US Navy Sea Blue(s)

[alt-92]

2 hours ago, PhantomBigStu said:

I not taking some effect into account I aren't

That grass looks unhealthy. 

[Casey]

I've made a comparison of paints vendors vs Monogram publication colors from the book @Troy Smith mentioned.

 

XF-17 is not the one.

 

XF-50 is somewhere around both Ana606 and Ana623.

 

Ana607 and Ana608 I could not find any good matches in the paints I've checked. For the full list of paints compared, see the post above.

 

Here is how the closest colors from those paints look like:

 

Target: ANA607 | Non-Specular Sea Blue 607 | GU 0.5, RGB: #32404B (L*=26.73, a=-3.73, b=-8.00)
    Closest color in: Humbrol (compared with 182 paints)
        DE00: 3.80 - #3E4A51 - Humbrol - AA0850 | No 77 | Navy Blue - Matt | GU 1.7 (L*=30.91, a=-3.60, b=-5.29)
      
    Closest color in: Revell (compared with 86 paints)
        DE00: 6.26 - #434E50 - Revell - 36169 | Granite grey | RAL 7026 | GU 1.6 (L*=32.43, a=-3.78, b=-2.48)
      
    Closest color in: Vallejo (compared with 123 paints)
        DE00: 4.26 - #3C4146 - Vallejo - 71.300 | Glossy Sea Blue | Azul Mar Brillante | FS15042 | ANA623 | GU 24.6 (L*=27.46, a=-1.56, b=-3.49)
      
    Closest color in: Tamiya (compared with 40 paints)
        DE00: 6.39 - #3E4042 - Tamiya - XF-17 | Sea Blue | GU 4.6 (L*=26.90, a=-0.31, b=-1.83)
      

 

Target: ANA608 | Intermediate Blue 608 | GU 0.8, RGB: #657784 (L*=49.34, a=-4.40, b=-9.09)
    Closest color in: Humbrol (compared with 182 paints)
        DE00: 3.74 - #5B6F79 - Humbrol - AB0230 | No 230 | Pru Blue - Matt | GU 1.3 (L*=46.03, a=-5.55, b=-7.54)
      
    Closest color in: Revell (compared with 86 paints)
        DE00: 4.80 - #646F75 - Revell - 36179 | Greyish blue | RAL 7031 | GU 1.9 (L*=46.29, a=-2.90, b=-4.43)
      
    Closest color in: Vallejo (compared with 123 paints)
        DE00: 3.84 - #5D6D7C - Vallejo - 71.299 | Intermediate Blue | Azul Intermedio | FS35164 | ANA608 | GU 2.5 (L*=45.65, a=-3.36, b=-9.50)
      
    Closest color in: Hataka (compared with 10 paints)
        DE00: 4.06 - #6F7A80 - Hataka - HTK-A032 | Ocean Grey | GU 13.3 (L*=50.63, a=-2.75, b=-4.38)
      
    Closest color in: Tamiya (compared with 40 paints)
        DE00: 5.43 - #74797F - Tamiya - XF-53 | Neutral Grey | GU 6.6 (L*=50.86, a=-1.35, b=-3.75)
      

 

[PhantomBigStu]

On 3/1/2023 at 1:56 PM, PhantomBigStu said:

, I not taking some effect into account aren't I

 

I hate paint

 

Did some research and yep grey paints morph towards the blue spectrum a lot...and as I've been flummoxed by stock issues decided to just call it a day, use the Mission models for FS15042 and if I attempt a tricolour aircraft AN607 alongside my Ak Insignia blue for 606.......probably will still pick up the Mig ammo sea blue next time I venture to my local for a kit

 

EDIT: heres the mission models (centre outer wing) alongside the xtracrylix in sunlight, which suddenly looks less purple, I hate paint 

Edited March 2, 2023 by PhantomBigStu

[PhantomBigStu]

As a follow up I've now acquired  one of Ak's Deep Sea Blue, which is meant to be their take on ANA623/FS35042 though they bizarrely call it FS35045. Very similar to Vallejo 898, basically less greener more bluer version. Which is interesting as its Ak's Dark Sea Blue (which their digital swaths say is darker) which is meant to be the equivalent to 898…..

