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Lancaster tropical radiators.


Admiral Puff

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I know that the radiators fitted to Tiger Force aircraft, and others intended for use in similar climes, were deeper, to provide better cooling. I've not been able to confirm how much deeper they were than the standard radiators - can anyone oblige, please?

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They are chubbier too, and the opening is a slightly different shape, I don't know of any good reliable drawings but I gather the Merlin versions of the current Airfix kit comes with both versions, as does (I'm told) the Hasegawa kit.

 

If you do a lots of Google Image searches for "Lancaster FM213" or "Lancaster KB895" for standard, and "Lancaster PA474" for the larger ones, and find some comparable angles, you will see the differences.

Edited by Work In Progress
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Thanks for that.

 

The Airfix FE release has the standard sized radiators (either that or the new moulds all have tropical ones ...) but I haven't laid eyes on the newest of the new as yet. As to Hasegawa, they long ago priced themselves out of my interest ...

 

I'll try your photo search and see what I can come up with. 

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6 hours ago, Admiral Puff said:

Thanks for that.

 

The Airfix FE release has the standard sized radiators (either that or the new moulds all have tropical ones ...) but I haven't laid eyes on the newest of the new as yet.

Hmm yes. My ol;y new Airfix Lancaster is a II, but from some further looks back at previous reviews it appears I was misinformed about the FE kit having the big radiators. Which is pretty disappointing from Airfix,

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1 hour ago, 72nd SQN said:

I have noticed something similar on some Lancastrians - like the one below that has a much deeper style with secondary intakes within the Radiator housing - similar to the Lincoln, but not annular.

ac8b4921-0b2f-4fc7-a8e2-98b46b74409d.jpg

Thanks for that - it gives a really good idea of the tropical nacelle layout generally and how much deeper the tropical radiators were. The intakes below the spinners were for carby air - note that the standard inlets on the sides of the nacelles have been deleted. And yes, a lot of Lancastrians used the tropical radiators, especially (but not only) those operated by Qantas and BOAC on the Kangaroo Route. That's one of the reasons I'm asking - my 1:32 Lancaster (whether HK or WNW) will be done as a Qantas Lancastrian, and in that scale the difference will be noticeable.

21 minutes ago, Work In Progress said:

Hmm yes. My ol;y new Airfix Lancaster is a II, but from some further looks back at previous reviews it appears I was misinformed about the FE kit having the big radiators. Which is pretty disappointing from Airfix,

The FE kit was a disappointment in more ways than one. Apart from the White/Black paint job, it seems to be the standard B.I/III without any of the tropical mods such as the radiators or the cabin cooling inlet on the starboard side of the fuselage above the wing - almost false advertising!

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42 minutes ago, Admiral Puff said:

Thanks for that - it gives a really good idea of the tropical nacelle layout generally and how much deeper the tropical radiators were. The intakes below the spinners were for carby air - note that the standard inlets on the sides of the nacelles have been deleted. And yes, a lot of Lancastrians used the tropical radiators, especially (but not only) those operated by Qantas and BOAC on the Kangaroo Route. That's one of the reasons I'm asking - my 1:32 Lancaster (whether HK or WNW) will be done as a Qantas Lancastrian, and in that scale the difference will be noticeable.

The FE kit was a disappointment in more ways than one. Apart from the White/Black paint job, it seems to be the standard B.I/III without any of the tropical mods such as the radiators or the cabin cooling inlet on the starboard side of the fuselage above the wing - almost false advertising!

Be interesting to see if HKM & WnW include the 'tropical radiators' as an option in the 1/32 kits. I intend to build PA474 so will need them. Alternatively it's another job for the aftermarket resin folks

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Not that I know of. And you're right - a 1:72 FE conversion set, with all the FE bits Airfix left out of their "FE" Lancaster, would be a no-brainer. Lancasters, Lancastrians, Yorks ...

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10 hours ago, Admiral Puff said:

Not that I know of. And you're right - a 1:72 FE conversion set, with all the FE bits Airfix left out of their "FE" Lancaster, would be a no-brainer. Lancasters, Lancastrians, Yorks ...

... and of course PA474, which is the one most people see, and (if memory serves correctly) "Just Jane" too.

