T8247741 Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 Hi all, What major differences are there between an E and an F ? I have the 1/72 Revell B-17F on the way but want to build it as an E. Any pointers would be appreciated Regards Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jure Miljevic Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 Hello, Paul From the top of my head: bombardier's nose glazing and other nose transparencies would be the most obvious differences, depending on E sub-model of course. Related to these are variations in nose armament. If you are intending to build one of the early E models, Bendix remotely controlled ventral turret and aiming bubble would have to be added. Also, E did not have Tokyo tanks as did last F series Fortresses so fuel vents on wing tips (if present on Revell kit at all, I do not have the kit handy to check) would have to filled. Wheels and wheel hubs also varied but, again, this depends on particular subject of your build. Some of the Es had at some point their framed nose transparencies replaced with enlarged F type glazings. Picking one of such modified B-17Es would save you a lot of work, but your model would be almost indistinguishable from B-17F kits. Probably this is not the complete list of modifications needed but somebody else will soon chime in with additional information. Cheers Jure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 Kora does a conversion set but check your subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJP Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 It's also worth knowing that the paddle-bladed prop was introduced during F production. That meant (IIRC) that the forward lip of the cowling needed to change shape, made subtly blunter to accommodate the prop when feathered. I do not know when the change was made but the usual reference to photographs of your subject . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 19 minutes ago, RJP said: It's also worth knowing that the paddle-bladed prop was introduced during F production. That meant (IIRC) that the forward lip of the cowling needed to change shape, made subtly blunter to accommodate the prop when feathered. I do not know when the change was made but the usual reference to photographs of your subject . . . You are correct, sir; in addition, the B-17E did not have the paddle blade props that were introduced with the F and G modesl. Of course, all of the other differences as described by Jure are correct. Doing a later production B-17E would allow the Sperry ball turret to be fitted in place of the remotely operated Bendix unit, which I do not believe is included on the B-17F sprues. You might also check to see that the ADF football is located in the same position on the E and on the F. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corsairfoxfouruncle Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Hello @72modeler ... Mike maybe you’ll know but didnt the B-17E’s have a lower flatter top turret ? The later 17’s the F & G had a more rounded turret i think was called a high hat turret ? I could be mistaken here or maybe crossing another aircraft with the ‘17 but thats what my aged brain is telling me ? Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T8247741 Posted June 11, 2018 Author Share Posted June 11, 2018 Something to go on !! Thanks fellas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Was not the off-set waist gunners positions introduced during the F series. And wasn't the rear tail planes a different size on the F & G series? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJP Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 The tailplane revision was part of the general rear fuselage redesign made for the first E model. The bit everyone notices is the vertical tail but the tailplanes changed then, not later. The staggered waist guns came during later G production. Not to say an F couldn't have been retrofitted - stranger things have happened, especially with the B-17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 I may be mistaken (since I don't have the kit) but I don't think the Cheyenne turret and the staggered waist positions are include in the Revell F kit anyway. One thing I can't see mentioned is the rounded astrodome above the Navigator's position in the F. It's flat on the E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jure Miljevic Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Hello Regular propellers and rounded cowling fronts of course, thanks Mike. Dalea, I did not specify it but I put navigator dome under nose transparency variations. Interestingly, early B-17Fs did not have navigator's bubble, but at least one B-17E, XC-108 VIP conversion for General MacArthur, did. It is difficult to become bored with B-17, even without discussing paint scheme variations and nose art. Cheers Jure 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Corsairfoxfouruncle said: Hello @72modeler ... Mike maybe you’ll know but didnt the B-17E’s have a lower flatter top turret ? The later 17’s the F & G had a more rounded turret i think was called a high hat turret ? I could be mistaken here or maybe crossing another aircraft with the ‘17 but thats what my aged brain is telling me ? Dennis Dennis, The E and F both used the turret that had a lower, flatter dome with a lot of metal framing. The G's used the high-hat turret that was taller, had a sloping front, and almost no metal framework, mainly an armored back panel. I have attached a link to the recently restored Memphis Belle that shows the turret fitted to E's and F's, as well as a link to the later high-hat turret fitted to the G's. The last photo is of the top turret fitted to the recently recovered B-17E known as Swamp Ghost. Very late production F's had a lot of the features of the G- chin turret, cheek gun mounts on the nose, etc. but don't think they got the late turret. I will do some checking on that issue, or maybe somebody better versed in B-17's can confirm or correct. Hope you are doing OK. Hot as h--- here in south central Texas! Mike https://www.flickr.com/photos/dcmeatloaf/4617383748 https://www.google.com/search?q=B-17F+top+turret&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7qJK47svbAhUG7YMKHRaWAtkQ_AUICigB&biw=1280&bih=654#imgrc=kQY2qKXewQXCdM:&spf=1528728774904 https://www.google.com/search?q=B-17G+top+turret&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi81JO18MvbAhUHoYMKHbnqCQUQ_AUICigB&biw=1280&bih=654#imgrc=6UXSKSrtq5m7GM:&spf=1528729301240 https://www.google.com/search?q=B-17E+top+turret&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiwnrPR8MvbAhUB9YMKHVcfC5UQ_AUICigB&biw=1280&bih=654#imgrc=QdMLcZ2u8VYnWM:&spf=1528729360644 Edited June 11, 2018 by 72modeler corrected spelling 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corsairfoxfouruncle Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, 72modeler said: Hope you are doing OK. Hot as h--- here in south central Texas! Hey Mike ... Ok yes good no, its been pretty hot here lately, but not quite Texas hot. Im familiar with Texas hot and you have my sympathies there. Hope youre fine as well ? Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72modeler Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, Corsairfoxfouruncle said: Hey Mike ... Ok yes good no, its been pretty hot here lately, but not quite Texas hot. Im familiar with Texas hot and you have my sympathies there. Hope youre fine as well ? Dennis Doing fine, Dennis- thanks for asking! Been fighting armadillos and cinch bugs...trying to figure out how to put an insecticide hopper on a big RC airplane to nuke the nasty little spuds! Getting mighty tired of looking at my huge unbuilt kit inventory and the fact that it's been almost 30 years since I finished something...the incredible models and modelers on BM don't help, either...how can I ever match what I see on a daily basis after being out of it for so long? That being said, I see a 1/72 Hurricane Mk V or Spitfire Mk IX in my future! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killingholme Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 My experience with B-17s, little as it is, is to pick your chosen airframe first, and then ask the Britmodeller brain "how do I model this specific aircraft?". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-17 man Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 The biggest major differences overall going F to E will be the skinny prop blades, cowl shape which really wont be to noticeable unless you know what to 👀 for. The top turret should pretty much be the same, there were a lot variations but won’t be noticeable at that scale. E and F tails are the same, open window and non staggered. Same tail guns, the belly turret will likely be the sperry ball turret as the early bendix flat turrets were rare and often replaced in the field. The football antenna, pitot tubes are in the same spots however there is an additional antenna mast near the cockpit that sticks out at an angle. And of the the framed nose cone, plus the rest of the nose windows can vary between different aircraft. Best bet, search google image and look at them and see the differences on each, pick one and go from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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