Graeme H Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Coming to party late, please excuse the tardiness OK, having heard good things about the Heller 1/72 Sherman, went ahead an bought one on ebay back before Christmas and before the start of this GB, it arrived yesterday, so immediately got stuck in, trying to catch up. Now a warning, I'm no armour builder, I build aircraft, with the very occasional foray into the dark side, so don't worry about pointing out any huge mistakes I've made, or even little ones, as I know nothing much, and have no references at all, so after you pull yourselves of the floor from so much laughing, please let me know what I did wrong. First up the box and sprue shots, which is the same as @Foghorn Leghorn, I'm not sure, but hope I'm not doing the same version, but blatantly stealing some of his ideas. DSCN0920 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr DSCN0921 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr Now, first up, are the Instructions, which I am slowly getting used to, but have made some rookie mistakes along the way, I had originally planned that I wanted to make the b option, but I made the a front end and stuck it on , so big change and now i'm making the a option because iot's the only one with those flange thingies on the front, and also is the box art. So, the instructions call out paint numbers, but don't say whose, figured out they are Humbrol, then found the main green is 86, and I didn't have any, so went out and got some, my initial idea was to brush paint the underneath and rollers, but this new Humbrol is terrible stuff , has no opacity at all, so had to spray, and boy are there some rollers to do, in fact I cut off and cleaned up both lots, then found I only needed one lot, told you I was lousy at this, then found I had to turn them over and do the other side, good thing I worked out you only need to 12. DSCN0924 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr Now i'm putting on different fittings on the engine deck, and it seems you have to use part D9, which is the one for the wading kit, and I definitely don't want those, is it possible to use the D3 option instead, or are there differences in them? or on the other hand can I just fudge it? no one will know right? I have no idea if I will get this done in time as another GB starts tomorrow, but hope I chose something fairly straightforward for that one to give me a chance at this, and then there is the 737 STGB starting on 1 Feb, so I'm going to be very busy, but I would dearly love to finish this one. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Welcome to the Sherman party Graeme. Another 72nd Heller Sherman? Bring it on! Sgt Squarehead will be happy 1. yes you can use D3 instead of D9, that's what i did, see my WIP 2. We'll both be doing option A but I won't be using the kit decals, stick with the kit decals and yours will look different to mine 3. Be careful about the bogie assemblies as they aren't handed (see my WIP). And my WIP also covers the large pin that shouldn't be there on the inside of the bogie assembly that can cause problems if it has flash. Neil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted January 19, 2018 Author Share Posted January 19, 2018 Thanks Neil, I already trimmed off those large pins thanks to your warning, I probably need to go re read your thread to help keep the errors to a minimum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corsairfoxfouruncle Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 (edited) The one nice thing about Armor over aircraft (i predominantly build wingy things), if you mess up you can A) slap mud on it. Or B ) you can gouge out the area and call it Battle damage. Edited January 19, 2018 by Corsairfoxfouruncle 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Splendid stuff.....Neil's got you well covered on the kit, my spares box is on standby, so I'm fairly confident you'll get through this one without significant incident. Everyone who's built a Heller Sherman seems to think well of the kit by the time they are done with it.....That's not how I'm feeling about the UM kits right now and that's a fact! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 Well no one told me that these VVSS units would be so hard, took me at least 4 hours or more, and a bit of loss of some A Positive fluid after a scalpel slip, mostly there now, that's all I have to show for the weekend, pretty pathetic really. Now I assume as Heller don't call the return roller on the top as a different colour, these are steel and therefore OD, wait to be enlightened by the armour cognoscenti though. DSCN0934 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Yep, fiddly little boggers but after assembling a couple of them I hit a routine that worked, can't tell you what it was though, cuz it's long since gone from this addled brain. I de-seamed the bits one day and assembled the next day, maybe that's the best stress free way. However, you have succeeded in getting 3 for each side, whiich is something I nearly screwed up. I'm leaving the suspension off (inc the idler and sprocket wheels ) until the end, makes painting and weathering easier. Also leave the turret aerial off til the end, I didn't and it disappeared yesterday Interesting to see it being built up as per instructions, rather than darting around like I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 For all they put up a fight, you definitely conquered them, hope your injuries aren't too severe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted January 29, 2018 Author Share Posted January 29, 2018 OK, I have been plugging away at this again, boy it is trying my patience, so a question in step 3, there are 2 square things (Air Cleaners?) p/n D5 that I put on, but then on reading the instructions they are for option "C" only, doesn't seem to be any alternative for option A & B Is this right? as I took them off when I saw this, can always put them back on, as I see FoghornLeghorn put his on, does he know something about these?. I see that I have dislodged one of the axle things badly, so need to fix that up, didn't notice until I saw this photo. DSCN0939 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr Then in step 9 they show a part D7, which I assume is the exhaust pipes (can you tell I know nothing about Tanks), I could not for the life of me figure out how the hell that was supposed to fit