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What can I do here? Please help.


Air Hockey Propellers

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Hello everybody,

 

I'm working on this project and after the first coat of paint (nope I don't prime) I noticed surface details that I had to sand off and the paint has gone off in those places. What should I do? In the past I'd just do whatever, but I want this model to come out better than the last ones. 

 

 

 

KIMG0077.jpg

 

KIMG0078.jpg

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What type of filler are you using? It sounds like the filler and paints might not be compatible. 

 

The quick answer is.... use a primer coat.

 

This will make any blemishes left on the plastic very obvious and very easy to correct. It is a LOT more work to sand back a layer of paint, as opposed to a thin layer of primer. 

 

You can buy suitable primers in car-supply shops. This is usually a cheaper alternative to buying a very similar product with the word "modelling" printed on the label (I still reckon they are the same product, if you look closely enough). If you are using the primer on a cold day, stand the aerosol-can in a bucket of hot (not boiling) water for ten minutes before using. It will produce a much more even coverage once it's been heated up a little.   

 

If the primer goes on a bit thick for any reason, you can just sand it to the correct thickness once dry. When applying, keep the can moving at all times.

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Chris. 

Edited by spruecutter96
Adding some info.
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What would I do: apart from 100% agreeing with Chris....

-Remove all paint. Youc an use oven cleaner, carburettor cleaner, whatever you prefer (or is available there).

-Check the model for any blemish, scratch, etc....

-Sand the model with very fine grit wet-sanding paper. Start from 800, then 1200, 2000, etc....the finer the better.

-Clean all the model with alcohol, it will remove any trace of grease, dust, etc....

-Give a coat of primer. I always use Humbrol enamels as primers, light grey will be fine.

 

I've found Alclad micro filler black primer very useful.

On the other hand, Vallejo primers had given me lots of problems and funny evenings full of bad words....

 

-

Edited by Artie
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It stands to reason that if you sand the surface to remove imperfections you'll end up going through the paint layer and back down to plastic. If you'd used a primer then you would simply reapply primer in the affected areas. But with no primer and straight to paint you can't do that. I think your statement kind of contradicts yourself because you state that you, "want this model to come out better than the last ones" Well if that's the case why are you skipping the primer layer and going straight to top coat? That's not how you achieve a good finish by skipping steps in the painting process. You need to use a primer first...

Edited by Steve Noble
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On 12/11/2018 at 9:33 PM, spruecutter96 said:

What type of filler are you using? It sounds like the filler and paints might not be compatible. 

 

The quick answer is.... use a primer coat.

 

This will make any blemishes left on the plastic very obvious and very easy to correct. It is a LOT more work to sand back a layer of paint, as opposed to a thin layer of primer. 

 

You can buy suitable primers in car-supply shops. This is usually a cheaper alternative to buying a very similar product with the word "modelling" printed on the label (I still reckon they are the same product, if you look closely enough). If you are using the primer on a cold day, stand the aerosol-can in a bucket of hot (not boiling) water for ten minutes before using. It will produce a much more even coverage once it's been heated up a little.   

 

If the primer goes on a bit thick for any reason, you can just sand it to the correct thickness once dry. When applying, keep the can moving at all times.

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Chris. 

 No fillers here. And yes, I will use primer coats from now on. In fact, I've been advised to use it but I have finally learnt my lesson. I only brush paint but thanks for your insight on using spray cans. 

 

And these car primers, are they the flat rusty-red ones? I thought those were to prevent rust.

 

On 12/11/2018 at 9:56 PM, Artie said:

What would I do: apart from 100% agreeing with Chris....

-Remove all paint. Youc an use oven cleaner, carburettor cleaner, whatever you prefer (or is available there).

-Check the model for any blemish, scratch, etc....

-Sand the model with very fine grit wet-sanding paper. Start from 800, then 1200, 2000, etc....the finer the better.

-Clean all the model with alcohol, it will remove any trace of grease, dust, etc....

-Give a coat of primer. I always use Humbrol enamels as primers, light grey will be fine.

 

I've found Alclad micro filler black primer very useful.