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by PhantomBigStu

[Denford]

Not sure if this the right place but ANA623/FS35045 faded rapidly and noticeably.

Any ideas how to render this...?  Presumably more noticeably on upper surfaces than lower.

[alt-92]

On 3/11/2023 at 9:23 PM, Denford said:

Not sure if this the right place but ANA623 [snip] faded rapidly and noticeably.

Any ideas how to render this...? 

 

Very thin layer of flat coat & beige (Tamiya Buff for instance) on exposed surfaces, and that means the underside of the wings as well.

Wings folded on deck, and all that...

From Asisbiz

[Troy Smith]

On 11/03/2023 at 20:23, Denford said:

Not sure if this the right place but ANA623/FS35045 faded rapidly and noticeably.

the 1944 ANA623 was found to fade.   

This was replaced in 1947 by a new ANA 623 that was eventually incorporated into the FS 595 as FS 15042

in FS 595 the first digit reflect finish, 1= gloss, 2 = satin, 3 = matt. 

1947 ANA 623/FS15042 is a different color to 1944 ANA623

 

For a wartime USN plane in ANA623,  given how short the service lives were,  it's not really an issue...  it maybe if you wanted to do a post war USN plane in 1946/47 though....  as seen on the image posted by @alt-92 above

 

FWIW looking at FS 595 deck FS35045 is a dark blue, I'd need daylight to say more.   FS35044 is apparently Insignia Blue.

 

Wartime ANA623  from the chip in the Elliot USN/USMC Monogram guide,  was described by Jamie at Colourcoats as a "deep smoky blue"  and that is very good,  it's lot greyer and warmer than you might imagine.

 

This wartime color shot shows the warm purple blue aspect of 1944 ANA 623 well. 

 

 

I spent time peering at the color, and to really see the color you need bright daylight,  I also noted that @Mike Starmer  matched wartime ANA 623 using a mix of Humbrol 77 Sea blue 4 parts with 1 part H68 Purple.

I found a very close visual match with some old Tamiya 23ml jars  of 1 part XF-17 Sea Blue to 1 part X-16 Purple.

Note, a recent 10ml jar of XF-17 was a very different color to the 23ml jar though.

 

It may have faded to a lighter greenier blue, as seen on that Corsair image, and seen on the colour pics of KD431 at Yeovilton, which is is wartime ANA 623, but I have not seen very many images of KD431 in daylight, and the idea that USN Gloss Sea Blue is a dark green blue is deeply ingrained,   as that is a good description of the post 1947 color, so the colour reproduction may have been tweaked to look like that.

 

This took some refinding  F4U-4 of VBF-86 on US Wasp summer 1945.   Look at the folded wings in the sunlight.  It's a bit washed out. 

 

2 hours ago, alt-92 said:

From Asisbiz

These are very faded F4U-4 Corsair  in 1946

 

Taken in the Mediterranean when the US Navy was being run down, and does show the problem with wartime 1944 ANA623 fading, which was a problem for a peacetime navy where aircraft generally had longer service lives.

 

@Denford  I'd suggest ignoring the fading problem unless you happen to be doing a post war run down era plane.

 

HTH

 

 

 

 

[alt-92]

1 hour ago, Troy Smith said:

These are very faded F4U-4 Corsair  in 1946

 

Yep, but the important part is they are WW2 ANA623 GSB and heavily faded & weathered, and therefore make a good example of what Denford was asking for  

[Graham Boak]

If you look at the water and the deck, there does seem to be a green tinge to the Wasp photo, which must cast some doubt on the colour reproduction of the aircaft.

