ththtttu7 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 I've created this thread to show reference photos and descriptions, for the Hornet and Sea Hornet airframe detail. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huvut76g7gbbui7 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 Hello David. Not quite sure if you mean to post details yourself or if you are asking us to do so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted June 30, 2018 Author Share Posted June 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, Scimitar said: Hello David. Not quite sure if you mean to post details yourself or if you are asking us to do so? Hi Scimitar, It would be great if anyone contributes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huvut76g7gbbui7 Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 Here's one taken at HMS Fulmar (RNAS Lossiemouth) in 1957 by Ian Stott who retains the copyright. Click to enlarge. Dozens of them were scrapped there. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 some cockpit photos John 8 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britman Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Excellent reference there John, thank you. I knew of some RAF Transport Command chappies that might describe that string as an auto pilot! Keith. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted July 1, 2018 Author Share Posted July 1, 2018 Hi Canberra kid, Your cockpit photos show the interior of Sea Hornet PR22 prototype TT187. Originally it was built as an F20. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 some more John 8 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k5054nz Posted July 2, 2018 Share Posted July 2, 2018 For a moment I thought it was someone asking for reference material and I was going to post "Contact forum member David Collins"! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted July 8, 2018 Author Share Posted July 8, 2018 (edited) The story of one Hornet: Hornet PX293 seems to be unique for the type, in having every stage of its flying service marked with a photo, highlighting the variety of colours they wore. It also had one of the longest flying service lives too, from March 46, to May '55. First flight 8th March 1046. Medium Sea Grey upper surfaces, PRU Blue undersides. Serials in Night Black on fuselage sides and undersides of wings. Blue/Red B-type roundals in 4 places. Blue/Red fin flash. Delivered to 27MU (Maintenance Unit) 14t August 1946. Fin extension added. Delivered to 19 Squadron, coded "A" on the 18th November 1947. Medium Sea Grey upper surfaces, PRU Blue undersides. Serials in Night Black on fuselage sides and undersides of wings. Blue/White/Red D-type roundals in 6 places. Blue/White/Red fin flash. Transferred to 27 MU by 17th May 1951. Transferred to Airwork by 4th June 1952, to be converted to an F4, with the addition of a Target Tow attachment and downward facing cameras. Green/Grey cammo upper surfaces, PRU Blue undersides with high demarcation line. Serials in Night Black on fuselage sides and undersides of wings. Blue/White/Red D-type roundals in 6 places. Blue/White/Red fin flash. Work complete by 29th January 1953, at 10 MU. Ferried to FEAF (Far East Air Force) via Benson from 25th May 1954. Joined 33 Squadron, coded "V" by 9th June 1954. With combined squadron 33/45 by 25th March 1955. SOC (Struck off charge by 27th May 1955. And here represented by two 1/72 Frog kits. Edited July 13, 2018 by David A Collins 11 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christer A Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 A question about the three under fuselage lights. Were they only available on the FAA machines and not the RAF ones? You can (barely) see them here, if you squint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 Wow- incredible photos, John! Thank you so much for sharing them with us! BTW, in that photo of PX239, am I right in assuming the undersides are yellow? What a neat scheme for a modeling project. Such a beautiful airplane- wonder how the restoration of that derelict in Canada is going? (You know, I never noticed until just now that the Hornet had the same paired exhaust stack arrangement as the single-stage Merlin Mossies.) Looks like @David A Collins picked up on that when he did his two Frog Hornets- I sure didn't when I did mine as PX217!) Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 5 hours ago, 72modeler said: Wow- incredible photos, John! Thank you so much for sharing them with us! BTW, in that photo of PX239, am I right in assuming the undersides are yellow? What a neat scheme for a modeling project. Such a beautiful airplane- wonder how the restoration of that derelict in Canada is going? (You know, I never noticed until just now that the Hornet had the same paired exhaust stack arrangement as the single-stage Merlin Mossies.) Looks like @David A Collins picked up on that when he did his two Frog Hornets- I sure didn't when I did mine as PX217!) Mike Thanks Mike @72modeler it is( was) a magnificent aeroplane, good question about the underside colour, I'd say yes, going on the fact the background inside the circle is a diferant colour to the underside(Ocean Grey?), perhaps to stop the bottom half of the 'P' disappearing? well that's my thoughts. John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted June 11, 2019 Author Share Posted June 11, 2019 (edited) On 6/11/2019 at 8:18 PM, canberra kid said: Thanks Mike @72modeler it is( was) a magnificent aeroplane, good question about the underside colour, I'd say yes, going on the fact the background inside the circle is a diferant colour to the underside(Ocean Grey?), perhaps to stop the bottom half of the 'P' disappearing? well that's my thoughts. John The underside of PX239 was yellow. The circle around the P is the same yellow. This is locally outlined in black. I will upload a photo to illustrate clearly. I'll have to scan in an original photo of PX239, but until I do here is the original NF21 prototype PX230 showing the same detail. PX230 by hornet project Edited June 12, 2019 by David A Collins 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Leader Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Not sure if this is ‘thread drifting’ however just wondering what’s everyone’s thoughts on the old Frog 1/72 Hornet kit? The Canopy looks a little small IMO and it definitely is if compared to the Special Hobby kit of the same scale. Besides that (not including its general basic details) it appears to be ok. Are there any other obvious issues that one would attempt to fix? Cheers.. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Rabbit Leader said: Not sure if this is ‘thread drifting’ however just wondering what’s everyone’s thoughts on the old Frog 1/72 Hornet kit? The Canopy looks a little small IMO and it definitely is if compared to the Special Hobby kit of the same scale. Besides that (not including its general basic details) it appears to be ok. Are there any other obvious issues that one would attempt to fix? Cheers.. Dave Dave, @The Wooksta! of this parish did an article in Scale Aircraft Modelling some years ago where he converted the Frog kit to an F.1, from what I can glean is the fin is too thick and of course there's the lack of detail you'd expect from a Frog kit of that vintage. He spent some time refining the details and also tackled the tailplane for the F.1 config, I don't know enough about the beast to know what these differences are. His summary was that in spite of a few outline errors it builds up well. P.S Happy Birthday young man! Edited June 12, 2019 by Wez 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scimitar F1 Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Why is it so difficult to get the Hornet right? Is Dynavector the only way to go for an accurate one? I have the Trumoy one but some company really needs to do it justice! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 18 minutes ago, Scimitar F1 said: Why is it so difficult to get the Hornet right? Is Dynavector the only way to go for an accurate one? I have the Trumoy one but some company really needs to do it justice! Couldn't agree more. Talking of getting things right, I have Xtradecal 72124 which is a sheet covering 19 Sqn RAF which includes F.1 PX284/H, it is shown as having a silver fuselage but the wing undersides and engine cowlings are PRU Blue and the top of the forward engine cowlings in MSG. I'm a bit dubious about this, is this an aircraft a partial way through re-paint (which is a very un-RAF thing to do), or does it have a replacement cowling or even wing robbed from another aircraft (which is a very RAF thing to do). The Warpaint has a profile which has a similar rendition of the scheme but the upper cowlings are PRU Blue. Picking up Troy Smith's mantra about not trusting a profile without a photo, can somebody verify this scheme? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Wez said: Couldn't agree more. Talking of getting things right, I have Xtradecal 72124 which is a sheet covering 19 Sqn RAF which includes F.1 PX284/H, it is shown as having a silver fuselage but the wing undersides and engine cowlings are PRU Blue and the top of the forward engine cowlings in MSG. I'm a bit dubious about this, is this an aircraft a partial way through re-paint (which is a very un-RAF thing to do), or does it have a replacement cowling or even wing robbed from another aircraft (which is a very RAF thing to do). The Warpaint has a profile which has a similar rendition of the scheme but the upper cowlings are PRU Blue. Picking up Troy Smith's mantra about not trusting a profile without a photo, can somebody verify this scheme? Hi, There are four main reasons why the Hornet hasn't been modelled accurately by manufacturers so far: 1/ Lack of a whole airframe to measure. 