silberpferd Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 13 hours ago, John Terrell said: With regard to the seat, the "alternative" option provided by Revell depicts a Schick Johnson seat. These didn't really begin showing up in P-51D's until P-51D-20-NA production. All of the P-51D-5-NA's had early Warren McArthur seats (unless modified much later in the field - both seat types were of course interchangeable), which were a carry-over from previous P-51B production. Note that, unlike the later Warren McArthur seats, this early derivative had a straight forward edge to the seat pan. Although some Warren McArthur seats are known to have been painted dark dull green, in all of the photos I've seen of D-5-NA's it would appear they were painted interior green, just like the rest of the cockpit. Hi all, In fact, it seems that Shick Johnson seats started to appear with the D-15-NA, as suggested by this factory picture of F-6D-15-NA 44-15581 I had made a thread on the P-51 SIG about 7 years ago about P-51s seats, and posted this picture using a couple of NAA blueprints showing why the front of the seat had to be curved, and that the cockpit pictures show 43-12102, this plane had a very unique gunsight, which we can partly see on the pictures. Laurent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourist Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) On 2/19/2018 at 10:54 PM, silberpferd said: Hi all, In fact, it seems that Shick Johnson seats started to appear with the D-15-NA, as suggested by this factory picture of F-6D-15-NA 44-15581 I had made a thread on the P-51 SIG about 7 years ago about P-51s seats, and posted this picture using a couple of NAA blueprints showing why the front of the seat had to be curved, and that the cockpit pictures show 43-12102, this plane had a very unique gunsight, which we can partly see on the pictures. Laurent Bonjour Laurent, your original post on the SIG was indeed what made me aware of the need for a curved seat bucket on P-51D's. I also thought the cockpit photos showed 43-12102 because of the gunsight but on the 2nd picture I think I see what looks like P-51D gun ports. If correct that would mean a lot more modifications than what was done to 43-12102, leaving 42-106539 or 540 as the best possibility. I agree about the SJ seat starting during the D-15 production, it is visible on captain Roscoe Brown's "Bunny" (44-15569) and a few others. Edited February 21, 2018 by Tourist Typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourist Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 18 hours ago, Mattlow said: Christian Thanks for your interjection. I like the fact that the seats seem to have had a slight curve - because I've done my straightening and there is a slight curve still present - so that's nice and prototypical So does John's photo show a 'subtly curved' seat front (hidden by the ding?). Matt Hi Matt, great start on your build! To be clear, the 2 stage curve variation is just a theory of mine and needs to be verified. There are very few period pictures showing the seat pan so I also look at surviving Mustangs and restorations (which are not always good sources for historical accuracy). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 20, 2018 Author Share Posted February 20, 2018 Before proceeding with my build, I just wanted to point anyone with an interest in the intricacies of the P-51D to this thread: Olivier's thread is a gold mine of reference and details and becoming more so with each passing day. It's also a great build and in 1/48 is putting a lot more detail in than I'm contemplating in 1/32. His thread certainly inspired me to put my efforts up here. Go have a look.! Matt 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 20, 2018 Author Share Posted February 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, Tourist said: To be clear, the 2 stage curve variation is just a theory of mine and needs to be verified. Well Christian, like a surprisingly large number of things from a relatively recent time, we seem to know surprisingly little. My seat has a slight curve to the front of the pan... though once it's in the 'pit and has some belts on it I doubt much will be visible Thanks for your observations. matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourist Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) 16 hours ago, Mattlow said: Well Christian, like a surprisingly large number of things from a relatively recent time, we seem to know surprisingly little. My seat has a slight curve to the front of the pan... though once it's in the 'pit and has some belts on it I doubt much will be visible Thanks for your observations. I'm sure it will look fine with the belts on. BTW I was the one who wrote the bit about the wheel wells finish you posted on LSP. Edited February 21, 2018 by Tourist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 20, 2018 Author Share Posted February 20, 2018 Aha! Well, in that case I'll go over and give it an attribution. My wheel bays started off overall YZC, then they got overall silver and finally the masking job with the YZC. If I can be bothered I may pick a few bits out in the greens and maybe a little more aluminium...? I am going to 'cheat' on the wheel bays by having the inner u/c doors just starting to drop as the hydraulic pressure falls off. I like the look of one door slightly lower than the other that is often seen. Matt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plasto Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I have run with all YZC on mine.. what belts will you use?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 21, 2018 Author Share Posted February 21, 2018 I have a set of HGW which also has a resin life raft/seat back cushion. I usually use Radu's belts but these were handy... Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plasto Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Ok I also used the HGW belts... They look great when done.. I asked somewhere else about the life preserver cushion, The view was that it didn’t seem to get used much in the 8th AF / ETO. I’m not sure how accurate that view is. Nor if the preserver is applicable to D-5’s. Food for thought possibly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted February 21, 2018 Author Share Posted February 21, 2018 Thanks for that... Though there was plenty of sea between home and targets I suppose what degree of life preservation one of these would offer in the North Sea..? Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 Just a few update photos of construction... 