Help and Advice - Modelcollect 1:72 B-2 Spirit

[EthanGreen123]

Hello there,

 

Calling to all modellers and in particular anyone who has built the Testors or Modelcollect 1:72 B-2 Spirit.

 

Just to give you some insight to my modelling ability, I’ve been building models for the past 12 years as a hobby, not professionally or for extreme detail or extreme realism but for fun to a good standard and as you all know over time you improve so I’d like to say I’m at a ‘Good’ standard now and that I’ve got the experience and desire to do more challenging builds. I use humbrol and Revell paints, acrylic or enamel depending on colours and I use brushes(Applying a number of coats to get a good smooth even finish). I’m starting to try and do more realistic looking builds(Not extremely realistic like some of the incredible looking models on here!) but reasonably realistic.

 

So, onto the topic of discussion - I’m just about to embark on a build of the Modelcollect 1:72 B-2 Spirit which will probably be the most difficult model I’ll build to date, not necessarily in terms of the actual construction because I will be displaying it gear up in-flight as I don’t think anything can beat the lines, shape and sleekness of the B-2 when in-flight. The difficulty for me will be more so in terms of finish, paint, decals… Likewise I’ve got quite a few questions regarding these areas so I’d really appreciate any info and advice that some of you Modelling pros could possibly pass on.

 

I’ve got questions regarding the specific look, surfaces and finish on the B-2 and then I’ve got some general modelling questions that will relate to these.

 

Decals

Firstly -

Decals on the B-2: The majority of the decals on the B-2 are long thin walkways which are relatively new to me, having mainly built WWII aircraft over the past decade which primarily consist of roundels and digits. However, the last build I did was the Revell 1/144 Globemaster which was probably the best model I’ve built, the long thin decals were tricky but I got there so I think I can do it again with the B-2 but there will be more of them and they’ll be much bigger. SO any tips and tricks on how to apply long thin decals(Walkways and panel line markings) would be greatly appreciated. My method is warm water, then use a scalpel to slide them on.

Secondly -

How do I use the Micro Set Decal Solution do I wipe some onto the spot where the decal will go beforehand and then apply some onto the decal afterward? Is that it sealed on now, i.e., no chance of it breaking/falling apart?

 

Engine Exhaust Metal

The Engine Exhausts on the B-2 are quite a stand out feature, they are very bronzed, stained and metallic. Which in comparison to the rest of the aircraft is a big contrast. How do I achieve a realistic looking finish on the exhausts? If you have a look on google images on the B-2 there are plenty of photos showing the coloration, finish and jet or fuel washed effect the exhausts have. How would I achieve this finish without an airbrush?

 

Paint: Stealth panels and shapes

The B-2 has various different angular and triangular like shapes on the surface that are either a lighter shade of the base aircraft colour or a darker shade, I’ve looked at a lot of photos of the B-2 and on some of the aircraft these panels are quite consistent with each other in terms of shape, size, position, shade of grey. However, they’re also seems to be quite a lot of inconsistency, on some aircraft these stealth panels are a lighter shade of grey than the base colour and on some it’s darker. I think this is up to me to decide as it won’t really make much difference, however either way it will require a lot of masking! Which I’m happy and confident in doing it will just take a while. SO anybody who’s built a 1:72 B-2, what would you recommend for this part? (Masking, panel shapes, shades, painting)

 

Just to follow on - PAINT COLOUR - What paint colour should I use? I’ve read the base should be Humbrol 125 but then what about the lighter/darker shade of the panels? As the B-2 has a bit of a strange finish, it’s mainly matt but then in the light it’s also quite shiny/reflective. Look at the photos. Some large sections on the wing are also more worn/faded than others. I fund that on the C-17 build I did when I used a rubber to gently rub along the panel lines it gives a bit of a faded surface look. Is is just me?

 

Right, I think that covers everything for now, sorry I’ve asked and written so much, I realise I’m asking a lot of fellow modellers. I don’t expect anybody to reply to everything I’ve said! But I’d really appreciate a short comment here or there just adding some tips or advice on decals, painting, the engine exhaust… Especially any info/advice from anyone who’s a built the Testors or Modelcollect B-2. I’m not sure where to post this so I thought I’d post it in the build section as technically it will be a build but it’s also lot’s of help questions and general stuff. If I should post it somewhere else, let me know. Thanks very much!!!

[hsr]

27 minutes ago, EthanGreen123 said:

How do I use the Micro Set Decal Solution do I wipe some onto the spot where the decal will go beforehand and then apply some onto the decal afterward? Is that it sealed on now, i.e., no chance of it breaking/falling apart?

The way I was taught was that you apply Micro Set to the area where the decal will be applied. You then apply Micro Sol to the decal before placing it in position* and then again after it is in position. Allow to dry. Once dry puncture any bubbles or silvering with the point of a sharp #11 blade and reapply Micro Sol. I have found that if you apply Micro Sol to the dry decal an hold it at an angle to a bright light any silvering will appear and you can puncture those area with the point of the knife  and the silvering will disappear. This might take several iterations to get it all out.   

