general melchett Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Dave, the mid-seventies variant Geoff mentioned was the upgraded S.2D, this initial release only covers the basic S.2, (well actually an S.2C). The main differences between the C and D being that the latter was Martel capable, (with consequent removal of a VG from each upper wing above the outer pylon attachment points) along with an upgraded FIN1063 (Ferranti Inertial Navigation) system, Blue Parrot radar and ECM upgrades. Visually, the only notable differences were the larger trapezoid mid-fuselage blade aerial and slightly modified rear tailplane RWR fairing ('bullet'). It would be pretty straightforward turning a C into a D to be honest. If you want your D carrying Martels then PJ productions released a nice, though pricey Martel/pylon combo, I'm fairly certain someone will offer them at some point and maybe include the blade aerial/tailcone, (Hi Colin, are you out there?) Other than that maybe wait for an S.2B and combine the two kits...or as Geoff suggests, rob an earlier kit. Talking of aftermarket I see ResKit have released some rather tasty wheel sets and 2in rocket pods for the Bucc. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Thanks for the detailed description Andy. Might be best to just build this version OOB and enjoy the commentary from all the Bucc experts like we did when Airfix’s FG.1 Phantom was released. It’ll be hard to see myself stopping at one kit, so hopefully the initial production run will be a large one. Cheers and thanks.. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 2 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said: Thanks for the detailed description Andy. Might be best to just build this version OOB and enjoy the commentary from all the Bucc experts like we did when Airfix’s FG.1 Phantom was released. It’ll be hard to see myself stopping at one kit, so hopefully the initial production run will be a large one. Cheers and thanks.. Dave Thankfully they gave the Buccaneer design to the lead designer to do a good job on it unlike the Phantom which they passed to a nugget who dropped some clangers that have not been rectified, pretty poor show for what was a flagship kit for that year !! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general melchett Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Pleasure Dave, aside from a few niggles it's a sound kit and certainly offers good value for money at the moment.....like you and, I suspect many others, I'll be getting a few more, which in turn reminds me, I really must finish my 1/24th Bucc, Quote Thankfully they gave the Buccaneer design to the lead designer True Geoff...thankfully. OK shameless plug here, but while I was building this and by way of inspiration, (as if I needed any!) I was offered another ride in the back seat of one of TBAGs Bucc S.2s, (this time XX894, finished in FAA colours)...perfect timing and a lot of fun. In the other aircraft was a former FAA observer who flew in both S.1 and S.2 Buccs in the late sixties/early seventies. He also rode around in Sea Vixens, Gannets and Skyraiders, a true gentleman. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickoshea52 Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 5 hours ago, general melchett said: The main differences between the C and D being that the latter was Martel capable, (with consequent removal of a VG from each upper wing above the outer pylon attachment points)...Visually, the only notable differences were the larger trapezoid mid-fuselage blade aerial and slightly modified rear tailplane RWR fairing ('bullet'). Sounds simple to modify, even for a ham fisted Rigger like me. It looks like I’ll be purchasing a few of those nice decal sheets from Hannants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichG Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 (edited) 12 hours ago, Geoff_B said: Actually you need to remember that this is the original Buccaneer S2, so its probably wisest to wait to see what exactly Airfix have lined up for an RAF boxing to determine what mods have been applied to their 2nd boxing, as the sprue breakdown obviously indicates a very different set up to the RN kit Well inclusion of old-style S.1 wingtips on the clear sprue, clearly illustrated in Andy's article, gives a strong clue to a future Operation Granby version. As far as I know these wingtips were only retro-fitted to the 12 aircraft sent to Muharraq, Bahrain in Jan 1991. It's great detail to get right and so I would hope (expect...) Airfix will include relevant markings & stores for these aircraft. And which in fact were included in the previous Airfix 1/72 Bucc... Rich. Edited September 7, 2019 by RichG 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisov Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Hopefully not too far off topic but as of today no sight of Airfix Model World up here in Elgin. Hope they do eventually make it this far north especially as Lossiemouth was their last home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadeocu Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) There are not many changes needed to make other marks than what is provided