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A30 Challenger.


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Well, the M1 Super Sherman is finished and waiting for a base to sit upon, the Tiran 5 has been glossed and is awaiting it's decals and the M4A3 Champagne is also waiting on a base being made, so I thought that it was time to dig out the next project. I've had this sitting in the cupboard for some years now, and have been putting off building it as just about every review that I've read about it says that it's a “dog”. I'm talking about SKP's A30 Challenger. The box that I have states that it's an “upgraded kit”, which means that it has some replacement parts in resin and workable tracks as opposed to the original clickable ones. I've assembled a set of these so called workable tracks before to use on a late welded Cromwell, so there was no way that I was going down that route again. They are a RRPITA to assemble and when finished and laid out flat, they form an arc, which is difficult to get them to mesh neatly with the road wheels and sprockets. So therefore, I ordered a set of 15.5 inch tracks from IMA in Hong Kong and hope they will be a better bet. They are more of the link and length variety.

There is also a small etched brass sheet included, but I'm don't know if that was in the original issue or is part of the upgrade. The problems that will arise from this build will be those of a fit nature, from what I've read of this kit. I've got a load of left over parts from Tamiya Cromwell kits, and a Bronco Comet which will become donor parts for anything that proves to be troublesome in the SKP kit. Failing that, there is always good old scratch building.

Colour schemes are a little limited. To paraphrase Henry Ford “you can have it in any colour that you want, so long as it's SCC15”. It will probably be a tank from 11th Armoured Brigade, same as the one that I did in 1/48th scale.

So I will be back from time to time with updates on the build (providing, that is, that I haven't thrown it against the wall).

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These are the books that I will be using for references, along with a couple of magazine articles that I've read.

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                                                                                                                                          ....................and the tracks.

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I'll show some more photos of the kit as I go along, but for now, it's a Full English and then a day in the modelling room (after all, it is Father's Day).

Thanks for looking.

 

John.

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12 hours ago, bigfoot said:

Definitely following this build with interest. I've got one of these in the stash so I'll be keeping my eye on your build for tips and problem areas!

 

12 hours ago, Kris B said:

I haven't got a clue that this model exist. It'll be very interesting project. 

Glad to have you both following. SKP's kit is the only game in town, unless you want to go down the total resin route with Accurate Armour. I spent some time going through the kits parts and already I've found some discrepancies, first of which is the fact that there are no rivet marks on the lower hull sides. So for this reason (and others), I will be using Tamiya's Cromwell lower hull and doing a cut and shut job on it.

 

John.

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23 hours ago, Bullbasket said:

Colour schemes are a little limited. To paraphrase Henry Ford “you can have it in any colour that you want, so long as it's SCC15”. It will probably be a tank from 11th Armoured Brigade, same as the one that I did in 1/48th scale.

I've seen (and hopefully saved) a photo of A30's in a dissruptive scheme,  hmm...

 

OK, here

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/missinglynx/a30-challenger-in-two-tone-camouflage-t101561.html

 

A30-7.jpg

 

though originally here

pics gone but @tonyot said the SKP kit just needed some filler.

 

HTH

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31 minutes ago, Troy Smith said:

I've seen (and hopefully saved) a photo of A30's in a dissruptive scheme,  hmm...

Thanks Troy. That's the clearest evidence that I've seen yet with regards to disruptive cammo on an A30. The argument for the Polish A30's though, is less convincing. Some opinion is that it is purely shadows. Some further digging required. Thanks for the photos.

 

John.

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As usual, I started with the lower hull, and straight away noticed that there is no detail on the outer panels, ie; no screw head details. Not wishing to go down the route of adding all of them (there are a couple of hundred), and knowing that there are some fit issues with these parts (there are no locating pins and holes), I decided that I could make a better job of this, cutting and shutting the Cromwell lower hull. I'd rather all of the extra work going down this route, than to find out later that something was misaligned and caused even bigger headaches.

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OK, so we're off and running. First job was to cut out the third panel from each side and discard it. Next a piece of 1mm card was cut to size for the extension. Using the drawings in the Army Wheels book on the Challenger, I added the screw head detail. I did this by marking out the positions and then using a .5mm bit, drilling shallow holes. These extensions were then glued in place along with some strengthening plastic on the back.

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A corresponding section was cut from the inner hull tub, and an extension made from 1mm card was inserted and glued. This was put aside to harden thoroughly, as I needed to drill a hole each side for the extra axle stub.

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Thanks for looking.

 

John.

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7 hours ago, Ripaman said:

Nice start John, love when I see models cut up waiting for some scratch work :like:

 

Thanks Richard. Yes, I know what you mean. The anticipation of seeing how it will turn out.

 

John.

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Good choice of subject John.

 

About the two tone camouflage. I suspect it was an attempt to disguise the height of the turret as much as anything. 

 

Good work on the lower hull mods. From what I've heard you've taken the best route. I will follow with interest.  

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On 23/06/2018 at 07:58, Hamden said:

 

Nice start looking forward to seeing this progress

 

  Roger

Thanks Roger. I hope to be posting something later.

 

John.

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7 hours ago, SleeperService said:

Good choice of subject John.

 

About the two tone camouflage. I suspect it was an attempt to disguise the height of the turret as much as anything. 

 

Good work on the lower hull mods. From what I've heard you've taken the best route. I will follow with interest.  

Thanks Nick. I've been itching to do this one for a while, but have been put off by the amount of work needed on it. You could be right about the two tone camouflage. I'm still trying to find a more definite photo or profile of one in that scheme. I've PM'd Mike Starmer, but not heard anything yet. I might try Dick Taylor and see if he has any info.

