Red Arrows, Now and Then - Airfix Gnat and Hawk 1/72

[rob Lyttle]

Hi, happy builder!

Ref the Hawk - and the fins underside at the tail.... have airfix supplied them as flat plates?

I've been working with the Revell version,, and in 1/32 as well, and their's are curved aerofoil section which is wrong.

They should be dead flat.

Thought I'd mention, as it's a lot easier to sort before they're attached!

 

Looking forward to seeing you blast these together.

Lemme just tick that lil box below..

[keefr22]

48 minutes ago, perdu said:

Rothman's Stampes amongst others

 

Only ever saw the Rothmans team flying Pitts Specials, never knew they'd flown Stampes. that must have been entertaining. Brian Lecomber was also one of my all time favourite aviation writers/authors too...

 

Sorry Ced, major digression in progress! 

 

Keith

[CedB]

Thanks Giorgio - OOB, OOB

Thanks Stuart - more paint brands? I only have Lifecolor and Tamiya. Oh, and some Mr Hobby Aqueous. Colourcoats of course and I think they're going to be my choice from now on, once I've used up some stock (waste not want not eh?)

Thanks Keith and Bill Yep, just following orders:

 

Paint it white by Ced Bufton, on Flickr

 

Weird that they've highlighted the H34 area grey though

I've been lucky enough to see the Arrows a few times, the best one being at Bournemouth where you stand on the seafront listening to the announcement and then "Ladies and Gentlemen, the Red Arrows!" is followed by them screaming over your heads and out to sea and then breaking into the display - brilliant!

 

Tomo I won't be doing smoke trails, sorry - OOB, OOB!

Thanks Adrian - naughty of you, but I am doing two

 

Thanks Rob Are the OOB tail fins flat?

 

Flat bits by Ced Bufton, on Flickr

 

Phew! OOB, OOB...

[shatters]

10 minutes ago, CedB said:

 

 

Paint it white by Ced Bufton, on Flickr

 

Weird that they've highlighted the H34 area grey though

 

It's marked 126 in the new boxing.

 

 

Phil

[perdu]

I wonder if one dare ask...............

 

Could it possibly safe to ask........................................

 

Or hows-about slipping a question innocently into a valid discussion point?

 

Ced will you be leaving the wrong white bits of innards white?

 

Just asking....................................

 

 

EDIT-TO-ADD

 

It is marked 34 in mine too Ced, we know you did what they asked

Edited February 24, 2018 by perdu

[Beard]

37 minutes ago, CedB said:

 

 

25 minutes ago, shatters said:

It's marked 126 in the new boxing.

 

 

Phil

I suspect Airfix suggest painting the cockpit white because it's a Starter Set kit, they often suggest 'wrong' colours in starter sets.

[shatters]

11 minutes ago, Beard said:

 

I suspect Airfix suggest painting the cockpit white because it's a Starter Set kit, they often suggest 'wrong' colours in starter sets.

They only quote the four colours they supply with it.

 

Phil

Edited February 24, 2018 by shatters

[Hamden]

1 hour ago, keefr22 said:

 

Only ever saw the Rothmans team flying Pitts Specials, never knew they'd flown Stampes. that must have been entertaining. Brian Lecomber was also one of my all time favourite aviation writers/authors too...

 

Sorry Ced, major digression in progress! 

 

Keith

I believe the Rothmans team started with Stampes and were led by Manx Kelly with Stephen Grey, Brian Lecomber and one other I can't remember.

Sorry for the drift, great start on these

 

  Roger 

[CedB]

OOB OO proper, new B.

 

As it's you:

 

[The Spadgent]

Nice start Ced. 

 

John

[Biggles87]

Sorry I'm late chaps, still can't walk very fast.

Has anyone seen the brilliant short film of the Arrows made by Arthur Gibson when Ray Hanna was the leader. I first saw it as a 'short ' in the cinema, then later we used to get it at the gliding school for showing to cadets waiting for air  experience flights. I must have seen it hundreds of times, forwards, backwards and upside down. I have it on video tape called ' The Red Arrows- Gnats and Hawks' introduced by Raymond Baxter. I still play it occasionally, the soundtrack's good too but it's getting a bit worn out now.

 

John

[rob Lyttle]

I just finished my Folland Gnat. Done wheels up!

