Help me decide which 1/48 F-16C or C+ to build

[planehazza]

My big goal is to make a 1/48 Viper and put all my efforts and passion to the test. It's my favourite jet and I have spent thousands of hours flying it virtually with the Viper Drivers VFS in Falcon BMS 4.33.

 

I'm tempted to build a few, and would love to build a modern CCIP USAF blk50 C, as well as perhaps a HAF blk52 C+ with CFTs.  

 

Tamiya to me seems to be the immediate choice, but in the long run I'd like a good kit that will have all the detail/good fit of the Tamiya range, but with the CFTs for the Greek stuff.  

 

What other kits would you recommend for detail and build quality?  1/48 for the 'main' viper is a must, but I'd be happy with a small fleet of 1/72 variants, such as agressors, ROKAF Vs etc.

 

Thanks!

[Fernando]

Hi, planehazza,

 

In 1/48 go no further. Get the Tamiya kit and just build what they propose. Keep in mind they are very detail-specific to the individual airframes they are depicting in their decal sheet.

 

There is no other F-16 kit with the "detail/good fit of the Tamiya range" (of any subject!). If you really need a spine/CFT equipped model, you have to add tons of resin aftermarket (of dubious fit) or risk a Kinetic kit (in itself not an impossible proposition, but not so well detailed/good fitting)

 

In 1/72nd, the Tamiya again rules for a C Blk 50; again, the kit is very airframe-specific for a USAF plane. The Revell AG kit is a bit more flexible but lacks some detail accuracy if building a C, though it can be coaxed into a Blk 52. HOwever, for a A/A Plus/AM/B and derivatives it still rules. The advantage is that the small scale allows fuzzier detail to pass muster; therefore, ill fitting or not-so-well-defined spines or CFT or relatively inaccurate small detail could look acceptable. Kinetic kits are reasonably detailed accuracy wise for modern Blk 52 + ships but they have a very imprecise fit (not to say they are real pigs -nothing impossible, though. I tried one: https://modelingmadness.com/review/mod/us/usaf/rol16d.htm) Revell's was a pleasure to build, instead: https://modelingmadness.com/review/mod/us/usaf/rol16b.htm)

 

Hope that helps.

 

Fernando

Edited March 27, 2018 by Fernando

[exdraken]

As Fernando statedm Tamiya all the way for single seater C model!

Everything else is a bit more complex...

There is also a 2-seater conversion from Wingman models for the Tamiya ones .

 

Arma hobbies/ attack squadron , now Hauler had CFTs for the Tamiya kit......

[planehazza]

Hi Fernando, thanks for that. I saw that 1/72 HAF kit.  Stretch that to 1/48, make it a C without the spine, and I'm dreaming   I'm of the minority opinion that the CFTs look really good, but I still love the standard slick Viper.

 

I think I'll stay clear of  Kinetic in that case. Your summary of Kinetic matches what I've seen in various videos where a kit can range from excellent to terrible in terms of parts fitment.  If I'm forever fixing and filling I'll end up getting frustrated ha.  

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

4 hours ago, planehazza said:

  I'm of the minority opinion that the CFTs look really good,

That make two of us ... I think the CFT’s look good on both F-16’s and F-18E’s & F’s as well. 

 

For your initial question Tamiya is great but id go with the Hasegawa kits. They're a bit cheaper and cover all the variants you want. 

 

Dennis

Edited March 27, 2018 by Corsairfoxfouruncle

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

Hello @exdraken ... Did i say something wrong ? You seemed confused ? 😉

[exdraken]

4 hours ago, planehazza said:

Hi Fernando, thanks for that. I saw that 1/72 HAF kit.  Stretch that to 1/48, make it a C without the spine, and I'm dreaming   I'm of the minority opinion that the CFTs look really good, but I still love the standard slick Viper.

 

I think I'll stay clear of  Kinetic in that case. Your summary of Kinetic matches what I've seen in various videos where a kit can range from excellent to terrible in terms of parts fitment.  If I'm forever fixing and filling I'll end up getting frustrated ha.  

You cannot fill and fix the Kinetic F-16 nose shape.....probably at all, so.....

 

Hasegawa... yrs mabe cheaper for bare plastic.... but when starting to add adecent nozzle, cockpit and wheelbay things look different very fast!!

[exdraken]

@Corsairfoxfouruncle

 

Wrong? NO!

definitely not about CFTS

I have a different opinion aboute Hasegaea F-16s though....  at least single seaters! 

 

 

Edited March 27, 2018 by exdraken

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

Fair enough I've built one of each of Hasegawa's F-16’s both a single and two seater. Had zero issues with both. Its ok I respect your opinion and Tamiya is a great kit. But since you have to add the stuff to get the Tamiya up to a Hellenic A.F. F-16 so i thought it’d be cheaper to start with a Hasegawa since you have to add to it anyway. 

 

Dennis

[planehazza]

Thanks for the input. When I was last in the hobby as young, naive, spotty teenager I thought that hasegawa was THE brand to have, but it's interesting to hear that they're not as highly rated, or perhaps I'm picking up the vibes wrong.  

 

Something, for me, that is an absolute no no feature, is raised panel lines.  To me, they look stupid, are not at all forgiving during the filling/sanding stage, and are very hard to get a convincing result when it comes to repairs.  I'll have to look through that thread I recently spotted that lists all of the hasegawa kits in great depth.  

 

Another reason I want to go Tamiya is that I don't believe I've ever built one before.  But, I gather by default being Tamiya does not always equal quality. I've learned since posting this thread that the WHOLE War Bird Tamiya series are all in fact rebrands, primarily from Italeri, which in the past weren't the best and have raised panel lines.  

 

I think I'll just stick to the traditional Tamiya Viper and go from there  I'm probably getting carried away with resin this and that as it'll only be my second model since returning.

