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Terry1954

Air Cadets, 1/72 Sedbergh T21 Vacform

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Great stuff, like a few here I also remember flitting about in these contraptions courtesy of the Air Cadets at Henlow, summer 1974. Day of my solo somebody decided to jump over the cable, in terror no doubt, just as 'Take up slack' was barked by a particularly vicious flight sergeant. The result was a broken leg and immobility until the ambliance boys eventually bowled up half an hour later. As it was late in the day any further flying was cancelled.....had to wait another month, the chap with the broken leg was very apologetic, decent type. One memorable flight in a T21 was with Cliff Spink, 111 squadron Lightning pilot and future Air Marshal, on a very hot Saturday afternoon at Wattisham in 1975 while on an ATC station visit on the Friday. (He was also the CFI of the local gliding club at the time so I didn't want to make a complete a*$e of myself!...luckily I didn't, it was fun, plenty of thermals and very instructive, thoughtfully he even bought a sandwich box with him!)

Quote

The centre console between the seats supports the spoiler lever and associated cables, together with the rudder cabled which are fixed to the inboard pedal on both sides. The ailerons and elevator torque tube is also housed in the centre console.

That brings back memories Chris...lots of banging and twanging going on.

 

Look forward to progress Terry.

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9 hours ago, stringbag said:

I agree with the standard colour coding of the control levers as you correctly point out however many of the ATC T21s had red column grips and the spoiler lever in red.  This was not the norm by any means and several that I've been personally acquainted with have had red spoiler levers with blue cross bars.

 

Thanks Chris. I'm going with black stick grip, red cross bar and blue spoiler lever, and of course yellow cable release knob! I'll post some updated pictures of the Instrument Panel as I decided there was something about my original that didn't look quite right. The three dials all seemed too close together. I think my newer version will work better!

 

Terry

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9 hours ago, general melchett said:

Great stuff, like a few here I also remember flitting about in these contraptions courtesy of the Air Cadets at Henlow, summer 1974. Day of my solo somebody decided to jump over the cable, in terror no doubt, just as 'Take up slack' was barked by a particularly vicious flight sergeant. The result was a broken leg and immobility until the ambliance boys eventually bowled up half an hour later. As it was late in the day any further flying was cancelled.....had to wait another month, the chap with the broken leg was very apologetic, decent type. One memorable flight in a T21 was with Cliff Spink, 111 squadron Lightning pilot and future Air Marshal, on a very hot Saturday afternoon at Wattisham in 1975 while on an ATC station visit on the Friday. (He was also the CFI of the local gliding club at the time so I didn't want to make a complete a*$e of myself!...luckily I didn't, it was fun, plenty of thermals and very instructive, thoughtfully he even bought a sandwich box with him!)

That brings back memories Chris...lots of banging and twanging going on.

 

Look forward to progress Terry.

Thanks for the memory as they say! It's great getting all such tales recounted here. 

 

Progress will be made, albeit at a rather slow pace!

 

Terry

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Today's efforts, not much. Some "weathering" of the cockpit and test fitting

 

20180625_160059

 

The IP will be added after everything is closed up. I can work a better fit that way. Slight re-engineering of said Ip is occurring.

 

Then some attention to accuracy around the rear fuselage. The plans kindly supplied by @stringbag are an excellent source to check all measurements. The kit is largely very dimensonally accurate, except where its not! Tailplane and fin needed some attention:

 

On the tailplane. The red line is slaters strip, used to fill the incorrect gap, the black pencil line to the left of that is where new hinge line will be scribed, and the black hashed area is to be removed. As you can see, a wee bit oversized.

 

20180627_165010

 

With the rudder we have a height issue. Below you can see to the right where I have cut of the tip and on the main fin, added a large lump of 60 thou (I think) to re-shape things a bit higher.

 

The light pencil line on the added chunk is about where the top of the fin should be. It doesn't look much but it does make a lot of dimensional difference.

 

20180627_170737

 

 

Thats it. re-shaping the fin will happen tomorrow along with the tailplane re-scribing,  if I get time. Lots of other stuff going on at the moment, not least is the Airfix Sabre (separate thread) and some other minor  modelling distractions!

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Terry

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Like your attention to detail, it makes all the difference

Are you going to make a winch to launch it when finished?

 

  Roger

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2 hours ago, Hamden said:

 

Like your attention to detail, it makes all the difference

Are you going to make a winch to launch it when finished?

 

  Roger

Thanks Roger.

A winch to launch it ............ now there's an idea......😂

Terry

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The cockpit coaming strip was black. The leatherette covering on the cockpit sides was in a medium blue for many years and then changed to black in later years. The pitot tube was black and had a piece of string with a cone of dayglo about an inch long to show if any adverse yaw present in flight.. ATC gliders had two screw tubes in front of the windshields to attach horizon t-bars. These were black and screwed in place to teach the gliders attitude with the horizon in flight. I have never seen them used.