in this kit. You could do this S.2D with the pointy tailplane fairings by using a large blade antenna, the antennas on either side of the fin, and long chord Martel capable pylons. A VG will need to be removed too. There is a blade antenna and landing light ahead and behind the bomb bay (respectively) on this S.2D; on early S.2s,S.2As and S.2Cs the light was ahead of the bomb bay where you see the blade antenna on this S.2D. It looks like the kit provides separate panels to accommodate for this difference. You could do an early RAF (12, OCU, 15) Bucc without too much to change. These OCU Buccaneers have flat bomb bays and pointy tail planes but long chord pylons (circa 1973): These 208 S.2As have short chord pylons and bomb door tank. These would have had a full row of VGs, a wide blade antenna on the spine, fin antennas and had blount tail plane ECM fairings: And another one to show how mixed and matched it could be in the 70s. An OCU S.2A circa 1975 with short chord pylons, pointy tail plane fairings, antennas on either side of the fin, wide blade antenna on spine and light aft of the bomb bay with blade antenna in front. Incidentally, this is XV154 which is the same airframe that is featured on the kit decal sheet in 809 livery circa 1972: Any of these examples take just a few tweaks. Parts for most of these can be found in the older Airfix kit. It appears that they have all been provided for in this new kit’s design so I am sure later releases will provide the rest of these parts if they aren’t already included as extra parts. Something to note about all of these examples is that (I believe) none of these had the MDC in the canopy. It will be interesting to see how Airfix my provide for that. My suspicion is that they won’t or maybe they will provide a decal which won’t really be up to snuff - time will tell. There is also the issue of the headlight on the nose gear which is a feature on RAF airframes that you can see on XV154 above. In the meantime, I have some CMR kits that I can raid if Airfix take their time, but I suspect we see an RAF boxing next year. I am holding out hope for a dedicated maritime strike boxing with TV and AR Martels as well as Sea Eagles! -Jack Edited September 8, 2019 by wadeocu 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phone Phixer Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) The difference between the weapons pylon design for the S2C and S2D (and the RAF equivalent S2A/S2B) is very noticeable. The S2C pylons were shorter in length and larger in height than the Martel capable "universal" pylons. The reason for the removal of the VG was the outboard pylons were moved further outboard to give clearance between Martel wings when multiple missiles were loaded. S2C https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1102163 S2D https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/model/Blackburn Buccaneer S2D Jack beat me to it with the pictures. Obviously quicker on the search and typing front! Edited September 8, 2019 by Phone Phixer 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadeocu Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 On 9/4/2019 at 1:22 PM, Acinonyx Jubatus said: Just a note of caution, Airfix website now says expected Autumn rather than September, so may be a slight delay in arrival Curse you Chief Black Cloud!! ☺️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadeocu Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 19 hours ago, Geoff_B said: Us Fishheads are in the same boat to do a later model FAA 809 Buccaneer for mid to late 70s to go with the later 892 Phantoms on Ark. The kit 809 scheme is compatible with an 892 phantom. The phantom kit has a scheme that is from 1978 but I don’t think the 892 phantoms changed much in the 70s. Edited September 8, 2019 by wadeocu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 3 hours ago, wadeocu said: The kit 809 scheme is compatible with an 892 phantom. The phantom kit has a scheme that is from 1978 but I don’t think the 892 phantoms changed much in the 70s. RWR Fin top. Silver Jubilee Markings which changed to Sqdn special scheme in 78 and 809 Buccs adopted the tactical roundels and the revised squadron badge and switched to the Universal pylons so yes they would be wrong posed together OOB. Robbing the previous kit for decals, pylons etc would be a quick fix or doing the Phantom without RWR and the special markings and ensuring that the aircraft serials were correct for the sqdn at that time would allow for an early 892 model for an early 70s set up on Ark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickoshea52 Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 23 hours ago, Rickoshea52 said: Sounds simple to modify, even for a ham fisted Rigger like me. It looks like I’ll be purchasing a few of those nice decal sheets from Hannants. Two Xtradecal sheets and a pair of Air Graphics CBLS panniers purchased in anticipation of this kit hitting the streets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 The Universal pylons in the previous Airfix kit should be suitable for use on the new kit, although the Martel Rails are probably a bit crude in comparison. It will be interesting to see if the bulged tank from the old kit can be adapted to kit the new kit as. The aftermarket slipper tanks should fit as the kit ones look to be the earlier version as they are on the RN specific sprue, and Freightdog's later Tail may be suitable to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Incidentally, I've just cancelled my back-order for this. When I signed up, it would have cost 18 GBP (22GBP less VAT); now they're only 10+GBP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 15 minutes ago, dalea said: ... now they're only 10+GBP. Where did you see that? Any chance of a link?? Cheers.