[Claudio Moura]

On 23/01/2019 at 19:34, sroubos said:

Eu tentei um pouco mais de azul escuro e acabei decidindo pelo Hataka afinal ... é uma coisa estranha, diluí com álcool isopropílico que funcionou bem no começo, mas começou a entupir no final, então tive que limpe meu H&S e encha-o novamente. Vou precisar fazer alguns polimentos, mas postarei algumas fotos de comparação neste fim de semana. Acho que saiu muito bem.

  

  I'm also having dilution problems with HATAKA, having to disassemble my entire airbrush DURING painting, since the paint dries on the tip and has the same return by the needle, reaching the trigger!!! I will no longer use this ink!

   Best whishes for all,
   Claudio

[dragonlanceHR]

1 hour ago, Claudio Moura said:

  

  I'm also having dilution problems with HATAKA, having to disassemble my entire airbrush DURING painting, since the paint dries on the tip and has the same return by the needle, reaching the trigger!!! I will no longer use this ink!

   Best whishes for all,
   Claudio

Which Hataka line? Orange, Red or Blue line?

[Claudio Moura]

13 hours ago, dragonlanceHR said:

Which Hataka line? Orange, Red or Blue line?

  Dear, 

 

Red Line. 

[Denford]

At this late stage I'll add comments on an NZ modelling website (which I now can't find) !  This was that PRU Blue was 'a good match' for faded ANA 623.  Certainly easier to match!

[noelh]

1 hour ago, Denford said:

At this late stage I'll add comments on an NZ modelling website (which I now can't find) !  This was that PRU Blue was 'a good match' for faded ANA 623.  Certainly easier to match!

Interesting!

[LDSModeller]

1 hour ago, Denford said:

At this late stage I'll add comments on an NZ modelling website (which I now can't find) !  This was that PRU Blue was 'a good match' for faded ANA 623.  Certainly easier to match!

 

Might you be referring to Pete Mossong's site? - Though he refers PRU Blue to a version of

NZ Sea Blue Grey (Manufactured in Australia/NZ) - NZ Sea Blue Grey is not even any match

for US GSB/Non Specular Sea Blue/Semi Specular Sea Blue.

 

Pete Mossong's site - Paint

 

Regards

 

Alan

[warhawk]

An interesting shot by Dan Friedkin.

Look at the nose of the machine in front.

 

source: Corsairs On Screen

 

Could this be the difference between wartime-, and postwar-GSB?

 

 

[Troy Smith]

48 minutes ago, warhawk said:

Could this be the difference between wartime-, and postwar-GSB?

Since no red bars on the stars, I'd say no.   What it does show is fresh and faded  1944 ANA 623 Gloss Sea Blue 

 

It a very interesting image, as the front plane is a F4U-4,  the 2nd looks to have light undersides, and just white bars on the fuselage star, as well as a carrier group marking, and a replacement cowl in fresh GSB.

The 3rd looks brand new, note the 2nd plane cowl is the same color.

The 4th has DF loop fitted?

 

Is this a Vought factory test flight?

 

I'll @Dana Bell  @Tailspin Turtle

 

[warhawk]

1 hour ago, Troy Smith said:

Is this a Vought factory test flight?

 

I have doubts, since three planes in the background are three-bladed -1Ds, and paint looks newer than on the -4 in the front.

Maybe this is a still from an immediate-post-war movie shoot? They are mentioned in the article I linked.

Edited July 11, 2023 by warhawk

[Tailspin Turtle]

1 hour ago, Troy Smith said:

Since no red bars on the stars, I'd say no.   What it does show is fresh and faded  1944 ANA 623 Gloss Sea Blue 

 

It a very interesting image, as the front plane is a F4U-4,  the 2nd looks to have light undersides, and just white bars on the fuselage star, as well as a carrier group marking, and a replacement cowl in fresh GSB.

The 3rd looks brand new, note the 2nd plane cowl is the same color.

The 4th has DF loop fitted?

 

Is this a Vought factory test flight?

 

I'll @Dana Bell  @Tailspin Turtle

 

That's a 1970's picture of some of the Corsairs used in the TV series, Bah Bah Black Sheep.