'pit is just about finished and I may join the fuselage halves this evening. To me at least, the P-51 'pit is characterised by lots of placards - they're everywhere! I put what Revell supply in but it looked a bit bare. So (and don't tell anyone else) I used various 1/32 and 1/48 Airscale Luftwaffe decals to spruce it up. I went for general shape of placard. The very fine 'cable' is an errant dog hair.. I've added a couple of odds and ends to the pit but nothing fundamental (couple of wires, throttle linkage). Need to add scuffing to the floor before closing up... P-51D-5 37by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 38by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 39by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 40by Matt Low, on Flickr My interior green doesn't look as radioactive in real life.. At the back end I have finished the canvas boot for the tail gear leg (Plasticine coated in Superglue) and put doped covers over the lightening holes in the well structure (saw this in an image of an unrestored Swiss machine). Most of this will hardly be seen when closed up. P-51D-5 36by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 34by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 33by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 41by Matt Low, on Flickr I don't know why I did close ups of this as it looks like it has been sculpted out of dog poo! I can assure you it looks fine at normal viewing.. Still a thoroughly enjoyable build. Matt 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 One thing I am disappointed with is the canopy and Windscreen. They both have distortion that appears to be a combination of surface irregularity and internal flow marks (so no polishing out). I had a spare Tamiya early canopy which fits beautifully. I tried the windscreen as well. Handily, the windscreen will fit with a little fettling of the mating surfaces. I have now contacted Tamiya's importer and have a couple of spare windscreen sprues on their way to me (for subsequent Mustangs). They were £7.99 each, but if you think of them as aftermarket that isn't too bad (with £4.50 postage). Their addition really does make quite a difference, especially on that great big canopy. The windscreen sprue also gives you windscreen armour, two gunsights, rear view mirror, nav lights - so is quite useful. I'll post a couple of images later. Matt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antonio argudo Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 nice job Matt, that pit is looking really good, nice addition on the tail wheel canvas too, sure the Tamiya parts will make a difference, keep the good mate! cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 +1 from me also. That's a good idea about the Tamia sprues, the clear parts in my kit are distorted too. Looking forward to the fuselage join up. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 As promised, Tamiya windscreen and canopy in place... look at the lovely clarity... it really raises the kit in my view... P-51D-5 43 by Matt Low, on Flickr P-51D-5 44 by Matt Low, on Flickr The previous and following images show that I need to take a little more material of the bottom of the windscreen (or fuselage) to allow the windscreen to sit properly. The windscreen is sitting over the Revell coaming so no issues there. P-51D-5 45 by Matt Low, on Flickr Finally, the thinness of the Tamiya canopy (Revell's is pretty thin, mind you) makes it naturally 'drop' down onto the spine of the fuselage in the open position. This is a characteristic sit and adds to 'the look'. P-51D-5 42 by Matt Low, on Flickr Matt 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 They look great Matt, almost like they were designed to fit it, especially as the main canopy sits down onto the spine. I have a Dragon Mustang to finish and the windscreen fit is notoriously bad, I wonder if I could retro-fit one of these, it might be worth a try. Cheers John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antonio argudo Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 32 minutes ago, Biggles87 said: I wonder if I could retro-fit one of these, it might be worth a try. Hi John, I would say no, I have both kits, Dragon's canopy/fuselage area is way too wide, I can't find my windshield now to make a comparation but I really doubt it will fit! cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles87 Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 OK, thanks Antonio. The fuselage is assembled anyway meaning I would have to remove some of it, leaving the IP cowl " floating " in mid-air. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 10, 2018 Author Share Posted March 10, 2018 I've had some great help from John Terrell, looking at the stamps on the aluminium of the mustang's skin etc. Made up a 'scale-ish' replica. Printed out for a test on plain paper. P-51D-5 47 by Matt Low, on Flickr Just about legible... P-51D-5 46 by Matt Low, on Flickr Have to try on decal paper now... Matt 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedders Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 That watermark stuff is very cool! And good shout in the canopy too. Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antonio argudo Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 (edited) wow, that's a great adition Matt, I remember someone did this for german aluminum as well and got fantastic results, the wheel bays will look cool! cheers Edited March 10, 2018 by antonio argudo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 10, 2018 Author Share Posted March 10, 2018 Cheers guys. MDC did the Luftwaffe stamps... The Extra coolness is that in some locations (just like of Luftwaffe machines) these stamps appeared on the outside of the fuselage. So I'll sneak a couple in here or there. John's also pointed me to a stainless steel stamp which could be seen on the rub plate on the inner u/c doors... Matt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plasto Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 That info on the Tamiya canopy is solid gold... Good work.. I reckon you you could make a bit of cash selling those Alclad decals... Especially while the kit is still in its ‘rapture’ phase... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattlow Posted March 10, 2018 Author Share Posted March 10, 2018 So, after re-ordering the three different lines of text to a more prototypical format, I've printed a few lines of the stamps out. P-51D-5 48 by Matt Low, on Flickr Basically you have these lines A line which just repeats ALCLAD 24 S-T Another repeating ALCLAD 24 S-T AN-A-13 ALCLAD 24 S-T The above lines alternate until at what seems to be the 9th line we get ALCOA REG.TM .051" The REG. and T.M. are directly above each other (can't do that on this system). There are different thicknesses of alu sheet. .051" is the thickness of the wheel well roof and the outer skin of the inner gear doors. I have also run off a line of .032" (vertical tail skin), .081 (wing fuel tank covers) and .040" horizontal tail skin).. I can use these if I want to depict any stamped outer skin panels. Matt 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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