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Hmmm. Disappeared again. Maybe it was the current one. Sorry for the bad steer, folks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 5 minutes ago, dalea said: Sorry for the bad steer, folks All good, I’d better tell the kids their inheritance just got a little bit smaller! Cheers.. Dave 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatbox8 Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 On 9/7/2019 at 8:50 PM, RichG said: Well inclusion of old-style S.1 wingtips on the clear sprue, clearly illustrated in Andy's article, gives a strong clue to a future Operation Granby version. As far as I know these wingtips were only retro-fitted to the 12 aircraft sent to Muharraq, Bahrain in Jan 1991. It's great detail to get right and so I would hope (expect...) Airfix will include relevant markings & stores for these aircraft. And which in fact were included in the previous Airfix 1/72 Bucc... Rich. Does having the S.1 wing tips included suggest there may be an S.1 release in the future, I wonder. With the separate intakes and exhausts it might be on the cards. Having been studiously collecting parts to convert the old Airfix Buccaneer to an S.1 I wouldn't be at all surprised! The Brick does look good in that all-white, pale roundel scheme. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Meatbox8 said: Does having the S.1 wing tips included suggest there may be an S.1 release in the future, I wonder. With the separate intakes and exhausts it might be on the cards. Having been studiously collecting parts to convert the old Airfix Buccaneer to an S.1 I wouldn't be at all surprised! The Brick does look good in that all-white, pale roundel scheme. No, its just for the Gulf War fit, the fuselage sprues are configured for the Speys, and the intakes would need to be a separate part from the wing root fwd. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Regarding follow up boxings, I starting to wonder given the limited load in the RN S2C if we may see an S2D with Martel's for the late 70s/ early 80s RAF and RN, then probably a late RAF 80's/ early 90fit for LGBs with Gulf War and post war grey scheme. I'm wondering if they will do a SAAF version as a separate boxing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadeocu Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, Geoff_B said: Regarding follow up boxings, I starting to wonder given the limited load in the RN S2C if we may see an S2D with Martel's for the late 70s/ early 80s RAF and RN, then probably a late RAF 80's/ early 90fit for LGBs with Gulf War and post war grey scheme. I'm wondering if they will do a SAAF version as a separate boxing ? This is along the lines of what I was thinking. A Maritime Strike boxing with a 70s 12 squadron example, an 809 S.2D and a late 80s 208 example with Sea Eagle. Then a LGB equipped example with Gulf War schemes, an early 80s RAFG scheme and a 90s overall grey example. Then a stand alone SAAF boxing. That does leave in the cold a 60s S.2 with grey over white scheme. I surprised this did not appear in the current boxing; all the appropriate parts are provided. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatbox8 Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 1 hour ago, wadeocu said: This is along the lines of what I was thinking. A Maritime Strike boxing with a 70s 12 squadron example, an 809 S.2D and a late 80s 208 example with Sea Eagle. Then a LGB equipped example with Gulf War schemes, an early 80s RAFG scheme and a 90s overall grey example. Then a stand alone SAAF boxing. That does leave in the cold a 60s S.2 with grey over white scheme. I surprised this did not appear in the current boxing; all the appropriate parts are provided. The early grey over white scheme is definitely my favourite. If the parts are there I'll def be building one of 801's from Victorious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meatbox8 Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Geoff_B said: No, its just for the Gulf War fit, the fuselage sprues are configured for the Speys, and the intakes would need to be a separate part from the wing root fwd. Why did the Gulf War jobs have these fitted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadeocu Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 7 minutes ago, Meatbox8 said: Why did the Gulf War jobs have these fitted? It had something to do with wing loading and decreasing stress and airframe fatigue I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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