😋

Bit of fogging on the old canopy, I'm afraid. (No change there, then)

[bbudde]

4 hours ago, Tomoshenko said:

C'mon Ced, aint you working up a new fangled high-tech uber-technical way of reproducing the smoke trails...

 

Hello Tomo and sorry Ced. I wouldn't use any other scheme on that. Maybe it's because, that's the only one I know. Thanks old Airfix. But the best looking on that, imho. As I don't like the Hawk, it looks better in black than in any other colour for me . Anyway it's you decision Ced, what you will hang under your ceiling. Cheers Benedikt

Edited February 24, 2018 by bbudde

[Cookenbacher]

Wonderful start Ced, but you must have gotten some incomplete sprues, where are the propellers?

 

6 hours ago, CedB said:

MAC valve - it reduces the airflow not the pressure (huh?)

Pressure and velocity are two sides of the same coin, just ask Bernoulli (or maybe it was Euler).

Read on only if don't mind really boring stuff.

The pressure in your compressor tank is the Total Pressure available for your airbrush. When you press the trigger, that pressure turns into velocity in the hose - the Total Pressure is the same, but now some of it is Kinetic Energy (Velocity) and some is still pressure, confusingly known as the Static Pressure (that's how pitot tubes work - they figure the velocity by measuring the difference between Total and Static pressure). The air whooshing by the paint cup has a lot of Velocity but little Static Pressure, creating a suction that allows even siphon feed paint cups to work.

The MAC valve causes a drop in Total Pressure in the hose, the equivalent of having lower pressure in your tank, but without having to vary the actual pressure in the tank - you give up a little efficiency for convenience. What effectively is happening is that the air is doing some Work on the MAC valve (Total Pressure is converted to Work, and what's left over goes to your airbrush).

[perdu]

Good to see the change Ced, ta mate its nice to see one of your builds galloping along sonicely

 

Funny thing about the Rothmans Team Stampes, few people remember the Stampes but in the time they used them the machines had two, similar but different blue and turquoise colour schemes

 

This I know to be true because I made mine in one scheme and another guy made his in the other scheme, both made it into Scale Models in the report on the IPMS Nationals that year, very early eighties or awfully late seventies... (or was it into the IPMS magazine that year)

 

I don't believe either of us received an award of any sort sadly

 

They were both nicely done models in Class B(mod)😠

 

😕

Edited February 24, 2018 by perdu

[perdu]

I ought to mention about Brian Lecomber, Turn Killer is one of my favourite books ever

 

Still on the shelf up to my left in the modelling studio/library/office

😊

[Mr T]

1 hour ago, perdu said:

I ought to mention about Brian Lecomber, Turn Killer is one of my favourite books ever

 

Still on the shelf up to my left in the modelling studio/library/office

😊

I recently re-read 'Talk Down' after  a fair while. Still a good story and full of places I live reasonably near to now. I have been so sad in my life that I replaced brown with grey in the description of an RAF Hercules in my copy. First read it when my first marriage was on the rocks, from cover to cover in more or less one sitting. 

[Biggles87]

I also remember the Rothman's Stampes and Brian Lecomber is also one of my favourite aviation authors.

 

John

[perdu]

To continue taking Ced's thread in the proper direction my shelf is heaving under the weight of Turn Killer, Dead Weight and of course Talk Down

 

I think I have just decided on my reading matter after I finish John Sandford's Virgil Flowers series, been far too long since I read them

 

OK Ced, carry on mate

[keefr22]

2 minutes ago, perdu said:

my shelf is heaving under the weight of Turn Killer, Dead Weight and of course Talk Down

 

Mine isn't. Wish it was, as I've got all three somewhere, wish I knew where....

 

Yes indeedy, crack on Ced! 

 

Keith

[Pete in Lincs]

I've read and enjoyed them too. 

Keith, that pic from Odiham. The hangar in the background was used by 240 OCU

Puma's back in the past. I left there to go to Germany in August '83. Happy days.

 

[rob Lyttle]

5 hours ago, Cookenbacher said:

12 hours ago, CedB said:

MAC valve - it reduces the airflow not the pressure (huh?)

Pressure and velocity are two sides of the same coin 

I ain't got a airbrush, and I don't think I could cope - sometimes it sounds like a complete Hobby in itself.

But this reads like it's analogous to Voltage and Current .

