Tomoshenko Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Each year the Birmingham IPMS hold a competition for models that fit within the area of a beer mat (technically a Carling Black Label beer mat) which for the generic sized mat designed to accommodate a traditional nonic imperial pint glass is 31/2 x 31/2 inches (88mm in new money). Due to my impeccable timing….not, I missed last year’s competition. However, this year I intend to field an entry. The rule of the competition is that it must fit within a beer mat, any subject or scale. Height is limited to a foot or so (Bill I’ve forgot what is it?), but depth is unlimited. So technically you could do an inverted scale model of a bathysphere exploring the depths of the Marianas Trench. I’m going for something nowhere near as imaginative. I bought this a while back with the intention of entering. I’ve got the Lanc out the way, and intend to start another substantive project in the near future, but want something small and quickish in between. This is my first foray into helicopter, well technically, auto/gyrocoptery – working myself up for the full plunge! There’s been a few builds of this kit on here, all quite tasty and in different schemes. Here is the proverbial box and kit contents. There isn’t much to it. The transparencies for the visors are printed on an acetate sheet. Detailing isn’t bad for such a small kit, but I will be adding some “improvements” (I’ve used quotes as a caveat in the event my attempt leads to a complete hash of things). The belts and harnesses are moulded to the seats, rectification of this is the first job, the engine may benefit from some extra detailing, and I’ll see what other bits n bobs I can add. I’ll also have to modify the rotor blades so they are in the folded back position. This will enable it to fit on the beer mat. Curiously I also like the Daddy Long Legs look this position gives it. All the schemes look attractive, especially the Swiss scheme, but I’ve chosen RAF K4230. There are a few restored versions knocking around museums in various schemes. Those in the silver livery are painted all over silver. However, I found this piccie where the engine cowling is polished aluminium. I quite like this look, similar to the scheme I did my Fury Hawker Fury RFI in so I’ve opted for this one. It’s not the same aircraft as the kit transfers, but very similar so it’s quite plausible that the K4230 looked something like this. I’ll do the cowling in bare metal foil so hopefully it will be quite eye catching and will complement my Fury when the sit beside each other in the display cabinet. Right then, first up is a coupled of poached eggs for breakfast and a mug of tea, then a start on the interior. 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Following, as I am absolutely intrigued by the notion of you modelling a 1:72 breakfast for the pilot even before the cockpit is done! 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdrianMF Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 I love the undercarriage! Do the instructions say “shake six seemingly similar sticks together until it looks like the picture”? Looking forward to this, although I’d do it wheels up if I were you! Regards, Adrian 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamden Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Interesting project mind if I sit by the bar and watch? Roger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted February 10, 2019 Author Share Posted February 10, 2019 Thanks all and glad to have you aboard. 8 hours ago, AdrianMF said: I love the undercarriage! Do the instructions say “shake six seemingly similar sticks together until it looks like the picture”? Looking forward to this, although I’d do it wheels up if I were you! Regards, Adrian Adrian as you can see the instructions are pretty basic and old school, so I’m sure it would be to your taste. The undercarriage will be a bit of a faff, I know some modelers have concocted a jig. It’s bridge to cross when I get there. On closer inspection the moulding is a bit dodgy, plenty of seams and rough edges, so everything will need cleaning up old school style. I’ve made a very small start and bust my cherry in that I’ve cut the first piece of plastic to coin a phrase. Here are the seats I mentioned above. The entry hatch is a sort of moulded roller shutter affair like you’d find on a bureau. The real hatch on the actual aircraft is retractable, but it does not look like this. Some library sources with the aircraft on the ground show it open. Anyroad I’ve decided to remove it and show it in the open / retracted position too to show more detail inside. I’ve also started sanding back and tidying up the seats. Oh well as they say a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step… 16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planebuilder62 Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 There was a build thread here on BM a while back that found out the V struts were too short and the whole undercarrige had to be scratch built. Good luck with this baby kit Regards Toby 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBaron Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 This should look most dashing in disco silver Tomo. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Gonna lurve this'n Go Tomo go I think our George imposed a twelve inch ceiling on the build but from my memory of Nigel's briefing I don't remember any stated limit Anyway, keep it tight I get an uncomfortable feeling I should get on with my non-beermat Aeroclub Skeeter, needs doing and looks like the General has forgotten his completely... 😆 But since chatting to John on Sunday I'm also getting Cranberry flavouring in my soup... Frog one waiting, mm mmm! