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Barracuda MkII, 822/1709 Squadron, Ceylon, 1945


russ c

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Hi All.

 Not giving away what I`m currently working on 🙂 but I`m trying to find out some info` on Barracuda`s with 1709 NAS whilst based in Ceylon.

Particularly whether they saw action or not and what the missions flown were. I`ve Googled a lot and trawled through what FAA/ Indian Ocean, BPF books I have but come up with nothing.

Also if the missions were just patrols, I presume the bomb racks would have been removed from under the wings, but what about the gubbin`s beween the U/C legs.

Did the bomb racks get removed from here too and was there a fairing for the `U` shaped recess which housed the torpedo/bomb release mechanism to cover it up. 

I`d be grateful for any info`

Cheers Russ

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Slight problem in that, from the usual sources (Ballance: Squadrons and Units of the FAA, McCandless: Barracuda From The Cockpit) I can't find any sign that 1709 Sq ever formed: the only squadrons in the early 17xx range have been 1700/1/2/3 (ASR squadrons with Walrus and Sea Otter) and 1710 which did not form until 2008 as a redesignation of FAA mobile repair units.

 

I don't know that the wing bomb racks would have been removed: if the Ceylon squadrons were working up for eventual combat deployment, wing racks were the ones most used for delivering ordnance.  If they were doing more basic stuff like navigation training, bombracks might have been removed to save weight.

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1 minute ago, Seahawk said:

Slight problem in that, from the usual sources (Ballance: Squadrons and Units of the FAA, McCandless: Barracuda From The Cockpit) I can't find any sign that 1709 Sq ever formed: the only squadrons in the early 17xx range have been 1700/1/2/3 (ASR squadrons with Walrus and Sea Otter) and 1710 which did not form until 2008 as a redesignation of FAA mobile repair units.

 

I don't know that the wing bomb racks would have been removed: if the Ceylon squadrons were working up for eventual combat deployment, wing racks were the ones most used for delivering ordnance.  If they were doing more basic stuff like navigation training, bombracks might have been removed to save weight.

Cheers Seahawk, Thanks for replying so quickly. Probably why I can`t find any info` on it 🙂. The profile that caught my eye was in the Warpaint book, captioned as 1700 Sq but when I looked this up, found that they never used Barracudas. So after searching on Google found the same scheme and aircraft on some decal sheets captioned 1709 Sq.

The aircraft I had in mind to do is BV780 `P` though I suppose this could be as fictional as the caption.

Thanks for looking.

Russ 

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The aircraft in Warpaint to which you refer, is listed in FAA Aircraft 1939-45 as belonging to 822 squadron as "P" in June 1944. It was built by Blackburn Aircraft sometime between June and Sept 1943. It ground looped and collapsed its undercarriage on 20/9/44 necessitating major repairs in Trincomalee. No other detail is given.

822 squadron was in India / Ceylon between April and October 1944. It was a spare Barracuda squadron for the fleet carriers. One detachment spent 9 days on Victorious in Sept 1944. Thereafter it returned to the UK without aircraft, as the Avenger began to replace the Barracuda on the fleet carriers.

 

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Looking at the profile in Warpaint, I see that the aircraft is listed as being with 1700 sqn in Nov/Dec 1945.

It was repairable in Sept 1944 and could have been returned to service by then. Although 1700 is not listed as using the Barracuda it was using a real mix of aircraft around this time (Swordfish, Avenger, Reliant, Seafire, Tiger Moth) in addition to its main equipment of Sea Otter and Walrus. So I suppose that it could have also added the odd Barracuda to its collection. There were plenty of them lying around in Southern India / Ceylon at that time that were surplus to requirements.

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3 minutes ago, EwenS said:

Looking at the profile in Warpaint, I see that the aircraft is listed as being with 1700 sqn in Nov/Dec 1945.

It was repairable in Sept 1944 and could have been returned to service by then. Although 1700 is not listed as using the Barracuda it was using a real mix of aircraft around this time (Swordfish, Avenger, Reliant, Seafire, Tiger Moth) in addition to its main equipment of Sea Otter and Walrus. So I suppose that it could have also added the odd Barracuda to its collection. There were plenty of them lying around in Southern India / Ceylon at that time that were surplus to requirements.

 

3 minutes ago, EwenS said:

Looking at the profile in Warpaint, I see that the aircraft is listed as being with 1700 sqn in Nov/Dec 1945.

It was repairable in Sept 1944 and could have been returned to service by then. Although 1700 is not listed as using the Barracuda it was using a real mix of aircraft around this time (Swordfish, Avenger, Reliant, Seafire, Tiger Moth) in addition to its main equipment of Sea Otter and Walrus. So I suppose that it could have also added the odd Barracuda to its collection. There were plenty of them lying around in Southern India / Ceylon at that time that were surplus to requirements.