With regards to the SKP kit, I've found another problem. I'll put ti in my next update.

 

John.

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Using a suspension arm as a gauge, I marked where the hole should go on the sides of the inner tub. These were then drilled with a small (0.4mm) bit, and then gradually enlarged until the stub was a tight fit. Obviously, because there are only five arms per side on the Cromwell, and six on the Challenger, I had to use one from the SKP kit for the extra position. Looking at the SKP part, I wouldn't be surprised if these had been cribbed from the Tamiya ones, as they have the moulding on the rear face for the stop pegs, but with no hole to accept the peg.

All six suspension arms glued in place. Please ignore the mishmash of plastic that can be seen on the inside of the tub. This is packing to reinforce the joint. It won't be seen on the finished article, but will give added strength to the join.

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Outer plates with the extensions added to the tub.

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The original idea was to use the wheels from the Tamiya kit and just use on pair of wheels from the SKP kit. Problem was that the kit that I was using as a donor was a Centaur, not a Cromwell, so the perforated tyres were of no use. Not to worry I thought. I'll just use the SKP ones instead. Then I looked at them closely. On the back of each wheel is a stonking great pair of ejector pins, right where the mating surfaces are. I don't think that SKP could have put them in a more difficult place if they tried. I cleaned up one wheel with a knife, file and a small grinding tool in my mini drill, and it took a little over 10 minutes…………..and there are 24 wheels to do! That equates to 4 hours work. I don't mind doing it for the extra set, but not for the whole lot. So therefore, when I'm back in the Motherland next week, I'll try and pick up a Cromwell and use the wheels from it. The kit won't be wasted as I can use it to build an early Cromwell with perforated tyres at a later date.

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So for now, I'm going to skip the wheels and press on with building the rest of the hull. There's still plenty to keep me going.

That's it for now. Thanks for looking.

 

John.

 

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On ‎6‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 7:41 PM, bigfoot said:

Definitely following this build with interest. I've got one of these in the stash so I'll be keeping my eye on your build for tips and problem areas!

Same here. 

 

1 hour ago, bigfoot said:

Good work John. Although the more I see of this build, the further my challenger goes towards the back of the build list!

Same here !! 😁

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14 hours ago, bigfoot said:

Good work John. Although the more I see of this build, the further my challenger goes towards the back of the build list!

Thanks. This is definitely not the sort of kit that you give to a first time builder. There are some glaring mistakes (such as the engine deck door being about 3mm too short and the hinges on the other end not mating up with their other halves), and ejector pins being in the most ridiculous places. Certainly not a shake and bake kit.

 

John. 

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Nice work so far. It seems the kit may be even worse than reports tell. These things don't get mentioned in magazine 'reviews' and then the publishers get all emotional when punters stop buying their thinly disguised trade magazines.

 

It almost looks as if you've been checking modified parts against each other :D

 

Roadwheels... I need to nudge a rather tall Canadian about those.

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30 minutes ago, SleeperService said:

Nice work so far. It seems the kit may be even worse than reports tell. These things don't get mentioned in magazine 'reviews' and then the publishers get all emotional when punters stop buying their thinly disguised trade magazines.

 

It almost looks as if you've been checking modified parts against each other :D

 

Roadwheels... I need to nudge a rather tall Canadian about those.

Thanks Nick. A member of the club that I belonged to before coming out here, did an article on this kit when it first came out for a magazine, and he was pretty scathing about it. A lot of what he said is what I'm discovering now. Fit issues, ejector pins in stupid places, no positive locating points (most parts are butt joined), and don't even get me started on the tracks. If I was doing a review of this kit I would add one very big caveat. Only attempt it if you like a challenge (no pun intended). 

 

John.

PS. If the road wheels that you speak of are the 1/48th Centaur ones, then I have the masters back in my possession. PM me if you want them. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

There won't be any updates for a while after this, as I'm 500 miles away from my workbench. But this is how far I got before leaving home.

Made a start on the upper hull. The original intention was to use the Tamiya parts. I even got as far as cutting the rear section from the front, but after looking at the SKP part, I though that it wasn't so bad. In fact, it's nicely detailed, plus the engine deck panels are in the correct place, as are the fuel fillers. The only problem was the engine access door, which was about 3mm too short. Easily remedied though with a piece of 1mm card cut to size and detailed. I believe that the two grab handles are the sort that are semi recessed when not in use. Unfortunately, I used 10thou Slater's rod, which is too fragile…..hence the right hand one is missing. I'll replace them both with thin wire. The two locking points were made from thin card and a small circle punched out using a punch and die set.

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                                                    Tamiya.                                                                                                                           SKP.

 

There are two brackets which fix to the rear hull plate and support the exhaust/air box. I had to file a slot on the LHS for one of them as it didn't exist and was preventing the part from being attached. The RHS was OK.

Two small circles of card were added at the rear to represent the oil filler caps for the final drive.

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The frame for the mesh over the exhaust/air box from the SKP kit has some chunky sprue attachment points, three each side. Removing them, though not impossible, would have been a pain, not least because of the nature of the plastic. It's very soft and fragile. So I used the one from the Centaur and added the mesh from the Eduard set.

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Engine deck parts in place, including the replacement access door and armoured intake cover with wire grab handles. The piece of white card that can be seen within the exhaust box, is a card replacement. It supports the frame for the mesh. The kit part just didn't fit at all. I made the grills over the engine side intakes from mesh from Accurate Armour, cut to size with scissors, and then glued to 5mm wide strips of card. The two armoured covers were then glued in place.

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That's it for a couple of weeks while I sun myself on the Costa del Sarfend.

Thanks for looking.

 

John.

                   

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