Brandy Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 (edited) Hi all!, While waiting for supplies for the Fairey Battle build, I've decided to go ahead and restore the Pfalz E.IV that was damaged when I relocated. To make it more interesting I will also build the AZ Models E.I alongside it. This is the reason for the restoration/repair Surprisingly it came apart (even more) very easily and it wasn't long before I had this The elevators have been reconnected with brass rod, and the odd curve that I had toward the rear of the wing undersides has been removed and the trailing edges sharpened up. It's all been sanded down and is about ready for the first coat of paint. I've sourced replacement crosses but will lose the (very small) airframe numbers behind the cockpit and at the top of the rudder. I don't think that will be a major problem. As for the E.I, here's what we have The plastic is very soft and there's a fair amount of work to do cleaning up mould lines, but otherwise not too bad. The PE is for an E.IV but I should be able to use some of it, we'll see! The first thing I noticed was that the wings are too long, but that appears to be because the same moulds are used for the M-S Type H and G, the latter of which has the longer wing. The instructions tell you to remove the inner end of the wings at the first rib mark to correct the length. This I duly did, then realised that the outer ends are the wrong shape and need correcting. This would have been far easier to do if I'd known before hand - instead of removing the inner rib, just reshape the outer tip! i tried reattaching the removed part to the outer edge, but that is not going to work. The wings are also way too thick and also too deep chord wise, needing a couple of mm removed from the trailing edge. The result of all this is that I will be scratchbuilding the wings, and also new tail surfaces as the kit ones are too thick. Nothing unusual there, it's pretty standard with any WWI kit! Oh well, here we go, Thanks for looking in! Ian Edited January 15, 2019 by limeypilot 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Ooh this brings back memories. This kit is literally the same kit I made, the Morane-Saulnier type G, albeit with a different set of instructions. Historically, the MS type G was made under licence by Pfalz prior to ww1, hence the identical look of the Pfalz E1 to the MS-G Anyway enough with the history lesson, following this with great interest Edited to apologise for failing to spot that you'd already said most of what I'd written, duh! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrzeM Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Damn! Exactly the same happened to my Fokker E.IV (old ICM kit). Good luck! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 Thanks guys! Just a small update tonight, fuselages! The E.IV was corrected according to plans when I built it, but when I used the measurements of the original instead of the 3 views, it showed the fuselage was 3mm too short! It has been corrected with a piece of 1mm x 3mm strip, attached to the tail end, and blended in with putty. The E.I however, proved to be too long! It was therefore trimmed to a little closer to the correct length, it will be finally corrected once it's all together. It also proved to be too narrow at the front end by 1mm, so .5mm strips were added to each side. I will cut the fuselage at the rear of the front section and sand down the additions to get a progressive narrowing of the fuselage. That's all for tonight folks, Thanks for looking in! Ian 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Excellent, I shall now watch the story unfold of how I should have done mine! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courageous Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Great to see you back on these aircraft. The scratch wings sound interesting. Stuart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted January 18, 2019 Author Share Posted January 18, 2019 (edited) On 1/16/2019 at 11:21 PM, clive_t said: Excellent, I shall now watch the story unfold of how I should have done mine! I'm not promising anything Clive! On 1/17/2019 at 2:59 AM, Courageous said: Great to see you back on these aircraft. The scratch wings sound interesting. Stuart Thanks Stuart, wings to come later. Meanwhile.. following on from adding the strip to the fuselage halves, I cut them just behind the fuel tank and sanded them down to give a taper to the halves. Since I had the PE I then started to work on the interior. The "detail" inside he fuselage was removed with a 3mm micro chisel - I'm really starting to love that little tool, it's so useful! At first it looked as though the PE wouldn't fit, then I thought it would, so spent some time trying to make it do so. Scraping out the fuselage halves, carefully folding the PE, until one slip led to a bit of a tangle. OK, maybe more than just "a bit" I managed to salvage the front end, which is all I really need, so continued with the folding. It wouldn't fit. More scraping out of the fuselage. Then I realised I'd folded it the wrong way! DOH! I reversed the folding without breaking it, but it still wouldn't fit! Trimmed some more...then I had to accept that my first inclination had been correct - it was NOT going to fit. Not really surprising as it hadn't been designed for this kit. It did, however, provide a