 

20 minutes ago, EwenS said:

The aircraft in Warpaint to which you refer, is listed in FAA Aircraft 1939-45 as belonging to 822 squadron as "P" in June 1944. It was built by Blackburn Aircraft sometime between June and Sept 1943. It ground looped and collapsed its undercarriage on 20/9/44 necessitating major repairs in Trincomalee. No other detail is given.

822 squadron was in India / Ceylon between April and October 1944. It was a spare Barracuda squadron for the fleet carriers. One detachment spent 9 days on Victorious in Sept 1944. Thereafter it returned to the UK without aircraft, as the Avenger began to replace the Barracuda on the fleet carriers.

 

Thanks very much Ewan for that information. 

Something to go on.

Cheers Russ

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The Barracuda sqns on the Light Fleet Carriers used Ceylon as a last working up base under tropical conditions prior to heading for the BPF and before leaving for Australia they made their Barracuda`s lighter due to the heat  affecting performance,........ so the rear gunner and his guns (and seat?) were removed, as were the Yagi ASV antennae on the Mk.II`s. Under the belly the rack for the 2,000 AP Bomb would have been added if and when this weapon was being used and under the wings I would say that four racks were usually fitted,....... the standard bomb load for tropical conditions under the wings was 1,500lb,..... often consisting of 3 x 500lb bombs fitted asymmetrically.  For training around Ceylon, Light Stores Carriers with practice bombs were often carried under the standard bomb racks.

 

Good luck with the model and I look forward to seeing it,

 

Cheers

            Tony

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Other potential squadrons to consider are

824 reformed Katukurunda, Ceylon 2/7/45 with 12 aircraft, of which 10 were taken over from 812 in Vengeance. Discarded its aircraft to return home in Sept 1945 and re-equip wih Fireflies. eg Mark II MX723

733 a Fleet Requirements Unit that had a myriad of types including Barracudas between 9/44 & 4/45. eg mark II LS672/C8K

756 a Training Sqn giving various forms of refresher and deck landing training. MkIII 10-11/45 eg ME136

757 a Fighter Pool Sqn and OTU. It again used many types including Barracuda II between 12/45 & 1/46 eg MX806

 

The following link will give you a list of 812 aircraft from Vengeance. The other sqns on the Light Fleet Carriers were 827 (Colossus), 837 (Glory) and 814 (Vengeance) which all passed through Ceylon in June / July 1945 as noted by Tony.

http://www.hms-vengeance.co.uk/812airc.htm

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2 hours ago, tonyot said:

The Barracuda sqns on the Light Fleet Carriers used Ceylon as a last working up base under tropical conditions prior to heading for the BPF and before leaving for Australia they made their Barracuda`s lighter due to the heat  affecting performance,........ so the rear gunner and his guns (and seat?) were removed, as were the Yagi ASV antennae on the Mk.II`s. Under the belly the rack for the 2,000 AP Bomb would have been added if and when this weapon was being used and under the wings I would say that four racks were usually fitted,....... the standard bomb load for tropical conditions under the wings was 1,500lb,..... often consisting of 3 x 500lb bombs fitted asymmetrically.  For training around Ceylon, Light Stores Carriers with practice bombs were often carried under the standard bomb racks.

 

Good luck with the model and I look forward to seeing it,

 

Cheers

            Tony

Cheers Tony,

 Thanks for the info`

Russ  

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1 hour ago, EwenS said:

Other potential squadrons to consider are

824 reformed Katukurunda, Ceylon 2/7/45 with 12 aircraft, of which 10 were taken over from 812 in Vengeance. Discarded its aircraft to return home in Sept 1945 and re-equip wih Fireflies. eg Mark II MX723

733 a Fleet Requirements Unit that had a myriad of types including Barracudas between 9/44 & 4/45. eg mark II LS672/C8K

756 a Training Sqn giving various forms of refresher and deck landing training. MkIII 10-11/45 eg ME136

757 a Fighter Pool Sqn and OTU. It again used many types including Barracuda II between 12/45 & 1/46 eg MX806

 

The following link will give you a list of 812 aircraft from Vengeance. The other sqns on the Light Fleet Carriers were 827 (Colossus), 837 (Glory) and 814 (Vengeance) which all passed through Ceylon in June / July 1945 as noted by Tony.

http://www.hms-vengeance.co.uk/812airc.htm

Thanks again Ewan,

I`ll do some more Hunting,

Cheers Russ

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If anyone`s interested, I found this the other day,  whilst doing more searching: https://www.docdroid.net/fymKM8A/far-east-barracuda-aeroplane-february-2016.pdf

Answers most of my questions along with Ewan`s, Seahawk`s and Tony`s replies.

 

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