 

*Micro Sol is a decal solvent so it will literally melt the decal into position. Therefore it is important to not touch the decal until the Micro Sol has dried. I hope this helps

 

 

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

Hello @EthanGreen123 ... For the walkways its possible and more manageable to cut them into shorter lengths. Use a very sharp new blade and make clean cuts. You cam overlap them by about .5 mm when placing decals. You wont lose more than a mm or two total, not enough to be noticed by anyone. Ive done that before with success. You could opt to rattlecan and mask them if you wanted to ? Ive done that also with good results from time to time. Though i haven't done it since ive gotten my new Airbrush. 

     For the micro set and micro sol. I’ve  used this system for at least 20 years. 

Step one) wet the decal in very warm water for 15-20 seconds.

 

Step two) while thats out of the water and soaking on the paper i brush micro set onto the model in the area the decal will be applied.

 

Step three) place the decal in  place on the model. Move it into the exact position you want. Adjust as needed before steps four, five, & six. 

 

Step four) wick up extra micro set and water with paper(kitchen) towel. 

 

Step five) After a few minutes i brush on microsol enough to completely cover the decal. 

 

Step six) Never and i mean Never touch the decal at this point. Doing so will destroy the decal. Wait at least 12 hours before the next step. Microsol literally melts the decal and paint together. It softens both and causes them to bond as one.

 

Step seven) if you have any panel lines, silvering, or gaps now is the time to take care of that. I usually take a fresh #11 blade and score panel lines, hinge lines and air bubbles at this point. 

 

Step eight) Repeat steps 5, 6, & 7 as needed to finish the decal. Usually once or twice. If its not perfect by this point its not going to get any better. 

 

Step nine) clearcoat to seal the decals to the model. 

 

I hope this helps you or someone else that reads this. 

[EthanGreen123]

Thanks guys for your tips on decals. The Micro Sol sounds like pretty serious. Would it be alright to brush on some micro set onto the area where the decal will go, place the decal on, then brush some more micros set over the top and then spray a clear coat varnish over the model? 

 

I understand your cutting method for the long thin decals but it might be a bit risky for me, however it could work, so thanks for that tip.

 

If I were to do it without cutting them is there any technique that prevents them from folding or breaking, other than cutting them and putting them on as separate chunks? 

Thanks again 

[billn53]

13 minutes ago, EthanGreen123 said:

Thanks guys for your tips on decals. The Micro Sol sounds like pretty serious. Would it be alright to brush on some micro set onto the area where the decal will go, place the decal on, then brush some more micros set over the top and then spray a clear coat varnish over the model? 

 

That is exactly how I use Micro Set. 

Be advised however that I've had Micro Sol sometimes react with the paint, leaving a whitish stain where it had puddled. Sometimes the stain goes away with clear coat, sometimes not. 

Edited April 2, 2018 by billn53

[rayprit]

2 hours ago, EthanGreen123 said:

But I’d really appreciate a short comment here or there just adding some tips or advice on decals, painting,

This maybe of help to you.............cant beat an eyes on tutorial can you?  incidently to help me with these micro agents on the top of the cap of each bottle I write the number 1 on the Blue and  number 2 on the red..................my memory isnt brilliant so number 1 tells me its the first solution to use and Number 2 is the second agent to use.................ovoids a lot of confusion

 

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

5 hours ago, EthanGreen123 said:

Would it be alright to brush on some micro set onto the area where the decal will go, place the decal on, then brush some more micros set over the top and then spray a clear coat varnish over the model? 

Yes thats pretty much how i do it. 

5 hours ago, EthanGreen123 said:

 

If I were to do it without cutting them is there any technique that prevents them from folding or breaking, other than cutting them and putting them on as separate chunks?

You could lay a puddle of water on the wing and pull the walkway onto it like a piece of spaghetti ? If that makes sense ? If its flat on the paper and transfers flat to the wing its less likely to roll/fold on itself. Risk to this method of course is ripping/tearing the decal from pulling to hard. If you go slow and have a-lot of liquid its less likely to tear as there will be less friction.

 

5 hours ago, billn53 said:

Be advised however that I've had Micro Sol sometimes react with the paint, leaving a whitish stain where it had puddled.

Bill speaks from experience here. Ive had the white stains also. Though mine almost slways go away when i clearcoat. If youre worried test it out on a scrap wing before trying on the B-2. I know that is a very expensive kit. If anything I've said helps you or someone reading this I’ll be happy. 

 

Dennis

[EthanGreen123]

Thanks again everyone, I think that's sorted decals now. I'll just use micro set(the blue one) before and after applying the decal and then spray a clear coat and hopefully that will seal it. As to the long thin walkway decals, still deciding on how I should tackle them but at least I'm more informed on the different options now so thanks Dennis. 

 

NEXT: Engine Exhaust metal, I'd really like to know how to approach and do this as I think it'll look great if I get it right. Have a look at the photos of the B-2 on google. 

 

Also if anybody has built the B-2 before, your help and tips would be greatly appreciated. 

 

Thanks

[corsaircorp]

Hello Ethan,

Did you ever used the oïl paints ??

Best way to achieve a good jet exhaust with what was at hand is thin layer of burned metal.