 

 

As a 14 year old I managed 60 launches at RAF Cranwell North in 1967/8 we had 2 Sedbergh WB923 and WG498  managed a 56 minute soaring trip never above 1,8oo ft another trip in cloud to 6,100 ft  6 miles downwind it was cold. Great build and stories the glider gets neglected.

Edited by T-21
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I remember fittings for Gosport tubes. I never saw them installed or used. Wait, that was on T.III's not Barges. 

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48 minutes ago, Ossington said:

I remember fittings for Gosport tubes. I never saw them installed or used. Wait, that was on T.III's not Barges. 

I'm not sure what a Gosport tube is, but I think this is a T.III?

 

20180227_173841

 

Terry

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3 hours ago, T-21 said:

The cockpit coaming strip was black. The leatherette covering on the cockpit sides was in a medium blue for many years and then changed to black in later years. The pitot tube was black and had a piece of string with a cone of dayglo about an inch long to show if any adverse yaw present in flight.. ATC gliders had two screw tubes in front of the windshields to attach horizon t-bars. These were black and screwed in place to teach the gliders attitude with the horizon in flight. I have never seen them used.

 

 

As a 14 year old I managed 60 launches at RAF Cranwell North in 1967/8 we had 2 Sedbergh WB923 and WG498  managed a 56 minute soaring trip never above 1,8oo ft another trip in cloud to 6,100 ft  6 miles downwind it was cold. Great build and stories the glider gets neglected.

Glad you like the build, albeit rather  s l o w!

 

Yes, the stories are good.

 

Terry

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On 6/28/2018 at 9:27 PM, Ossington said:

I remember fittings for Gosport tubes. I never saw them installed or used. Wait, that was on T.III's not Barges. 

No need for gosport tubes on the T21 or Mk.3. Instructor only needed to shout.

 

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Whisper was loud enough most times

Up quickly round then bumpitty bumpitty trundle

 

And that wasnt the instructor pilot :)

 

The T31 is pretty damned wonderful Terry but I think I may have already mentioned that before

 

Gosport tubes would have had to be on the 31s certainly not the Sedbergh

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We tried the Gosport tubes for a while with the srudent wearing a headset, but we soon gave it up because we preferred shouting from the back. One of our guys joined the RAF and eventually flew Jaguars, but when he was at Valley he came back to us a couple of weekends a month, and he turned up one day with his Mk2 bone dome and oxygen mask and wedged himself into the back of a Mk3 and somehow connected his hose to the Gosport tube. He flew a couple of circuits like that with one of our staff cadets who said he couldn't understand a word he had said.

We also found a set of the 'T' bars in the stores and tried them out but didn't find them of much use, preferring to use our own horizon references.

This thread is bringing back many happy memories, and a few scary ones.

 

John

 

PS. If I remember correctly, the piece of string and plastic cone was an official item and had a stores number.

Edited by Biggles87

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9 hours ago, stringbag said:

No need for gosport tubes on the T21 or Mk.3. Instructor only needed to shout.

 

Ah, I think I get what they are now!

 

9 hours ago, perdu said:

The T31 is pretty damned wonderful Terry but I think I may have already mentioned that before

Thank you Bill, and yes I think you probably did say that before, but you can say it as many times as you like! I think that was my first post here, to test the water. Glad I took the plunge.

btw if you are at Telford this year, you can see it in the flesh. I'll be with IPMS Dorset crowd both days. Hopefully this T21 will make it there along with a few others of my hand crafted efforts!

 

3 hours ago, Biggles87 said:

This thread is bringing back many happy memories, and a few scary ones.

Yes John, the memories keep coming through this thread. Seems so many of us had this "start to early adult life" experience.

 

Thanks again all.

 

Terry

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I sometimes forget how lucky I was to have access to this activity ( along with a PPL gained through the Air Training Corps )which led to about 15 years of almost continuous flying. It seems that a lot of youngsters these days seem to exist in a virtual world through their computers/smart phones.

Sorry if I sound like an old fart.

 

John 

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Further progress has been made enabling the fuselage to be closed up!

 

First the final detail painting etc to go into the cockpit.

 

20180701_10331520180701_103339

 

In the next shot you can see I decided to do some strengthening internally with good old Milliput.

I filled the main wing support on both sides with plenty and also padded quite a bit behind the cockpit rear bulkhead. You can't see it all in this shot but I know its there! 

The main reasons for this are that the kit plastic is very thin, and there will be external filing and rubbing done in all these areas, so didn't want to take any chances of rubbing through to air!