useful guide for some plastic strip. A little more plastic strip and some 10 thou for a false floor to hide the joint, and I now have this. All taped together and it looks as though the shape is now ok so, on with the interior detailing! As for the E.IV, I added a little PPP to the tail adjustments and tidied it up. This will probably wait now until I get to painting them both. Thanks for looking in! Ian Edited January 18, 2019 by limeypilot 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, limeypilot said: I'm not promising anything Clive! ... At first it looked as though the PE wouldn't fit, then I thought it would, so spent some time trying to make it do so. Scraping out the fuselage halves, carefully folding the PE, until one slip led to a bit of a tangle. OK, maybe more than just "a bit" Looks like you've taken to modelling a crashed zeppelin! I have every faith in you sir, your work on the Fairey Battle is promise enough! 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courageous Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 A bit of a fight with that PE Ian, when it says no, it means NO. But every cloud...and we have cockpit framing. Stuart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamden Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Shame about the damage to your EIV Looks as though you've got the repairs well in hand, looking forward to watching this and the E I come together Roger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Only just found this Ian, so have had to catch up. What a disaster with the E IV, but out of the ashes a better model will rise in due course. And of course we can all enjoy following one of you threads describing how to correct and superdetail a kit! P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted January 24, 2019 Author Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) On 1/18/2019 at 11:08 PM, clive_t said: Looks like you've taken to modelling a crashed zeppelin! I have every faith in you sir, your work on the Fairey Battle is promise enough! I did think about a crashed E.I, I must admit! However that was long after I'd stopped swearing at myself for being so clumsy. On 1/18/2019 at 11:26 PM, Courageous said: A bit of a fight with that PE Ian, when it says no, it means NO. But every cloud...and we have cockpit framing. Stuart It does indeed Stuart, and I gave up fighting it at that point! On 1/19/2019 at 1:33 AM, Hamden said: Shame about the damage to your EIV Looks as though you've got the repairs well in hand, looking forward to watching this and the E I come together Roger Thanks Roger. The damage is not too bad, the main reason for the stripdown is simply the fact that this was one of my first builds and it wasn't up to my current standards so the damage gave me a good excuse! As Stuart said, every cloud has a silver lining! On 1/19/2019 at 11:44 PM, pheonix said: Only just found this Ian, so have had to catch up. What a disaster with the E IV, but out of the ashes a better model will rise in due course. And of course we can all enjoy following one of you threads describing how to correct and superdetail a kit! P Thanks P! it was a disaster, but as I said above, it is really just an excuse to do what needed to be done! Not really much to add as progress has been slow, but sure. One of the first things I noticed was that the fuselage was narrower at the top for some reason! I added a thin strip of 10 thou card to correct that. After that it was just a case of deciding which bits of PE would work and which wouldn't. The seat was OK, but the framework and the rest of the interior wasn't up to it, far too 2-dimensional. I used 10 thou card to replace the rear cockpit partition, and added a couple of pieces of 16 thou brass rod for the seat frame. I have no idea if this is correct or not, but the one pic I do have of the interior framework seems to show that the PE is definitely not right. The controls are 10 thou brass rod, with the PE used for the hand grip. It's a little too 2-dimensional but better than nothing! It was then all stuck on sticks for a coat of primer, although that pic seems to have been eaten by my camera. It is now all white, and ready for a little detail painting. Ian Edited January 24, 2019 by limeypilot 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Hungry cameras are a real problem sometimes aren't they? I do like the interior details that you are adding - simple for sure but the it was in these early machines - which is one reason why I like them! This is clearly up to you usual very high standard and I am looking forward to seeing more. P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courageous Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I'd have words with that greedy camera... Back to the build, cockpit is simple but sweet. Stuart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massimo Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 The first picture is really sad... Such a beautiful kit!!!! It'll be interesting to se the parallel build! I'll be watching! ...anyway...I HATE PEs!