Then when your paint is thoroughly dried, start with oïl paints.

Choose a good brand for a best result Like Rembrandt or Windsor & Newton.

I use rectified turpentine as a thinner/cleaner, some other used white spirit but it's more agressive.

You must have Cobalt blue hue and lemon yellow, Raw umber and sooth black

Have a flat #1 brush and another3 O one !

Advice !! Save that 2 brushes for oïl paint only !

With the thin brush take a TINY bit of oïl paint place it at the point you need to enhance !

Then with the flat brush expand the paint with the shape you want to achieve.

THIS is not properly a painting, the goal is to have a chromatic effect

With raw umber, the metal will look burned in some Brown shades

At the root of the jet pipe you will have a kinda like yellowish burned effect with the yellow pant.

And the blue seem an evidence.

Be always light when work with oïl paint, have a try on old kits or so !

Then you can make some washes, Highly diluted paint that can leakrd in the panel lines or so

Exhaust stains can be reproduced with the sooth black !

If you put too much paint, a soft clothe with a bit of turpentine and all is cleaned up.

Give it a try... And let me know if you need an advice,

Have a look at any of my RFI, I used this technique for more than 30 years !

Hope that it help.

Sincerely.

Corsaircorp

[Space Ranger]

12 hours ago, EthanGreen123 said:

I'll just use micro set(the blue one) before and after applying the decal and then spray a clear coat and hopefully that will seal it.

You really should use Micro Set in conjunction with Micro Sol. Micro Set is a wetting agent; that is, it makes your decal water 'wetter' and helps you position the decal in the right spot. Micro SOL softens the decal and helps it shrink down into panel lines and other surface irregularities without silvering; it is this that helps the decal better adhere to the model. Using one without the other is pointless, in my experience, and I've been building models for approximately 65 years. And no, I don't work for the the company that makes the stuff.

 

As to the angular panels, New Ware offers two sets of painting masks which should help:

 

 

 

 

And for anyone attempting to build this kit, I submit the following from Paul Boyer, former editor of FineScale Modeler and now a kit reviewer for that publication. He's working on a review for an upcoming issue, but in the meantime posted this to the 72nd Scale US Military Aircraft Yahoo group:

 

"Guys, here is the scoop: The new ModelCollect B-2A Spirit is 1/72 scale. I agree that $149 is pretty high, but realize that any new kit of this size is going to cost at least that much.

 

"I can’t give away all the info since I’m building the kit for FSM review, but I will tell you this: ModelCollect has a long way to go for improving their instruction sheets. This is one of the worst I’ve seen. The parts that show from the outside - basically the center portion and the wings fit quite well together and will make a sharp-looking model. All the cockpit detail they give you is wasted plastic and effort (both on the kit-designer’s and the model-builders part) as you can see only the panel cowl and the top of the seats when the model is assembled. The gear bays and bomb bay interiors are OK, not great. But those instructions! Poor illustrations with no explanations, no coloring guide - a clear case of the right hand not knowing what the left has given it. Far cry from the marvelous instructions from the new Airfix and standard Tamiya. It all goes south when building the interior components and trying to figure out which pieces go where and how they should sit in the main airframe. Lots of test fitting and flipping around. No precise-fitting parts anywhere in the interior. Aaargh!

 

"My overall impression is that this kit is half baked - rushed. A better company would have sent the test shots back with instructions to add pins and slots, alignment tabs, and fit refinements. Even the instructions for the excellent TwoBobs/Cartograf decals were missing number codes. Sure it looks fine now, but this one is trouble. Full story in the July FSM."

 

Good luck! you're gonna need it. I'll stick with my Testors kit.

[EthanGreen123]

Luckily I'll be building mine in flight with bomb bay doors closed! I think it'll look great. Unfortunately those B-2 masks are unavailable in the UK. I don't mind masking myself, it will just be a very long tricky process. 

[Space Ranger]

39 minutes ago, EthanGreen123 said:

Unfortunately those B-2 masks are unavailable in the UK. I don't mind masking myself, it will just be a very long tricky process. 

Those masks are available directly from New Ware (I don't work for them either, but I highly recommend their products):

 

http://mek.kosmo.cz/newware/indexmasks.htm

[k5054nz]

@EthanGreen123, if you haven't already, I suggest you post a thread at the Aircraft Resource Centre (ARC) forum as it's a much more US-centric audience who may be able to help with references etc.

[EthanGreen123]

7 hours ago, Space Ranger said:

Those masks are available directly from New Ware (I don't work for them either, but I highly recommend their products):

 

http://mek.kosmo.cz/newware/indexmasks.htm

Yes, but they are based in the Czech Republic...

 

I've just posted a thread in the ARC, thanks. 

 

Does anybody know how I would achieve the finish on the engines like this one: https://modelingmadness.com/review/mod/us/usaf/mlpb2.htm

[EthanGreen123]

Build is going very well! Completed the construction and 99% went really well, apart from bomb bay doors, gear doors and cockpit fitting which all needed quite a bit of adjustment but got there in the end! Now onto painting... I've got the right shades of grey down very well so at least I know which colours to use, now masking...