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On ‎10‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 5:34 AM, 72nd SQN said:

I have noticed something similar on some Lancastrians - like the one below that has a much deeper style with secondary intakes within the Radiator housing - similar to the Lincoln, but not annular.

ac8b4921-0b2f-4fc7-a8e2-98b46b74409d.jpg

 

Are these the same tropical fit, or a third variant?  Having a secondary intake inside the main intake would reduce the flow to the radiators suggesting that they would require yet further enlargement.

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Just found this

 

https://goo.gl/images/LUhXMz

 

This looks like ‘type 3’

 

Edit

 

Here is G-AKDP from the port side

 

https://www.na3t.org/air/photo/AB00614

 

Its the same aircraft as in 72 Sqn’s post - look at the markings under the cockpit.

 

So was this a one-off? I’m sure Flight Refuelling were more than capable of doing this sort of modification.

 

It was built as a MK.X and served with TCA. So was it modded beforehand?

 

Trevor 

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A link to another exposure, a bit sharper, that seems to be the same occasion:

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8270787@N07/8437676170

 

There is lots of good detail there.  Four machines with at least 3 nose paint designs in three different shades of blue.  One prop has black blades, one is NMF.  Are those Lincoln wheels?  And aerials galore.

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14 minutes ago, Max Headroom said:

^^ The link doesn’t work (not on my iPhone at least).

 

Trevor

Hyperlink doesn't seem automatic in Chrome either but one can still copy and paste.  That works as advertised.

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20 hours ago, Sonoran said:

I would be extremely shocked if either of the 1/32 kits has them.

HKM Lanc has the cabin cooling intake and I would expect the WNW Lanc to have it too. According to the Spec, the WNW Lanc has more variable options, but both only have the regular (non FE) intakes and radiators. Interestingly, the WNW Lanc has parts to build both RR Merlins and Packard ones! 

 

The WNW Lanc has the early tailwheel which I need for PA474, meaning I just need to hope out for aftermarket treaded mainwheels and will probably have to do the rudder mod myself. 

 

As a note, don’t use PA474’s radiators as gospel for an FE Lanc - her’s are the York type. You want to be looking at the NX series Mk.VII survivors for that 

 

Cheers,

  WV908

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23 minutes ago, WV908 said:

As a note, don’t use PA474’s radiators as gospel for an FE Lanc - her’s are the York type. You want to be looking at the NX series Mk.VII survivors for that 

 

 

So that's four different types?  Not counting Lincolns, of course.

Edited by Graham Boak
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27 minutes ago, Graham Boak said:

So that's four different types?  Not counting Lincolns, of course.

At a guess, yes. European, FE, York and the tropical carburettor type.

 

The York type is a bit wider than the FE radiator but just as deep. In general though, ignore PA474 for Lanc references as she was such a late airframe and has been modded so much post war that a good chunk of the fittings are Lincoln* and York (spar caps are even re-machined Shackleton stock). Ignore R5868 as she’s a Trigger’s broom, equally ignore NX611 as the VII is vastly different in fittings  (plus she should also have a Martin 250CE) and ignore KB889 as she’s a MK.X, unless of course you want a representative X as she’s spot on. For a ‘proper’ Lancaster you have to make the trip to Australia for W4783. As such, this airframe is the only survivor that can accurately be built OOB with no mods at all from ANY of the Lanc kits currently in production, plus the HKM Lanc of course. I’m not sure about the WNW kit yet 

 

*technically Lanc parts, but are accepted on the whole as changes primarily for Lincoln production

 

Cheers,

  WV908

Edited by WV908
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On 10/3/2018 at 3:47 PM, Admiral Puff said:

Thanks for that - it gives a really good idea of the tropical nacelle layout generally and how much deeper the tropical radiators were. The intakes below the spinners were for carby air - note that the standard inlets on the sides of the nacelles have been deleted. And yes, a lot of Lancastrians used the tropical radiators, especially (but not only) those operated by Qantas and BOAC on the Kangaroo Route. That's one of the reasons I'm asking - my 1:32 Lancaster (whether HK or WNW) will be done as a Qantas Lancastrian, and in that scale the difference will be noticeable.

The FE kit was a disappointment in more ways than one. Apart from the White/Black paint job, it seems to be the standard B.I/III without any of the tropical mods such as the radiators or the cabin cooling inlet on the starboard side of the fuselage above the wing - almost false advertising!

A diorama of G-AGLX would be simple and avoid the radiator size/shape issue! Although strictly speaking it was a BOAC aircraftt.

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