 

 

[planehazza]

Do models get updates? Like I know manufactures may relaunch the same model years later with better detail and options, but does the same 'generation' get patched with fixes/updates? If so, how do I know when ordering that I'm getting the latest iteration?

[Corsairfoxfouruncle]

8 hours ago, planehazza said:

When I was last in the hobby as young, naive, spotty teenager I thought that hasegawa was THE brand to have, but it's interesting to hear that they're not as highly rated, or perhaps I'm picking up the vibes wrong.  

It really falls to simple reasons of personal choice and how exact the kit must be. Im personally not the Rivet counting type. I once was a rivet counter, it ultimately led to me burning out and walking away from models for 10 years. To me if it looks like a 🦆 and quacks like a 🦆its a 🦆. If it looks like an F-16 then its an F-16. 

     It simply falls to personal preference as to A. How much money do you want to spend ? And B. How much detail or accuracy do you want and are willing to accept ? If you want a lot of fine detail and have the $ £ € to afford a Tamiya then by all means get a Tamiya. If youre on a very tight $ budget like i am, then a little less detail is perfectly acceptable. I hope that explains my thoughts and reasons why i opted to recommend the Hasegawa over Tamiya. My apologies if its a little long winded or preachy. 

 

Dennis

Edited March 28, 2018 by Corsairfoxfouruncle

[exdraken]

1 hour ago, planehazza said:

Do models get updates? Like I know manufactures may relaunch the same model years later with better detail and options, but does the same 'generation' get patched with fixes/updates? If so, how do I know when ordering that I'm getting the latest iteration?

Yes, models are updated sometimes, Special ediations are relaeased containing additional parts, sometime new sprues are added and/ or others are taken out.

 

NO general rule there, sorry!

a good place for telling what is inside a specific boxing is the internet.... and here :

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10186544

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/search?typ1_c=102&cat=plamo&state=&sold=0&sortid=0&searchkey=hasegawa+f-16

 

 

 

Regarding the F-16 in 1/48, it is simply that the Hasegawa model is like 20years older then the Tamiya one and that technology has evolved since then.

Hasegawa F-16s are great kits, but the Tamiya one simple overtook it. (again, true only for single sear C models)

 

If you are really courious, buy both of them and compare for yourself! both can be built to a great standard
 

 

 

 

 

[Phantome]

12 hours ago, planehazza said:

Thanks for the input. When I was last in the hobby as young, naive, spotty teenager I thought that hasegawa was THE brand to have, but it's interesting to hear that they're not as highly rated, or perhaps I'm picking up the vibes wrong.  

 

 

There's never been and probably never will be a "THE brand to have". All brands have hits, all brands have misses. Ultimately if you want to build the best kit out of any model you'll have to do your homework. Having said that, it's hard to argue that Hasegawa isn't a top tier brand and probably still holds the largest tally of "best kit in X scale" of them all.

[exdraken]

hard to get it cheaper I think

http://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=HSG 07232

 

[planehazza]

$36 for the 61098 blk50.  Great price but a long way to ship and risk damage :/

[exdraken]

23 hours ago, planehazza said:

$36 for the 61098 blk50.  Great price but a long way to ship and risk damage :/

No risk, no fun!

 

[Uncle Uncool]

Hmph... Which one of the Kinetic 1/48 F-16 kits happened first, the C or the AM? 

I think the awful nose shape issue occurred with the C one, no? Or did they correct the nose issue on the AM kits? 

Edited March 30, 2018 by Uncle Uncool
A dead fly on the keyboard

[scotthldr]

The only two Kinetic kits that suffered from the hideous nose droop were the first batches of F-16 NATO Viper 48002 and 48004 the F-16A/B boxing. Both kits were subsequently fixed and if you were to buy any of these from a mainstream outlet it would be the updated boxings that you would be buying.

 

The original misshaped boxing's still turn up from time to time on places like Ebay and the various modelling websites classified sections

 

Personally I've built Hasegawa, Kinetic and Tamiya F-16's and none of them are poor just different, They all look the part and all build fairly easily, the Kinetic one is slightly over engineered but nothing too taxing.

 

The following were all built using Aires cockpits and exhausts

 

Hasegawa 'D'

 

 

Kinetic 'C'

 

 

Tamiya 'C'

 

[planehazza]

Very nice, I do love the HAF jets.  Did those kits come with the AM style tail base?  I think I've found one on Scalemates that would allow me to convert a Tamiya kit to HAF, but before then, this may have happened. I bought them by mistake, honest! Oh wait, SWMBO isn't on here, phew!

 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/vL5mYfKC2VTW1Lht2

 

 

They're predominantely going to be OOB builds, but I will scratch make the odd basic part from sprues and lead wire.  I tend to try and strike the balance of what I want against what I can be bothered to make. Thankfully, the Tamiya kit looks very nice, and in 1/48 scale, a vanilla build should still be very convincing.  No idea where I can display them in our two bedroom house!

 

Are the Tamiya detail up sets worth the money? Thinking about getting them as they're made for these kits and I'm a little disappointed by the lack of 3D seat belts; I was actually quite surprised to see an almost £50 kit have decals to represent them.

 

Also, I really like all of the RBF features you've added.  I was a little concerned about the HUD assembly, as the way the glass attaches to the frames looks very poor compared to real life, so I like the idea of putting the RBF HUD cover on to hide it.  Are they scratch built, are there RBF addons?

Edited April 5, 2018 by planehazza

[planehazza]

Couldn't stop myself; just ordered an Aires full cockpit set for both kits (25/32 and C/N aggressors) from hannants. 

 

Need to get myself some vallejo metal paints and a good modelling saw. The jlc saw worth the money?