Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 To try speeding up painting horses, I bought some Vallejo Model Air, in various shades of brown. The stuff airbrushes OK, doesn't spit, run or clog, but I'm having problems. I'm applying over a decent (matte) primer which has been dry for a couple of days. So, despite long, careful mixing, the drying time is HOURS. My spraying area isn't unduly cold or humid, and drying of Tamiya acrylics after AB'ing is about ten minutes. Second, coverage is appalling. Even using Dark Earth which ought to be fairly opaque, after two coats isn't still really, really patchy. Third, nothing seems to make a decent fist of cleanup afterwards. I've tried IPA/surgical spirit, detergent, soapy water, diluted screenwash and even cellulose thinners and the stuff fights all the way! What am I missing here? I've used Vallejo Model Colour brushed for years no problem, and I've airbrushed all different makes and apart from the later Humbrol acrylics I've never had a problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocky05d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 What are you mixing it with ? It is already thinned as you know . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 minute ago, cocky05d said: What are you mixing it with ? It is already thinned as you know . Straight out of the pot mate. It flows and sprays a treat, as I say, doesn't clog, spit or any of that sort of thing. I could put up with the long drying time and tricky cleanup but the apparently miserable covering power is really doing my crust in. Based on this it would be a cold day in hell before I tried it on an aircraft! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratch Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 When I airbrush VMA its touch-dry within 20 minutes - no idea why yours takes so long to dry. Did you shake the bottle before putting in your airbrush cup? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocky05d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 I do find that spraying small items such as aircraft spinners or wheels ,then VMA is a bit of a pain. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 23 minutes ago, Ratch said: When I airbrush VMA its touch-dry within 20 minutes - no idea why yours takes so long to dry. Did you shake the bottle before putting in your airbrush cup? Definitely. I've been shaking them for several minutes every day since I bought them because I know the normal acrylics settle out really badly, and shook each jar for several minutes before use. I have wondered whether this still wasn't enough, despite it seeming at least thorough if not extreme! 14 minutes ago, cocky05d said: I do find that spraying small items such as aircraft spinners or wheels ,then VMA is a bit of a pain. This is 28mm scale wargame horses, so the size of tailplanes/elevators on 1/72 or 1/48 aircraft. Not massive, but decent size bits. It slides off raised details in a quite alarming way, leaving them very, very exposed. I'm running at about 10-12 psi which doesn't seem excessive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dnl42 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 (edited) Too old or bad batch? I tried them back in maybe '13 or '14. Didn't have the problems back then that you described, but I found them too thick. I kept them for brushing. I just recently tossed those bottles because they became unusable. No amount of shaking or stirring would make them stable, sounds a little like what you described. Edited December 2, 2018 by dnl42 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocky05d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 I should crank up the air pressure .Also what size nozzle are you using ?I had a lot of problems with a 0,35 ,when i changed to a ,050 it was a lot better . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 Standard 0.5mm nozzle, and brand new bottles! I'll try more pressure later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Very strange, I use them from a 0.2 tip uo to 15 PSI and have no issue with them. You seem to have done all the right things, shake them properly, straight from the bottle into the airbrush... wonder if you got some dodgy ones, or maybe they are old. I've had one bottle of Vallejo model color behaving that way in the past but it was one in 20 or 30, so I assumed it was just a bad one that got through quality control. To get rid of vallejo paint I use denatured alcohol, works perfectly even on old paint. Ammonia also works. In the worst possible cases there's brake fluid, but this also removes the primer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocky05d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 34 minutes ago, Mitch K said: Standard 0.5mm nozzle, and brand new bottles! I'll try more pressure later... Well i am out of ideas ,i take the top of the bottle off and stir the paint ,now i am out of ideas . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depressed lemur Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 I have found that sticking a couple of ball bearings in helps tremendously. Other than that, .3 or .5 needle, around 20psi and I normally have no problems. One thing I do is after spraying an area is shut off paint and blow air through the brush to speed up drying. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratch Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 What is your "decent (matte) primer" ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Ratch said: What is your "decent (matte) primer" ? Duplicolor white. Works like dream! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch K Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 Thanks everyone! I'm going to leave things for now, re-do where I can see I need more filler then try again, after "getting medieval" on the stirring! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratch Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 2 hours ago, Mitch K said: Duplicolor white. Works like dream! Maybe its reacting with the Vallejo paint. I use Vallejo's own polyurethane primer. Usually the Gloss Black on figures but sometimes the white. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corsairfoxfouruncle Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Hello @Mitch K ... Ive brushed it with no problems, other than it needing a 2nd or 3rd coat. What i do is let it sit on a paint palette for 15-20 minutes. This is to thicken or evaporate the thinners a little. To clean i use 91% Iso. Alcohol and if its stubborn i use tamiya lacquer thinner. Dennis 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan71 Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 (edited) I had a few problems with Model Air.But found even though you can spray straight out of the bottle.A few drops of there thinner made all the difference.After thinning never had any more problems.But you do need to shake the hell out of the bottle and a few ball bearings helps.Also found turning the psi up a bit. Say 18/20 Edited December 3, 2018 by Bryan71 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissy_J Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 On 03/12/2018 at 08:06, Bryan71 said: I had a few problems with Model Air.But found even though you can spray straight out of the bottle.A few drops of there thinner made all the difference.After thinning never had any more problems.But you do need to shake the hell out of the bottle and a few ball bearings helps.Also found turning the psi up a bit. Say 18/20 I struggled with Model Air too; some would spray well out of the bottle, others wouldn't. In the end I now add several drops of thinner to the paint in the cup, and a drop of flow enhancer, and stirred it in. Then test on some cardboard. If it's too thin (it runs or looks watery or 'spidery') I add a drop more paint. I still have problems with tip drying though. I use Vallejo or Lifecolor airbrush thinner, and Daler Rowney flow enhancer, decanted into empty dropper bottles, and spray at about 15psi. I do recall being advised not to use the paint straight after shaking, because it aerates the mixture, but to let it stand for a couple of minutes before dropping it into your airbrush. In fact Vallejo recommend rolling their bottles to mix the contents, instead of shaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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