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrik Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235010850-rs-models-172-avro-rota/ This may help you avoid some of my mistakes, and allow you to concentrate on your own. Watching with interest. Patrik 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spadgent Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 (edited) Ooh I picked this kit up at IanAllen the other day. Looks like you’re goi g to have fun. I’ll tag along if that’s ok. johnny. ps. I put it back down again btw. 😊 Edited February 11, 2019 by The Spadgent 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted February 11, 2019 Author Share Posted February 11, 2019 12 minutes ago, Patrik said: https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235010850-rs-models-172-avro-rota/ This may help you avoid some of my mistakes, and allow you to concentrate on your own. Watching with interest. Patrik Thanks Patrik I have come across this build, and a nice job you made of it too. I have bookmarked it and will use it as a reference thanks. 52 minutes ago, perdu said: Gonna lurve this'n Go Tomo go I think our George imposed a twelve inch ceiling on the build but from my memory of Nigel's briefing I don't remember any stated limit Anyway, keep it tight I get an uncomfortable feeling I should get on with my non-beermat Aeroclub Skeeter, needs doing and looks like the General has forgotten his completely... 😆 But since chatting to John on Sunday I'm also getting Cranberry flavouring in my soup... Frog one waiting, mm mmm! Cheers Bill. This un will be on terra firma, so within the rules. That said there is part of me that would like to do a ten foot + tall (deep / inverted) model of a bathysphere exploring the depths of the Marianas Trench just to see the expression on folks faces Nothing worth posting build wise this evening. I have finished off sanding back the seats and searching tinternet (including Patrik's build) for references for detailing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrik Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 PM sent Patrik 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted February 12, 2019 Author Share Posted February 12, 2019 Patrik very kindly PMd me some drawings which are very useful indeed. I’m beginning to take stock of what to add and what not (unable to add), finding my feet as it were. One thing which I did decided right from the offset was to do something about the rudder pedals. Here is the kit offering which is just a lumpy plastic ridge and looks awful. Bottom right (and just about left) is the real thing. And from the plans Patrik sent me (sorry for the small size). First up was to remove the ridge and scratch replacements from rod, wire, and folded take-away foil. Here is the result: Dry-fitted in place at the moment so a bit wonky. Perhaps a tad over scale but better than the blobby originals. More soon. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Yup Good 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastcat Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Hi Tomo, Watching with interest. One of these contraptions listed as a Cierva C30 was based at, what was then Elmdon Airport, now Birmingham International. It was there when I was a lad in the early '60s. I never saw it fly but it was stored in a hangar not far from the old airport building. You weren't supposed to go into the hangar but one night me and a couple of mates snuck in (it was usually left open) and had a good look at it and some of the other light aircraft there. On the way out we were met by a single airport police constable but seeing that we were peaceable and just interested in the planes, he just let us off with a warning that we weren't allowed in. Can't see that happening today somehow........................ I well remember the awkward look of it, with a big radial on the front and the stilty undercarriage also that it looked surprisingly big. It was silver doped and the registration was G-ACUU. I think the reg was in red and so were the undercarriage legs and pylon. It's now on display at Duxford. Brings back memories of school holidays, cycling to Elmdon from Aston and spending sunny afternoons in the viewing enclosure............those really were the days. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 I'm like you Dave, I used to ride over to Elmdon on my own scratch built bike from just round the corner to where Tom lives now I call it a scratch build acos the frame was found in the river Cole, handed in to Sparkhill cop shop then returned to me by them so I could build it into My Bike I never did get to wander round many of the buildings though, occasionally pottering about by the flying club hut Tom I found a half decent shot of a Cierva in Hendon on my phone, if its any use I'll send it to you Sunday do? 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonners Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Nice one, and I’m intrigued by the ‘Beer Mat Challenge’ - what a great idea! The box colour profiles seem to suggest a polished metal forward fuselage, so it seems entirely reasonable to do it that way (I would). Jon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spadgent Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Smashing pedals Tomo. 😎 nice work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomoshenko Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 On 2/13/2019 at 10:51 AM, Fastcat said: One of these contraptions listed as a Cierva C30 was based at, what was then Elmdon Airport, now Birmingham International. It was there when I was a lad in the early '60s. I never saw it fly but it was stored in a hangar not far from the old airport building. You weren't supposed to go into the hangar but one night me and a couple of mates snuck in (it was usually left open) and had a good look at it and some of the other light aircraft there. On the way out we were met by a single airport police constable but seeing that we were peaceable and just interested in the planes, he just let us off with a warning that we weren't allowed in. Can't see that happening today somehow........................ I'm sure you'd get your collar well and truly felt Dave and would probably be languishing in clink. Erm I don't suppose you can remember anything about the cockpit fittings....? On 2/13/2019 at 12:50 PM, perdu said: Tom I found a half decent shot of a Cierva in Hendon on my phone, if its any use I'll send it to you Sunday do? Every little helps Bill. On 2/13/2019 at 1:01 PM, Jonners said: Nice one, and I’m intrigued by the ‘Beer Mat Challenge’ - what a great idea! The box colour profiles seem to suggest a polished metal forward fuselage, so it seems entirely reasonable to do it that way (I would). Jon The beer mat challenge is a great idea because the subject matter is only limited by size, so no matter what your interest there is potential for everyone. It also draws on originality and imagination which can only be a good thing. Some itsy bitsy progress. I’m still finding my way a little and working out dimensions. I got the seats finished off and sanded smooth. They look ok in a silver finish to contrast with the red and green interior. I’m not planning on adding cushions, but even if I do, I’m sure home brew milliput ones will look better and have more definition. I’ll nock up some belts later from take-away tin foil. In most images I’ve seen they hang loose at the back of each seat as opposed to being draped over the seats as you can see above. I’ll see how to present them later. I added a little more detail which consisted of the brake and clutch levers, and the mount for the compass, and the compass itself: Not an awful lot will be seen especially with the seat in place, but you will see some of it and it all helps to busy things up a tad. If you look at the image of the cockpit above and the one below (with acknowledgments to hochmuth©2004) you can see the approximation I’m trying to represent: If you look at the throttle and mixture controls they are not particularly well represented in the kit, so I will scratch some improvements. Also there is a rectangular block which is absent in the shot above. What an earth is it? I pondered. I had another check of the plans Patrik sent me: It is a Very flare pistol and cartridge case. I had a snifter on the tinternet and discovered this from a museum website specializing in British Empire militaria – a flare case from an RAF bomber circa 1941. I think it’s reasonable to assume that the Rota may have carried something similar, hence the kit moulding. Not that I think the Avro Rota would have been an effective bomber given its …erm …rather limited payload, but another little addition to scratch build for more interest. Back in a bit. 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastcat Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Quote I'm sure you'd get your collar well and truly felt Dave and would probably be languishing in clink. Erm I don't suppose you can remember anything about the cockpit fittings....? Hi Tomo, Well, notwithstanding the fact that it was over 55 years ago and I can hardly remember my name from that far back, I only remember that the cockpit was a long way from terra firma and you'd have to use the foot rests or a ladder to look in. Carrying a ladder was a bit of a problem on my push-bike and might have been a bit tricky to explain to said constable. I also remember that it was a bit past it's sell-by date and pretty scruffy - for some reason I felt a kind of kinship........................................... Dave 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andwil Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 The pilot would want to be very careful firing a flare from a Very pistol from an aircraft with a rotor..... AW 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastcat Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) Hi Tomo, Not sure if you've seen this:Link or this:Anuvver Link or even this : Even more Links. Also have a look at Getty Images. Some nice period pics amongst all the dross! Dave Edited February 20, 2019 by Fastcat Not telling 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courageous Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, Fastcat said: Not sure if you've seen this:Link or this:Anuvver Link or even this : Even more Links. Go on @Tomoshenko, you know you want to... Stuart 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, Fastcat said: Hi Tomo, Not sure if you've seen this:Link or this:Anuvver Link or even this : Even more Links. Also have a look at Getty Images. Some nice period pics amongst all the dross! Dave Yes, I think you are right Tom When even your friends start taking the wee-wee you know friends just became mates don't you Lovely links Dave, very nice research (Wonder what Dave's researching these days...) 👏👏 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastcat Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) Well, apart from the usual stuff (like how to tie ones shoelaces and how to avoid falling out of bed too often), at the moment I'm researching the Jaguar XK120, Art Chester's Jeep, Red Wolverton's Ace motorbike and the Thomas Flyer (which most certainly didn't). Also had a look at the Bullitt Mustang car and various Mustang and Corsair racing aircraft. Plus, Dora Wings have a very nice Vega Gull and Proctor, the latter another type frequently seen at Elmdon. Nosing about's often as interesting as making a model .......................... Oh, almost forgot the Model T. Dave Edited February 20, 2019 by Fastcat 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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