Thud4444 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 I read on the interwebs that BAC proposed wiring the Lightning for Sidewinders. Was there ever a mock up done? Was it going to be a double mount like on an F-4? Or a staggered double mount like on a F-8? Or was it a single mount like on the A-7? Any official pics or documents? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabba Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 There is a picture of a Lightning F3 (I think) with a dummy Sidewinder fitted in a book on Lightnings, but I will have to wait until I get home to find out which one. It was taken a RAF Valley at an APC and was meant as a joke. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 I don't know if any mock-up was ever built, likely not. I remember having seen drawings of the proposed arrangement, IIRC it was a Y shaped arrangement attached to the fuselage stub pylons allowing 2 missiles to be carried on each side of the fuselage 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Going on memory because I cannot lay my hands on the book involved at the moment I do recall reading that thought was briefly given to equipping the Lightning with Sidewinder during the 1970s but as the cooling system for Firestreak/RedTop was not compatible with that for the AIM-9 it would have taken time and money to resolve and in any case stocks of the former were considered sufficient to see the Lightning out of service. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selwyn Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Des said: Going on memory because I cannot lay my hands on the book involved at the moment I do recall reading that thought was briefly given to equipping the Lightning with Sidewinder during the 1970s but as the cooling system for Firestreak/RedTop was not compatible with that for the AIM-9 it would have taken time and money to resolve and in any case stocks of the former were considered sufficient to see the Lightning out of service. Both types of missile had their own launcher type. The cooling system of both missiles were in their respective launchers so the coolant issue would not be much of a problem. More of an issue would have been the wiring system and the ability to link the sidewinder seeker with the radar for a full integration. (SEAM System). a basic boresight integration would have been quite easy (it was done on Harrier GR3 for the Falklands in a matter of weeks) But it was probably not considered cost effective as the lightning was envisioned to have a short life. It also is of note that The Red top seeker was considered better at target aquisition than the comparative earlier model sidewinder seekers. Selwyn 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hook Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Well, there's this.... https://hushkit.net/2013/02/01/the-ultimate-what-if-bae-super-lightning/ Cheers, Andre 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 6 hours ago, Selwyn said: Both types of missile had their own launcher type. The cooling system of both missiles were in their respective launchers so the coolant issue would not be much of a problem. Apologies , I was aware that the coolant bottle for the Sidewinder was contained within the launch rail but obviously seem to have misunderstood the cutaway drawing of the missile pack in Kev Darling's 'Lightning The Operational History' and his explanation that ' Cooling of both the seeker head and onboard electronics was carried out using nitrogen stored onboard the carrier aircraft' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabba Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Further to my earlier answer it is in the Osprey Air Combat book on the Lightning printed in 1984 and on page 146 shows XP706/BM of No11 Sqn at RAF Valley in 1982 fitted with two sidewinders drill rounds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thud4444 Posted April 16, 2018 Author Share Posted April 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, Jabba said: Further to my earlier answer it is in the Osprey Air Combat book on the Lightning printed in 1984 and on page 146 shows XP706/BM of No11 Sqn at RAF Valley in 1982 fitted with two sidewinders drill rounds. One on each side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thud4444 Posted April 16, 2018 Author Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) On 4/16/2018 at 12:39 PM, Hook said: Well, there's this.... https://hushkit.net/2013/02/01/the-ultimate-what-if-bae-super-lightning/ Cheers, Andre I'll raise you the FAA Sea Lightning Isn't that just beautifully ugly? If only my skills where up to the task. Edited April 17, 2018 by Thud4444 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabba Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 9 minutes ago, Thud4444 said: One on each side? Yes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canberra kid Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 On 16/04/2018 at 2:21 AM, Thud4444 said: I read on the interwebs that BAC proposed wiring the Lightning for Sidewinders. Was there ever a mock up done? Was it going to be a double mount like on an F-4? Or a staggered double mount like on a F-8? Or was it a single mount like on the A-7? Any official pics or documents? It took soom finding but I found these three. John 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thud4444 Posted April 17, 2018 Author Share Posted April 17, 2018 Thanks for all the help, I think I've got what I needed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweeky Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 with regards to cooling of Lightning missiles Firestreak had an ammonia bottle in the launcher as well as Stanag (that's what it called on the line) Air that was contained within the weapons pack and was recharged during servicing's 1500psi sticks I'm my mind. The Redtop that had a 3000+psi pure air bottle that was dropped out when it got to its lower value 1000psiish. when I say dropped out I mean it had a hook on a cable and a pin on the bottle it was winched down and out. when fully home it sat at an angle. Nothing replaced in the redtop launcher. As for the what if its a photoshopped mess, the side intakes are after the no1 (lower) engine. F18 super hornet intakes I do believe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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