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted February 10, 2019 Author Share Posted February 10, 2019 (edited) On 1/25/2019 at 11:43 PM, pheonix said: Hungry cameras are a real problem sometimes aren't they? I do like the interior details that you are adding - simple for sure but the it was in these early machines - which is one reason why I like them! This is clearly up to you usual very high standard and I am looking forward to seeing more. P Thanks P! I can't disagree with the "simple" bit, it certainly is that! On 1/26/2019 at 1:52 AM, Courageous said: I'd have words with that greedy camera... Back to the build, cockpit is simple but sweet. Stuart Words have been had, and it appears to be behaving....so far! On 1/26/2019 at 2:13 AM, Massimo said: The first picture is really sad... Such a beautiful kit!!!! It'll be interesting to se the parallel build! I'll be watching! ...anyway...I HATE PEs!!! It was not the worst as far as damage goes, I still have to attempt to rebuild the Short 184 which may not be repairable..... Anyway folks, after 8 days straight of work, I finally had a day off today. I'd been doing little bits and pieces in the meantime, so the interior was pretty much ready to go together today. During the last week I had painted all the woodwork and controls. My usual for the wood: base coat of radome tan, thinned leather on top, then clear orange. All acrylics. I have also done a little tidying up on the cowling and cheek fairings. Some flash on the cowling needed to be taken care of, plus sharpening up the corners. The cheek fairings were thinned and the rear edge cleaned up to give a smooth curve instead of the step as moulded. This pic shows how much they were thinned and this one shows the step at the rear edge, compared to the smoothed out version I also took a look at the kit engines. There's a little detail here that is slightly worrying. There are 2 engines in the kit. The instructions show only the 9 cylinder one as that is what they would have you use. However, the E.I was powered by the other one - the 7 cylinder Oberursel U.0! I'm not quite sure what they were thinking there, but needless to say I'll be using the 7 cylinder, with improvements! That is all I have managed to do over the last couple of weeks, so the plan for today was to get the fuselage put together and make new wings. Hopefully all before the rugby tonight! So, first job, glue the forward fuselage halves together. Easy enough after I carefully filed down the end of the rear seat mounting, which fouled the framework on the other half. The rear half was then attached. Something is not quite right. The sides should be straight but for some reason one side has a slight curve so that will be taken of once it's properly dry. On comparing the side profile to the drawings it also appears that I will need to add a little more under the nose, and if I use the kit part on top it will be too deep from top to bottom, so I may just use 10thou card for that piece. I'll look into it in more detail when it's dry. Then on to the wings. I used 40 thou card for those. Copies of the plan wings were cut out and drawn around, then removed from the sheet using the standard "score and break" method, the same as for vac kits. Once cut out, they were clamped together and sanded to shape. I clamp them together simply to make sure they are the same. A slight difference from the plans won't be noticed, but if they are different each side it will be obvious! Once the shape was finalised, I made sure the edges were square so they will be square when mounted! Nothing worse than having a swept wing aircraft when you don't want one! The wings have quite a noticeable curve to them at the forward edge so I boiled some water and held the leading edges in it to soften the plastic a little so that I could bend them and get the correct aerofoil shape. Using a knife handle I pressed the leading edge down against my modelling mat to get a curve on the front edge. That left me with two very thick wings that then needed sanding to get nice sharp trailing edges, and remove the square edges at the tips and along the leading edges. 30 minutes or so of sanding and I had a decent pair of wings that are ready for final details! All in all a little under 2 hours from marking the sheet to finished wings. I'm happy with them, and I'm not sure yet whether I will add more detail, or just let the painting take care of the ribs. I will be using 0.3mm masking tape for the black rib tapes - the tape I have just happens to be black so it's perfect! So there we are! All done in time to see England annihilate France too, a good day! Thanks for looking in! Ian Edited February 10, 2019 by limeypilot 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clive_t Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Great work Ian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTiger66 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Very nice work on the wings there Ian. I always like to see broken kits being brought back from the brink. For some time I’ve been wondering how a ‘broken kit’ Group Build could work. I think it may already have been done; I must check. I have the AZ M-S version of this kit Ian; I haven’t built it because, if my memory serves me correctly; 1: The wing ribs don’t quite match up to some plans I had 2: As you have described; the trailing edge thickness and chord aren’t quite right. 