2/ As far back as the late 40's the length and tail-plane widths of the airframe were published inaccurately for some of the marks, leading to confusion. 3/ Accurate manufacturers drawings were not available outside of deHavilland/British Aerospace until recently. 4/ Most profile artwork has re-hashed the same inaccuracies and spurious schemes due to lazy research or not actually looking at good photos that have been available for years. And finally, the Frog Hornet doesn't look too bad in plan view, but as a previous poster said thicknesses of many parts are off, leading to parts that cannot be corrected as you start chasing the errors everywhere! Wing is too thick. Fin is too thick. Nose is too pointy. Canopy is too flat. Edited June 12, 2019 by David A Collins 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ththtttu7 Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, Wez said: Couldn't agree more. Talking of getting things right, I have Xtradecal 72124 which is a sheet covering 19 Sqn RAF which includes F.1 PX284/H, it is shown as having a silver fuselage but the wing undersides and engine cowlings are PRU Blue and the top of the forward engine cowlings in MSG. I'm a bit dubious about this, is this an aircraft a partial way through re-paint (which is a very un-RAF thing to do), or does it have a replacement cowling or even wing robbed from another aircraft (which is a very RAF thing to do). The Warpaint has a profile which has a similar rendition of the scheme but the upper cowlings are PRU Blue. Picking up Troy Smith's mantra about not trusting a profile without a photo, can somebody verify this scheme? Regarding 19 Sqn RAF which includes F.1 PX284/H, I will dig out some photo's to show what is right/wrong with this scheme. There were a couple of aircraft from 19, 64, and 65 Squadron that received partial trial colour schemes. All were rejected. 19SQN - PX246 (two photo's of one scheme) PX246 by hornet project - PX284 (one photo, three schemes) 64SQN - Unspecified aircraft, description only. 65SQN - PX252 (no photos, description only) - This particular aircraft has had the same incorrect artwork re-hashed for years, in fact currently in the latest Flypast. I will update this thread with descriptions and photo's of these schemes. Edited June 12, 2019 by David A Collins 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sloegin57 Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 .....just thought that I would pop this in, following on from Canberra kid's excellent series. found on the web, thanks to original poster :- Dennis 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Headroom Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 16 minutes ago, Jordi said: A lot of airplanes seem to be cursed. How long was it before we finally got an accurate 1/48 Spitfire Mk.IX? Quite agree about the Hornet. As for the Spit IX, wotabout Eduard? Trevor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 11 hours ago, sloegin57 said: .....just thought that I would pop this in, following on from Canberra kid's excellent series. found on the web, thanks to original poster :- Dennis I love this picture, both props are feathered and the aircraft is only flying on kinetic energy and gravity yet it still looks like it's roaring along at over 400mph! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Re David Collins' comments on the Frog Hornet kit issues, I am in total agreement with them all-the wings look like they would be better suited for a glider. The wheel bays and cockpit are bare, and although it's a very minor issue and hard to see unless you are looking for it, one of the engine cowlings is 3" longer than the other right behind the spinner backplate due to the gearing needed to reverse the rotation of one engine, but this poor old Mk 1a brain doesn't recall which one at the moment! Like the rest of you, I think she is one gorgeous airplane and I hope we will see an accurate one in both 1/72 and 1/48 someday. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71chally Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 3 hours ago, Wez said: I love this picture, both props are feathered and the aircraft is only flying on kinetic energy and gravity yet it still looks like it's roaring along at over 400mph! 806 Sqn demonstrated a Hornet F.20 pair at airshows, one of which would perform what was described as an engines stopped (guessing props feathered) loop. There was also a four ship NF.21 demonstration by 809 Sqn which featured one with both engines going, one each with stb'd & port props feathered and the lead aircraft with both props feathered! Is there anything wrong with the Special Hobby Hornet? That looks quite nice to my eyes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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