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Sunderland into Empire


DMC

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9 hours ago, dcrfan said:

This thread lead me to purchase a ebook on the Empires.  Great reading on the train today.  Thanks for the heads up.  

Your welcome.  I have one in the post myself.  That whole Imperial Airway thing makes for good reading 

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1 hour ago, Jure Miljevic said:

Dennis,

why not going the whole hog and convert Sunderland into Maia component, adding scratch-built Mercury component on the top of it :wicked:? Just joking, but it would make an impressive model. Cheers

Jure

I don’t know very much about the, is it mayo?, set-up but I’ve seen photos.  That would be quite a project.  Out of my abilities I think. 

 

Cheers

 

Dennis 

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Hi Dennis

 

I started a similar topic on the Empire/Sunderland a couple of years back. Have a look at Ed Russell’s post (#8) and the link to the Airfix tribute forum - an interesting conversion of a Sunderland to Empire. I was lucky enough to obtain a vacform fuselage that was mentioned from one of our Aussie members. It’s pretty basic but should do the job!

Cheers

Glen

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Hi Glen,

 

Wow, thanks for taking the time to post this terrific reply.  It has, more or less, helped me to make up my mind about taking on what has proved to be quite a challenging build.  At first I thought, after basic research, the similarities between the two aircraft were close enough to allow me to convert with only detail scratch building, mainly the bow.  Now I have come to the conclusion, thanks to your reply, and the others, that the project is probably above my modelling pay grade.  The build in the Airfix Tribute Forman is especially worth viewing just to see what is involved.  Just the sort of thing I enjoy seeing other, more adventurous, modellers take on.  Fascinating stuff.

 

Cheers, and thanks again,

 

Dennis

 

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I have been reading this topic with interest. I have had plans to convert the old Airfix Sunderland into the SAS Sandringham but the lack of decals has stopped me. I have been looking at the 1/144 Sandringham from F-RSIN but I would still have to get decals so that was no option. Well I guess I need to use build time to learn a vector based paint program so that I can get decals printed as for some reason people say that pixel based pictures can't be used even though I have many models on the shelf that disagree.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/16/2018 at 7:42 PM, KRK4m said:

No, brother - just the opposite. The engines in Empire are parallel to the fuselage centreline (and the line of flight), while in SUnderland they are poitning outwards, like in Ju 52 3m. So you can use the Sunderland wing as a whole (unmodified) - just modify the wing/fuselage joint (the sinus of 4 deg is 0.07 which makes some 6mm insert needed for the 90mm wing chord in 1/72).

Of course the underwings floats must be realigned and the flaps (much larger in the Sunderland) rescribed on the underside.

Cheers

Michael

Unless I screwed up working to the Warpaint plans the floats on my Italeri Sunderland also point outward but in any case they can easily be realigned, just cut off the lump on the stuts that is meant to go inside the float and they will point any which way you like. How do I know? Which dimwit joined the floats BEFORE reading the instructions :banghead:

Edited by rossm
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The Maia was not an Empire Class boat but a separate design.  Good luck.

 

Remember to note the difference in step between the early marks of Sunderland and the later ones: some work will be required to match the later one to the Empire (not sure about the earlier one, but I think it more similar to the Empire.)

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 9/20/2018 at 6:14 PM, Orso said:

 F-RSIN but I would still have to get decals so that was no option.

I think one of the F-RSIN kits came with a SAS option.

EDIT - Yes, kit 144 14026 SAS/DNL (LN-LAI) 

 

With reference to the above posts,  I still think my latter solution is the optimal one. viz

Quote

 I suggest giving up some other vice and putting the money into a CMR kit (:>)

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1 hour ago, Ed Russell said:

I think one of the F-RSIN kits came with a SAS option.

EDIT - Yes, kit 144 14026 SAS/DNL (LN-LAI) 

That is true but sadly they got the decals wrong. The SAS ship had a different windows layout and the SAS text they used on the decal is for a more modern plane and not the 1940 style.

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As far as I can see the DNL Sandringhams went to SAS in 1952, not 1940.

In 1/144. I imagine decal windows would be fine.

The F-RSIN one looks similar to this but I imagine there are some differences.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5d/SAS_Short_Sandringham_at_Fornebu.jpg

Decals are available in 1/72 for a RAI one so maybe the SAS one is not impossible. It's probably easier to hire a graphic artist than learn CorelDraw or similar! Good luck!

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I can live with decal windows in 1/144 scale but F-RSIN have windows missing, in the wrong place and also wrong shape. The SAS lettering doesn't match the Sandringham they are more suitable for a jet plane.

I am thinking about 1/72 scale decals for a DC-3 or DC-4. Perhaps they could be used.

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  • 4 months later...

Even I have looked into these planes as possible modeling subjects in the past. The 2 points I don't see covered here yet:

 

1. The Empire Boat canopy was made up of "blown" panels, all one smooth compound curve shape, while the Sunderlands had flat windshield panels to prevent optical distortion during searches & attack runs.

 

2. The Maia had a very different fuselage cross-section, flaired wider at the bottom with hollow curves in the sides to support the additional weight of the Mercury. This is well-represented in the Contrail kit.

 

Cheers, -Lars

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On 3/17/2019 at 1:59 AM, lars_opland said:

1. The Empire Boat canopy was made up of "blown" panels, all one smooth compound curve shape, while the Sunderlands had flat windshield panels to prevent optical distortion during searches & attack runs.

The Airfix Sunderland has rather curved surfaces of windows in main canopy, it may help 

J-W

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Hi J-W, My recollection of the kit part, without checking in the attic stash, is that the interior surface is a smooth curve while the exterior is faceted around the front as it should be, leading to the classic "Coke bottle" appearance in the windshield panels. The top is compound curved, as it should be. Careful sanding & polishing would make the Airfix part more suitable for an Empire boat than a Sunderland, I think....

 

Cheers, -Lars

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2 hours ago, lars_opland said:

My recollection of the kit part, without checking in the attic stash, is that the interior surface is a smooth curve while the exterior is faceted around the front as it should be, leading to the classic "Coke bottle" appearance in the windshield panels. The top is compound curved, as it should be. Careful sanding & polishing would make the Airfix part more suitable for an Empire boat than a Sunderland, I think....

Agree

J-W

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi all

I have built both the Sandringham and the C Class in 1/72. Both from the airfix  sunderland kit. Made my own decals for VH. BRC Beachcomber and still completing decals and details for C Class Coriolanus but basic work done.  both models take time and patience but not impossible. Cheaper than the box kit.

Sandringham details were from an old APMA Aaustralian plastic modellers magazine. C class fuselage used an old 1/72 C class vacform fuselage as a guide where to reshape the airfix parts. 

Edited by John Martin
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On 4/6/2019 at 10:11 AM, John Martin said:

Hi all

I have built both the Sandringham and the C Class in 1/72. Both from the airfix  sunderland kit. Made my own decals for VH. BRC Beachcomber and still completing decals and details for C Class Coriolanus but basic work done.  both models take time and patience but not impossible. Cheaper than the box kit.

Sandringham details were from an old APMA Aaustralian plastic modellers magazine. C class fuselage used an old 1/72 C class vacform fuselage as a guide where to reshape the airfix parts. 

Very interesting. I am still gathering courage to do conversion of Sunderland into Empire. Recently I made vacu Clipper in 1/72 what was also a kind of challange...

It would be helpfull if you can show some details of conversion or just tel about the tricky things and show result....Could you?

Regards

Jerzy-Wojtek

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