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Gambrinus

MiG-23 lower surface colours

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Hi all.

 

I am working on a couple of Trumpeter MiG-23's and have come across a peculiar (to me) thing. In some cases the lower fuselage seems to be painted in two colours. The front 2/3 in one colour and the rear 1/3 in another colour. The front colour appears to be the usual blue-grey, while the rear is more of a pale blue. In fact I have a pot of each from Xtracolor, named as Czech colours.

 

What puzzles me is why this was done, was it done by all variants and by all user countries?

 

I would be very interested to learn more about this, and any help will be greatly appreciated.

 

Cheers

Christian

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that could have to do with the fact that most Soviet planes were kept in the outside and only the cockpit part was covered from the elements usually. The mid section probably being better protectde by the wing....

 

could be wrong though!

 

any pics?

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5 minutes ago, exdraken said:

only the cockpit part was covered from the elements usually

....as in this pic wot I took of a Su-27 at the Monino Officers Academy.....

 

day02_01.jpg

 

So the front fuselage colour tends to be brighter (less faded) than the rest of the airframe.

 

Ken

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Thanks so far, guys.

 

The demarcation line is just to the rear of the centerline pylon.

I attach a couple of pics.

 

I hope I am not violating any copyrights. If so, please let me know, and I shall remove the pics right away.

 

888-8.jpg

 

The far one:

 

Valka.cz

Skupinovka-bedny.jpg

 

Valka.cz

650_800_image1105114591.JPG

 

Cheers

Christian

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good question.....

 

but see here:

RVCzVDhxWNWoOTqqniY7fH50gQ9BxNLD507rKIuc

https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/comments/6c9dat/czechoslovakian_air_force_mig_23_floggers/

 

 

maybe it was some unpainted / heat resistant paint for the engine area by some users?

 

see this Hungarian plane:

MiG-23MF,Hungarian_Air_Force_Lofting.jpg

https://www.skytamer.com/MiG/MiG-23MF,Hungarian_Air_Force_Lofting.jpg

 

Edited by exdraken

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From how it looks; the forward part of the aircraft is definitely a different color. Notice that the undersides of the wings are in the same shade of blue-grey as the fuselage forward of the centerline pylon. Any covering would end at the wing. The forward color should show a variation if that were the case. My understanding(which could be wrong) is that the rear fuselage was painted in a different color because of the heat generated by the engine. The paint industries in the WARPACT nations had trouble formulating a Lt. Blue that could keep its color; but, found that a Lt. Grey didn't fade/show damage. At least, that is what a lot of the references available to me in the 80's-early 90's mentioned. Perhaps one of our Russian/Ukrainian/Belarussian members can help shed more light on this. This is still an area where good information is limited. Perhaps the good people at AKAN could help? I have some MiG-23/27 kits that could use that info. I have those Xtracolor paints, too.

Joe

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40 minutes ago, JPuente54 said:

Perhaps one of our Russian/Ukrainian/Belarussian members can help shed more light on this. This is still an area where good information is limited

Maybe and help........when I read all 43 pages this topic:

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_17723_start_640.html

Some MiG-23/27 really have two shadow blue, but I don't remember why.

My need fresh my mind and read topic.

 

B.R.

Serge

 

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I have read all 43 pages a topic about MiG-23 there is nothing on the matter!

:(


But is in this topic:

;)

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_49579_start_20.html

write:

"A difference in shades of paint are caused by the fact that according to documentation the lower part of the fuselage was recommended to be painted AK-5178M enamel blue to shp.20, and further EP-140 enamel blue on No. sample... (color compound, unlike factory AK-5178M color). Application of the enamel  various brands when coloring "paunch" of hundred is connected with the fact that EP-140 has more high resistance to influence of operational liquids, than AK-5178M."

Still discussion here:

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50763&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=80http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50763&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=80
and here:

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42406&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=60

and here:

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_49579_start_40.html

and here write:

http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_54530.html

"recommended to be painted AK-5178M and further EP-140 enamel was standard for MiG-23,  MiG-25 & Su-17".

And if read other topic standard for MiG-27 too!

 

B.R.

Serge

 

For the first time probably the difference in coloring has been shown in this drawing:
00051.jpg
There below are text charts in Russian where the difference in coloring is specified.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Floggerman said:

Heat resistant colour on ML.

Heat resistant? But how? As bottom
the fuselage can be a heat and the top can't? :)

It contradicts such science as thermodynamics! ;)
And here the fact that liquid following aspires down sir Newton confirms the law of gravitation! ;)
Generally, about heat resistant it is city legends.

Why painted only a part the fuselage but not all? As option enamel EP-140 (ЭП-140) cost more money than enamel AK-5178M.
It is simple to paint EP-140 all plane of this enamel it was economically inexpedient.

 

B.w. AK-5178M & EP-140 it's name type enamel as Humbrol or Du Point e.t.c.

 

B.R.

Serge

Edited by Aardvark

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On 11. 3. 2018 at 2:06 PM, Aardvark said:

Heat resistant? But how? As bottom
the fuselage can be a heat and the top can't? :)

It contradicts such science as thermodynamics! ;)
And here the fact that liquid following aspires down sir Newton confirms the law of gravitation! ;)
Generally, about heat resistant it is city legends.

Why painted only a part the fuselage but not all? As option enamel EP-140 (ЭП-140) cost more money than enamel AK-5178M.
It is simple to paint EP-140 all plane of this enamel it was economically inexpedient.

 

B.w. AK-5178M & EP-140 it's name type enamel as Humbrol or Du Point e.t.c.

 

B.R.

Serge

 

On 11. 3. 2018 at 4:04 PM, Floggerman said:

Wow, a scientist. Any explanation for the same on Su-22, MiG-25...?

EP-140 color is resistant to fuel and hydraulic . It is more expensive and therefore used only on the surface where it was needed. It's also seen on Mig-29.Other colors were  alkyd-acrylic AC-1115  and these PL-6 and AMG 10-damaging.

Sukhoi used a different type of color.

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I am not an expert on military(all services) paints; but, the pigments used for the greens, browns, tans, etc. for the upper surfaces are better(for whatever reason), or, more resistant to the heat generated by the aircraft's engine than the blues made by the Soviet Union, and other WARPACT nations. Most likely as they are darker; they can radiate the heat better than lighter colors. Also, notice that the horizontal stabilizers/elevators are in the blue-grey/Lt. Blue/Med. Blue(choose one) color of the forward fuselage. harvy5 mentions that EP-140 is resistant to fuel and hydraulic fluid(s); and, is more expensive. That is why it used for just a portion of the MiG's fuselage. Someone who knows the chemistry of paint could provide great insight here. This is one of the more interesting threads in this forum. I am probably wrong in some(or all) of what I just posted. Here's where I would be happy to shown why. The links above can be a bit hard(for me) to follow; the English translation(by Google) isn't the best. Again, much of what I learned about the schemes is based on info known/guessed at in the 80's and early 90's. I have the Squadron/Signal "In Action" book on the MiG-23/27s. That is still my primary source(yes, I know it's limitations) on these two aircraft. Again, a very interesting and useful thread, I look forward to more postings on this subject.

Joe

 

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