with the really vague drawing, as I was trying for the outside, it was only when I went to our local model Group meeting yesterday, one of the armour guys put me straight, it goes on the inside, right? DSCN0937 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr and before I join the upper and lower, I thought I might add a bit of weight, not sure if this a done thing, but my reasoning was it would help it sit better on it's tracks DSCN0938 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr OK I lost one of the rear lights, it is so small There was no chance I would ever find it, but put the other one and the guards on, now adding the myriad of tiny little bits at the moment, boy there are a ton of them, and also sanding and blending in the end of the Barrel, Sarge you are so right, what a stupid idea, whoever thought of that needs to be drop kicked through the goal posts of life. OK need to get out of this Hedgerow country before the 88's come along 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 13 hours ago, Graeme H said: in step 3, there are 2 square things (Air Cleaners?) p/n D5 that I put on, but then on reading the instructions they are for option "C" only, doesn't seem to be any alternative for option A & B Is this right? as I took them off when I saw this, can always put them back on, as I see FoghornLeghorn put his on, does he know something about these?. f me figure out how the hell that was supposed to fit with the really vague drawing, as I was trying for the outside, it was only when I went to our local model Group meeting yesterday, one of the armour guys put me straight, it goes on the inside, right? Air cleaners. Oh, bo**ox! I'll have to look into that, if you're right then it's too late for me. However, as I'm doing a generic M4 I can live with it ... and that's one of the reasons why I AM doing a generic one. Well, that's my excuse anyway I expect the sage of all things Sherman (ergo Sgt Squarehead) will put us right on that one in due course. The problem with shermans is there's so many versions within versions it's a minefield to tell what bits should be where. Exhaust, that looks right to me, that's where my exhaust is, IIRC there's a small pip/hole that it locates into. Ironically it's virtually invisible when the kit is fully assembled. Yeah, there's loads of small delicate bits to put on, tweezers are a must. When you're dealing with 72nd armour there's a trade off between accuracy and easy assembly, this kit looks like it's the former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 If you mean the boxy bits under the hull overhang as seen here: Fit 'em. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 Yep, dem's da boys we're on about, the air cleaners. I must admit that I assumed they should have been there, I didn't realise they were only for option C in the kit. It was a fluke that i got it right, why would they be an option? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 I guess the others have the wading stacks fitted and the air filters would interfere with those parts or are not required because of how they are designed. Either that or Heller are a bit pants at instructions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: I guess the others have the wading stacks fitted and the air filters would interfere with those parts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted January 29, 2018 Author Share Posted January 29, 2018 6 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: I guess the others have the wading stacks fitted and the air filters would interfere with those parts or are not required because of how they are designed. Either that or Heller are a bit pants at instructions. Well damn, that makes sense, learning all the time, will put them back on then, great photo by the way, and your second line is just so true, no explanation for anything, I guess it's because they wanted to eliminate language and just go with pictorial, any 10 yo could cope with this stuff no worries, me being of a much greater age find I am struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 I dug my kits out to double-check.....Heller don't make it at all clear, but if you are not using the wading trunks you should indeed fit them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 Well, got into the fiddly stuff, but first I went over the instructions so far to make sure I hadn't missed anything important, well stage 8 gave me 2 little boxes showing how to paint something, paint references were 86 and 19 now that sounded familiar, sure enough 19 is Red and the part to be painted was B3, didn't remember that, so looked more carefully and in some bizarre Gallic humour they are suggesting to paint the tail lights on, and even suggest that those parts have separate areas to be painted Red. In the immortal words of John McEnroe You cannot be serious those bits are about 1mm in size, and I lost one of them, and I don't have an Electron Microscope or in fact any kind of Microscope to see if in fact Heller did mark them, I checked Neil's work, and he made no mention of painting them up. Anyway moved on to the next page, and fitted all the Hull bits at the back, except the missing taillight and refitted the Air Cleaners, DSCN0945 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr then onto step 11 all OK except I didn't fit the Machine Gun just yet as worried it might be a casualty., onto step 12 where you have to fit a lot of unnamed stuff, and it worked out 2 of them were probably headlights and guards, only I lost one headlight and guard, Now the more bizzare thing here is that Heller want you to drill 2 two 0.7 holes into the front to fit a bracket thingy, now they are really giving me the they gave us the end of the gun barrel as a separate piece so we wouldn't have to drill a hole , I just cut off the locating pins and added it where it seemed to suggest flat onto the front. Moving into the turret, they again want you to drill 2 holes 0.8 for who know what, find that out 3 steps further on, went and read all through Neil's build but being an armour modeller he skips over most of that, whereas I have to rely on some Illustrations, hmmm OK got the Barrel into the Mantlet after reaming it out a bit, then fitted all the Turret stuff including part C20, which I have no idea what it is, but again cut off the locating pins and just glued it to the turret Now the back of the turret has a join between the