On the other hand, Vallejo primers had given me lots of problems and funny evenings full of bad words....

 

-

I decided to compromise since there's a lot of surface area on that model and I removed the paint in the affected areas. BTW, it's the nose area that has all the bumps but the wing areas only had paint imperfections.

 

I will sand and sand and sand. Luckily for me, I'm fine having a model without panel lines, I say so because this one has raised panel lines. You see, after seeing real helicopters and planes, one notices that the panel lines are just that, lines. Often barely perceptible.

 

Finally, I will use Mr. Surfacer 500. I can't use enamel primers because I use lacquer acrylics. Lacquer doesn't go over enamel.

 

On 12/11/2018 at 9:57 PM, Steve Noble said:

It stands to reason that if you sand the surface to remove imperfections you'll end up going through the paint layer and back down to plastic. If you'd used a primer then you would simply reapply primer in the affected areas. But with no primer and straight to paint you can't do that. I think your statement kind of contradicts yourself because you state that you, "want this model to come out better than the last ones" Well if that's the case why are you skipping the primer layer and going straight to top coat? That's not how you achieve a good finish by skipping steps in the painting process. You need to use a primer first...

No I've finally come to accept that the primer is an essential part of the process. I will use it from now on.

 

 

KIMG0089.jpg

As you can see the seams between the right wing and the fuselage is exposed... for a healthy layer of primer.

 

KIMG0090.jpg

The flaps and ailerons didn't have any no-primer related problems but plain paint problems instead. And hopefully the border between the old paint and the new paint will be imperceptible enough once fixed.

 

I will also improve the canopy and fuselage seams.

 

Thank you for your advice and encouragement. As obvious as the answer may have been I finally made the change.

 

 

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Hi.

 

It's good to hear that you will be using primers from now on - they are well worth the extra effort involved. I've always been very wary of applying paint (of any kind) to bare plastic. The primer will give your paint a surface it can really hold on to.

 

By the way, car primers can now be purchased in a very wide range of colours (and the anti-rust ones will not go on to plastic models at all well, from what I've heard about them). 

 

Good luck with your build, my friend.

 

Chris.

 

PS: Remember, keep the primer moving AT ALL TIMES. Never feel tempted to hold it in one place, to cover an area that the primer went on in a thin/patchy way.   

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The best colour primer for high lighting any imperfections is grey primer. A light layer is all it will take to show up any holes, seems or just anything that requires more prep work. You can primer, repair and primer again, as many times as you need, until you get the proper smooth surface you desire. Then once all is good you can final prime then apply your colour coats. Proper prep is the key to a perfect finish..

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On 12/13/2018 at 3:19 AM, Steve Noble said:

The best colour primer for high lighting any imperfections is grey primer. A light layer is all it will take to show up any holes, seems or just anything that requires more prep work. You can primer, repair and primer again, as many times as you need, until you get the proper smooth surface you desire. Then once all is good you can final prime then apply your colour coats. Proper prep is the key to a perfect finish..

Ok, so I used a 500 (grit?) primer, a rough one, and it did fix up the surface very nicely although some parts seem rougher than others in that it doesn't have a uniform sheen. I am now on the second coat of paint but I'm starting to think that I should have either fine sanded the rough primer coat or applied a finer primer. If so I'd think it's not too late to fine sand the painted area as per damage control, would it? 

 

On 12/13/2018 at 12:08 AM, spruecutter96 said:

PS: Remember, keep the primer moving AT ALL TIMES. Never feel tempted to hold it in one place, to cover an area that the primer went on in a thin/patchy way.   

 

You mean, to keep moving the airbrush or can from side to side, right? I do all my work with brushes and I'm applying the same principle.

 

***

 

Well, I started this reply with a quote which I cannot push down to update you...

 

The clear blueish grey of the right wing upper side came on nicely but the whole upper area was ruined when I painted the darker tone of the camouflage so I had to remove all that paint. I proceeded to prime the now exposed plastic and I'm at the second coat of paint. Should have smoothened the primer coat since it was really rough.

 

To prevent the problem I had with the darker tone of grey from happening again I will mask the model with liquid latex.

 

 

 

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