3: I was terrified of scratch building my own wings 😱🤣👍. I think that you have helped me develop a spine here Ian: a scratching I will try for the wings when I try to build the model. Thank you for showing a great way to do it 👍 Best regards TonyT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 That is looking very good Ian. Making wings really is not very difficult once some simple techniques have been mastered as you hav eso aly demonstrated. Indeed it was not being sure about how to make wings that stopped me from attempting scratch builds: now I know how to I only scratch build! P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 A great tip for getting the undercamber on those wings, you have just made some more whacky projects possible for me! Martian 👽 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted February 11, 2019 Author Share Posted February 11, 2019 14 hours ago, clive_t said: Great work Ian Many thanks Clive! 14 hours ago, TonyTiger66 said: Very nice work on the wings there Ian. I always like to see broken kits being brought back from the brink. For some time I’ve been wondering how a ‘broken kit’ Group Build could work. I think it may already have been done; I must check. I have the AZ M-S version of this kit Ian; I haven’t built it because, if my memory serves me correctly; 1: The wing ribs don’t quite match up to some plans I had 2: As you have described; the trailing edge thickness and chord aren’t quite right. 3: I was terrified of scratch building my own wings 😱🤣👍. I think that you have helped me develop a spine here Ian: a scratching I will try for the wings when I try to build the model. Thank you for showing a great way to do it 👍 Best regards TonyT Hi Tony, great to see you back here! If you really want to see "broken kits" take a look at my Ilya Muromets and Fairey Battle builds. Those two really should be binned from the outset, but it is great fun correcting them though! Looking forward to seeing the M-S some time soon and I'm glad you found my methods useful. I hope you are doing well down under! 13 hours ago, pheonix said: That is looking very good Ian. Making wings really is not very difficult once some simple techniques have been mastered as you hav eso aly demonstrated. Indeed it was not being sure about how to make wings that stopped me from attempting scratch builds: now I know how to I only scratch build! P Very true, and I always try to find the simplest way of doing things. 12 hours ago, Martian Hale said: A great tip for getting the undercamber on those wings, you have just made some more whacky projects possible for me! Martian 👽 Why am I not surprised to see the word "wacky" in something written by you? Glad to be of service! Ian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 2 hours ago, limeypilot said: Why am I not surprised to see the word "wacky" in something written by you? Me? With my reputation? Shocked of Mars 👽 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marklo Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 (edited) Some lovely work going on. Quote I always like to see broken kits being brought back from the brink If you like that then you'll love this. My first 1/48 scratchbuild which will be brought back from lifesupport. Edited February 11, 2019 by Marklo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted February 15, 2019 Author Share Posted February 15, 2019 (edited) Morning all! A few more days of slow progress with bits here and there, then I had another full afternoon at these yesterday. Before I finalised the fuselage I needed to sort out the front end. The kit part for the upper nose was never going to fit. I tried sanding down the underneath to get it to sit flush but it wasn't having any of it, and besides, it was still far too high, and didn't match the curve of the cowling anyway! So out with the .020" sheet and a piece was shaped and bent to as close as I could get it to match the cowling. I sanded the front edge of the cockpit by wrapping a piece of sandpaper around a knife handle. This was then glued to the upper front fuselage and clamped to ensure it retained its curve. It's still a fraction too high, and will need a tiny waft of filler once the cowling is on, but it's far better than the kit part. The next job was to finish the fuselage. That meant filling and sanding (again!) and drilling holes for the brass rod that will secure the wings. I managed to break two drill bits while drilling the wings so I will have to order more. No telling how long they will take to get here! You can see on this shot just how far off the kit wing mounting points are. Also the holes I've drilled are for .020" rod which JUST fits the edges of the new wings. The filled dimples show how thick the kit wings are! That's not bad even if I do say so myself! I didn't pin the E.IV wings when I built it which is probably why they came off so easily, so that too has been done. I thought I'd take a look at the tail feathers too while I was in the mood. They didn't look too healthy, which was not really a surprise! So out with the 20thou sheet again and the black marker. The elevators were clamped together as usual to make sure they are the same! A little sanding, et voila! New tail feathers! Much betterer! That's how they sat at close of play yesterday, I hope to make more progress this weekend. Thanks for looking in! Ian Edited February 18, 2019 by limeypilot 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 A Trigger’s Broom restoration, where we eventually end up with no original parts at all! Lovely jubbly. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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