Andre B Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 What is/was Humbrol 27 used for? Was it an early Humbrol grey used for "RAF ocean Grey" or "RAF Dark Sea Grey"? What can it be used for today? Can it go for extra dark sea grey? Cheers / André Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 I'm pretty sure I measured this for someone recently who wanted a Humbrol equivalent which really isn't what we're about. Anyway, the results of measuring with our Nix Pro Color sensor yielded a greenish hue resulting in a colour that doesn't really work for any of the darker RAF greys which are more towards purple-blues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 I have long considered it an acceptable match for Dark Sea Grey, but not for either of the other two. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 According to the Humbrol conversion card I acquired last week, Humbrol 27 is now supposed to be equivalent to , amongst others,- Revell 79, FS36231, RAL 7031, Xtracolor 410, Tamiya XF 54, Lifecolor UA109. Choose your own poison. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vppelt68 Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 Humbrol 27 is quite good match for German RLM 75 Grauviolett. Not so violet than, say, the "proper" Hu 246 is. A manufacturer still quotes Hu32 and Hu27 for RLM 74 and 75, and then Hu247 for RLM 76, in one of their boxings! My . V-P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 11 hours ago, dalea said: According to the Humbrol conversion card I acquired last week, Humbrol 27 is now supposed to be equivalent to , amongst others,- Revell 79, FS36231, RAL 7031, Xtracolor 410, Tamiya XF 54, Lifecolor UA109. Choose your own poison. "Equivalent" only in the sense that some US AN colours were deemed "equivalent" to MAP shades for use on lend-lease aircraft to Britain ie "an acceptable off-the-shelf paint that isn't too wide of the mark if you're not too fussy". And since this thread https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235038201-opinions-on-ocean-grey-please/ has decided Revell 47 is an acceptable match for Ocean Grey, it's unlikely that it's also a particularly close match to Humbrol 27. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalea Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 FWIW, Humbrol 27 is named "Sea Grey". "Dark Sea Grey" is 164,"Extra Dark Sea Grey" is 123. 106 is "Ocean Grey". Revell 47 is named Mouse Grey, which is presumably Mausgrau, which is RAL 7005. Revell 79 is named Greyish-Blue, which is RAL 7031, as Hornby says. What do you use it for? Presumably, painting ships Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhantomBigStu Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 I bet its very good ballpark for dark admiralty grey (harrier hawk tornado cockpit colour) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MigModeller Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 34 minutes ago, PhantomBigStu said: I bet its very good ballpark for dark admiralty grey (harrier hawk tornado cockpit colour) Really? What about H 246? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vppelt68 Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 Funny... Hu 246 is also the dedicated RLM 75, supposed to replace the Hu 27 in that job 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre B Posted May 16, 2018 Author Share Posted May 16, 2018 8 hours ago, dalea said: FWIW, Humbrol 27 is named "Sea Grey". "Dark Sea Grey" is 164,"Extra Dark Sea Grey" is 123. 106 is "Ocean Grey". Revell 47 is named Mouse Grey, which is presumably Mausgrau, which is RAL 7005. Revell 79 is named Greyish-Blue, which is RAL 7031, as Hornby says. What do you use it for? Presumably, painting ships Well... Humbrol 27, 29, 30 and 64 existed long before 106, 123, 163, 164 and 165... Or is there really someting called RAF seagrey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratch Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 13 hours ago, vppelt68 said: Humbrol 27 is quite good match for German RLM 75 Grauviolett. Not so violet than, say, the "proper" Hu 246 is. A manufacturer still quotes Hu32 and Hu27 for RLM 74 and 75, and then Hu247 for RLM 76, in one of their boxings! My . V-P That's odd, I have Hu:27 as RLM74, it was HG4 Luftwaffe Dunkelgrau 74 (Dark Grey) in the Authentics. Hu:67 & Hu:79 were also supposed to match RLM74. RLM 74 is not in the current Humbrol RLM paints. I have Hu:92 Matt Iron Grey as RLM75, though it is also compared to RLM02. Hu:106 & Hu:140 are also supposed to be RLM75, Hu:246 is the current Humbrol RLM paint. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vppelt68 Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 19 minutes ago, Ratch said: That's odd, I have Hu:27 as RLM74, it was HG4 Luftwaffe Dunkelgrau 74 (Dark Grey) in the Authentics. Hu:67 & Hu:79 were also supposed to match RLM74. RLM 74 is not in the current Humbrol RLM paints. I have Hu:92 Matt Iron Grey as RLM75, though it is also compared to RLM02. Hu:106 & Hu:140 are also supposed to be RLM75, Hu:246 is the current Humbrol RLM paint. Yes that can be quite a jungle! Humbrol, though does have that RLM 74 in their current range, as Hu 245. Here's the reference I was talking about. Br, V-P And the scheme looks like this: Maybe looks too dark and grey but I can live with that . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratch Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 My chart is assimilated from many references. It seems that Humbrol (and other sources) vary on their judgements and either this latest one is a new take or they've misprinted (not unknown). Yesterday I was listing their new sets and they have listed the same 8 paints in the AB9061 Acrylic Landscape Set as in the AB9060 Acrylic Figure Set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre B Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 I always matched Hu 79 as RLM 74. It also matched the Tamiya RLM 74 (AS spray colours). My experience with the current Humbrol RLM colours are that they are too grey. /André Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Who's Luftwaffe references are we discussing here? The conversation is rather meaningless without first know who's idea of RLMwhatever we're talking about. There is some disparity between the colour chips published by the numerous different researchers on that particular subject. I suspect the answer cannot be given, but that in itself is a full explanation of why different Humbtol numbers apparently match different RLM numbers. You don't know who's version of the RLM numbers are being compared against! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre B Posted May 18, 2018 Author Share Posted May 18, 2018 8 hours ago, Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies said: Who's Luftwaffe references are we discussing here? The conversation is rather meaningless without first know who's idea of RLMwhatever we're talking about. There is some disparity between the colour chips published by the numerous different researchers on that particular subject. I suspect the answer cannot be given, but that in itself is a full explanation of why different Humbtol numbers apparently match different RLM numbers. You don't know who's version of the RLM numbers are being compared against! Noo... But Hu 27, 67 and 79 cant match RLM 74 all three at the same day. Or... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie @ Sovereign Hobbies Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Andre B said: Noo... But Hu 27, 67 and 79 cant match RLM 74 all three at the same day. Or... ? They can if the 3 separate owners of a tin of 27, 67 and 79 all own different RLM paint chips. Merrick & Kiroff's chips don't match Ullman's which don't match Jerry Crandall's which don't match the common understanding in the 1960s, etc. Furthermore, 1 in every 12 adult males has colour perception deficiencies and it tends to worsen with age - with men suffering much worse than women and tending to see things more yellowish as they get older. Most modellers offering paint matches are doing so visually. How can you be sure they're not colourblind to a greater or lesser degree? Even if they're not, how fussy are they? I've yet to have a repair at a car bodyshop I haven't had to complain about but the guy with the paint gun thinks it's a perfect match. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Starmer Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Humbrol 27 has been around for over 50 years at least. It was I believe intended to match Extra Dark Sea Grey in the MAP range. Those swatches were published in volume V of Aircraft of the Fighting Powers and they are not printers inks, they are very close in colour and texture to the more recent RAF Aviation colours book now accepted as the standard. This was pre-plastic kits era. I used what is now 48 blue on a balsa PRU Spitfire in 1954 but it wasn't that number then because the range wasn't that large. Some of Humbrol's range then were based on the BSC. 381 1948 book too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre B Posted May 18, 2018 Author Share Posted May 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, Mike Starmer said: Humbrol 27 has been around for over 50 years at least. It was I believe intended to match Extra Dark Sea Grey in the MAP range. Those swatches were published in volume V of Aircraft of the Fighting Powers and they are not printers inks, they are very close in colour and texture to the more recent RAF Aviation colours book now accepted as the standard. This was pre-plastic kits era. I used what is now 48 blue on a balsa PRU Spitfire in 1954 but it wasn't that number then because the range wasn't that large. Some of Humbrol's range then were based on the BSC. 381 1948 book too. Thanks... I knew I've read somewhere that Hu 27 was matched as EDSG some time long ago albeit it is an better match as DSG today... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 Revell 79 might be a good greyish blue for uboats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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