upper and lower that shows, is that visible on the real thing or do I need to fill and sand that. On Neil's advice I also didn't fit the antenna spring will do that right at the end, but now need to somehow make a headlight and guard to match the other side DSCN0944 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr So if I can fix up the headlight, will add some paint tomorrow before I head away for Model Show down the road, it's just on 720 kms each way so Friday down, Saturday show, Sunday home if all goes well 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEMPESTMK5 Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Good monring Graeme Very good job so far I plan to build one too .. Patrice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob S Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 3 hours ago, Graeme H said: ... before I head away for Model Show down the road, it's just on 720 kms each way so Friday down, Saturday show, Sunday home if all goes well 729 kms to be exact (or 869 kms if you go the back way and pick me up on the way in! ). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 The tail lights would look better in black than the red recommended in the instructions, the lenses were very dark.....If you think the Heller parts for the tail-lights are a pain, wait till you see what UM have given me, the lights themselves are just tiny blobs, the lens detail is on a miniscule seperate etch part.....I you not, they are utterly insane! PS - Was going to ofer you some help with missing bits, but I noticed you are quite a long way away, not sure it's entirely practical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 5 hours ago, Graeme H said: In the immortal words of John McEnroe You cannot be serious those bits are about 1mm in size, and I lost one of them, and I don't have an Electron Microscope or in fact any kind of Microscope to see if in fact Heller did mark them, I checked Neil's work, and he made no mention of painting them up. then onto step 11 all OK except I didn't fit the Machine Gun just yet as worried it might be a casualty., onto step 12 where you have to fit a Moving into the turret, they again want you to drill 2 holes 0.8 for who know what, find that out 3 steps further on, went and read all through Neil's build but being an armour modeller he skips over most of that, whereas I have to rely on some Illustrations, hmmm On Neil's advice I also didn't fit the antenna spring will do that right at the end, but now need to somehow make a headlight and guard to match the other side Nah, I didn't paint them up, by the time I've slapped some mud on the Sherman you won't see them. As you say, they're tiddlers Same as you, I've kept the hull machine gun on the sprue for now. Turret, I think the holes would be for the pistol port. Looks like you got it in the right place though. Err, I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the tools on the backplate of the hull will get in the way of the decals. If you can prise them off I'd suggest you do so. Either that or (later on) cake mud on the area to cover where the decals should be, but you might be caking mud there anyway to cover up the lights so you don't have to paint them However you could you add a tarp/stowage draped over the back edge of the tank to cover up that whole area. I'm in the process of planning/thinking about adding stowage atm. Generally speaking, leaving the pioneer tools off until after painting and decalling, is SOP (standard operating procedure) for armour modellers, as you're not an armour modeller this may not have ooccured to you. You're ok with the right hand side tools though, they'll just be fiddly little boggers to paint later on. BTW, there's nothing wrong with leaving a light cluster off at the front. Loads of things get ripped off during battle, a hedge, a piece of wire or some masonary might have torn it off. That's the great thing with armour, they get personalised a lot more than aircraft do and stuff gets added or removed at the whim of the crew. Actually, you could add a tarp or some sort of blanket thing over where the front light should be. Stowage is a great addition for covering up mistakes, been there, done it Impressed with your lifting eyes, they're tiny ittle s*ds and getting them on the model ain't easy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Update, here's what I mean about the rear tools and decals: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme H Posted February 9, 2018 Author Share Posted February 9, 2018 Well darn, I didn't think ahead about the decals going on, I should be able to get them off I only used Tamiya extra thin, and find if you put some more on it usually softens the join and you can carefully prise them off. OK, I found the headlight guard, although I don't have carpet in my modelling room, I have tiles, with a linoleum overlay to keep the paint drip from ruining it. I thought about where I could get something that would make a decent headlight, and remembered that a lot manufacturers put little blobs after the item being moulded to stop them getting short shot, went through a dozen kit, until the Dragon Meteor F3, sawed the back off while still attached, and put it on with white glue, so I could adjust if needed, a blind man on a golloping horse and all that. DSCN1194 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr here it is attached to a bit tape to stop it going awol DSCN1195 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr A bit of white glue to cement it on, and Robert's your mum's brother DSCN1199 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr I bought some of this Tamiya stuff to help muddy it up, interesting stuff indeed DSCN1193 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr and copying @Foghorn Leghorn idea, painted some on the underneath before I attach the suspension DSCN1198 by qfa_tsv, on Flickr Now to figure out what is a decent gloss coat to go over Humbrol 86 and get those pesky decals on 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foghorn Leghorn Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Tha's a cracking headlight, looks better than the kit one. Nice bit of lateral thinking What are the jet intakes from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Nice progress Graeme, nice idea for the headlight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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