Also, with the wing support, I intend to drill holes down into it to fix wing attachment/aligning pins for strength. As with the T31, although on the real thing the wing support braces gave strength and support, at this size and scale, that will all be achieved through the main central wing join. The struts will go on after that.

 

20180701_103634

 

Then the whole lot has finally been glued together, with more Milliput used to help strengthen thin joints.

You can see how I have loaded the wing support and the join between rear bulkhead and fuselage. Lot's of refinement will be needed here. Might need to get myself one of @perdu's SIHRSC thingies!

 

20180701_11081020180701_11082120180701_111045

 

This next picture may alarm those of nervous disposition, but it shows the extent of rework needed on the belly!

 

The front keel piece I put in is buried under the milliput. The repositioned belly "step, is where the plastic card cross pieces can be seen, then right of that the next keel piece which will help support further applications of milliput, back to the point where the under fuselage is flat.

 

20180701_110829

 

And finally a shot showing inside, minus main IP at the moment, which will be going in later on.

The keen eyed will notice a thin piece of plasticard has been stuck over the front right hand coming. There was a little mis-alignment down the centre line which I didn't want to just fill as the plastic is too thin. This will all be blended in later.

 

20180701_111110

 

She's looking a bit messy at the moment inevitably. Lots of cleaning up to do, but for me this feels like a major milestone getting the fuselage together.

 

Am setting her aside for a good 48 hours to let everything set rock hard!

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Terry

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Looking good Terry

 

A new member of the sihrsc club?

 

I'm sure the rest of us will make you very welcome

 

😊

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Nice progress! Looks good! :)

 

Håkan

 

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Looking good Terry.  It's great to see the fuselage buttoned up. 

 

Keep up the good work. 

All the best 

Chris 

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On 7/1/2018 at 3:50 PM, perdu said:

Looking good Terry

 

A new member of the sihrsc club?

 

I'm sure the rest of us will make you very welcome

 

😊

Thanks Bill. I feel welcome to that club already!

 

On 7/1/2018 at 3:50 PM, Azgaron said:

Nice progress! Looks good! :)

 

Håkan

 

Thanks Håkan, it feels like some good progress at last

 

On 7/1/2018 at 10:22 PM, bigbadbadge said:

Looking good Terry.  It's great to see the fuselage buttoned up. 

 

Keep up the good work. 

All the best 

Chris 

Thanks Chris. Getting the fuselage buttoned up is always a good moment.

 

I'm focusing on the underside build up and correction at the moment. More photos soon.

 

Cheers

 

Terry

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More progress over the last few days, mostly around shaping the fuselage, mainly the underside. This is a step by step build up process, making sure to retain the under fuselage step which looks to be right on the aircraft C of G.

 

First a rough clean up of the first layer of milliput:

 

20180703_092745

 

Then start to lay in some card to help underpin the area behind that:

 

20180703_09391920180703_094838

 

Then a layer of Green Stuff putty:

 

20180703_095406

 

More sanding and shaping:

 

20180703_224017

 

Then some Mr Surfacer 500, then more sanding and more Green Stuff. This is about as far as I have got tonight. It's getting there.

 

20180706_215831

 

Some further clean up and shaping on the nose and also the main wing support. The rear part has been lengthened at the base. The kit part was too short.

 

20180703_095657

 

Then some decisions on getting the IP in. Decided the best way was to chop out the side pieces and slot the whole panel down in. This would give a cleaner fit and allow for some further shaping.

 

It looks quite drastic like this:

 

20180703_224111

 

But test fitting the panel things will look OK. It will all be smoothed in when its stuck in place, put will detail and paint the panel itself first.

 

Note also the brass pin now embedded into the solidified milliput inside the wing support.

 

20180706_21564520180706_215635

 

When thats all done, the edge of the cockpit itself will be re-shaped and cleaned up.

 

More soon

 

Terry

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That's a great idea for fitting the panel, I hope I remember it!

 

Ian

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Wow this is coming together well. Great idea for the IP as said above.  

This is gonna be a little gem.

All the best 

Chris 

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Laborious fuselage shaping continues, but couldn't resist a test fit of wings and tailplane and a couple of shots with her stablemate...........

 

20180709_08385720180709_08353920180709_083713

 

All is progressing well. Next tasks are:

 

Refinement of underside, and build/fitment of wheel and wheel housing

Completion of IP - I rebuilt the original as I wasn't happy with it. Will post pics before I fit that, as photographing internal detail once wing is on will be difficult.

Undercoats to Wing and fuselage assembly (wing won't be fitted till the end after final paint and decals)

Top coats

Decals (some homemade)

Final assembly (Wing and support struts onto fuselage)

 

Simple yes .................??????

 

Terry

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That is coming together well. Looks nice along side it's stable mate

 

      Roger

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