 

@CedB, count your blessings with the grey plastic mouldings. I've endured weeks of bright red sprues , parts and paint.

Don't know how your fixed for choice of Red paint. I was using aerosol cans and eventually plumped for Rover Vermilion, which I think got me quite close for the Hawks. Definitely an orange kind of Red required.

There's a great walk around photo ref on here, by the way. 

[bbudde]

Hello guys. I really do not understand, what you are talking about previously? Is that toxic or is there a chance to eat this?

[CedB]

16 hours ago, The Spadgent said:

Nice start Ced. 

 

John

Thanks Johnny

16 hours ago, Biggles87 said:

Sorry I'm late chaps, still can't walk very fast.

Has anyone seen the brilliant short film of the Arrows made by Arthur Gibson when Ray Hanna was the leader. I first saw it as a 'short ' in the cinema, then later we used to get it at the gliding school for showing to cadets waiting for air  experience flights. I must have seen it hundreds of times, forwards, backwards and upside down. I have it on video tape called ' The Red Arrows- Gnats and Hawks' introduced by Raymond Baxter. I still play it occasionally, the soundtrack's good too but it's getting a bit worn out now.

 

John

Hi John - I hope the knees better soon

Is it this video?

 

16 hours ago, rob Lyttle said:

I just finished my Folland Gnat. Done wheels up!

😋

Bit of fogging on the old canopy, I'm afraid. (No change there, then)

Nice Gnat Rob - did you paint the markings?

 

16 hours ago, bbudde said:

Hello Tomo and sorry Ced. I wouldn't use any other scheme on that. Maybe it's because, that's the only one I know. Thanks old Airfix. But the best looking on that, imho. As I don't like the Hawk, it looks better in black than in any other colour for me . Anyway it's you decision Ced, what you will hang under your ceiling. Cheers Benedikt

Thanks Benedikt - has to be Red Arrows Red for me

16 hours ago, Cookenbacher said:

Wonderful start Ced, but you must have gotten some incomplete sprues, where are the propellers?

 

Pressure and velocity are two sides of the same coin, just ask Bernoulli (or maybe it was Euler).

Read on only if don't mind really boring stuff.

The pressure in your compressor tank is the Total Pressure available for your airbrush. When you press the trigger, that pressure turns into velocity in the hose - the Total Pressure is the same, but now some of it is Kinetic Energy (Velocity) and some is still pressure, confusingly known as the Static Pressure (that's how pitot tubes work - they figure the velocity by measuring the difference between Total and Static pressure). The air whooshing by the paint cup has a lot of Velocity but little Static Pressure, creating a suction that allows even siphon feed paint cups to work.

The MAC valve causes a drop in Total Pressure in the hose, the equivalent of having lower pressure in your tank, but without having to vary the actual pressure in the tank - you give up a little efficiency for convenience. What effectively is happening is that the air is doing some Work on the MAC valve (Total Pressure is converted to Work, and what's left over goes to your airbrush).

Thanks Cookie - interesting stuff (to me)

 

Thanks Bill, Mr T, John and Keith for the book suggestions

 

13 hours ago, Pete in Lincs said:

I've read and enjoyed them too. 

Keith, that pic from Odiham. The hangar in the background was used by 240 OCU

Puma's back in the past. I left there to go to Germany in August '83. Happy days.

 

Thanks Pete

9 hours ago, rob Lyttle said:

I ain't got a airbrush, and I don't think I could cope - sometimes it sounds like a complete Hobby in itself.

But this reads like it's analogous to Voltage and Current .

 

@CedB, count your blessings with the grey plastic mouldings. I've endured weeks of bright red sprues , parts and paint.

Don't know how your fixed for choice of Red paint. I was using aerosol cans and eventually plumped for Rover Vermilion, which I think got me quite close for the Hawks. Definitely an orange kind of Red required.

There's a great walk around photo ref on here, by the way. 

Thanks Rob - don't you mean "I ain't got no airbrush"? Grammar is important

Just seen your big Hawk - too big for me but some great work.

 

 

Bit hungover this morning after an evening 'Star Gazing', a talk from Dartmoor Skies at a local hotel. He's a great guy and really knows his stuff.

Of course it was cold outside and so I had to have a few drams to warm up again...

 

[Pete in Lincs]

2 hours ago, CedB said:

Grammar is important

So is Grandpa!

I should know, I are one.