Airfix 1/72 Phantom FG.1 in Stock at Hornby

[iainpeden]

55 minutes ago, 06/24 said:

Had a look in my box but no stray FGR.2 bits, which is good as I want to build a Navy one. Can someone explain (or even better, show) for those of us who are hard of thinking, where the missing vents are/should be? I realise the Phantom experts are likely to wail and gnash their teeth but despite looking at a lot of pictures I'm just not seeing the omission. 

 

I'm not doubting the error btw, just am too thick or ignorant to see it.

There are 4 vents related to the intakes; 2 above and 2 below. Looking at the starboard side and working right to left; you have the splitter plate then the opening of the intake, the missing vents on the top of the intake, runs from front to back and is basically the same length as the rear cockpit canopy. Port side is the same and the underside vents basically mirror the upper. in 1/72 the vent is about 2mm wide and 10mm long - not massive but you know it's there.

 

The other missing vents are at the exhaust end. If you look at pictures of the back end of the Phantom you'll see that some of the structure is unpainted. You should be able to see a ring just in front of the jet nozzle, Just above where the nozzle meets the fuselage there is a small vent which is apparently missing.

[06/24]

The five black/darker grey squares?

 

image by jongwinnett, on Flickr

 

(Source image noted as US Navy, Public Domain on Wikipedia)

[Dave Fleming]

39 minutes ago, 06/24 said:

The five black/darker grey squares?

 

image by jongwinnett, on Flickr

 

(Source image noted as US Navy, Public Domain on Wikipedia)

 

Yes

[delticfan]

Spent an hour or so last night trial fitting the air intakes, the design is very good and with careful filing and sanding all seemed to fit well. I might need to glue them a bit at a time and certainly the intake covers would be best to be done that way so they line up with the fuselage. Hopefully spray the inside of the halves today and get them glued up. Trying to think of a better build order to suit painting but the instructions are pretty good. I might fit the spine section before the base of the wing so I can glue it from inside. Hoping someone is thinking of etch detail, canopy rails, intake covers, mirrors and any overlays for the undercarriage doors. Maybe resin replacement for the missing vents above the engine tailpipes.

[missile-monkey]

Thank you 06/24 for posting the photo. Like you I couldn't find them oreven  know where to look. I suppose they could be represented by decals. As a side issue if the RN and RAF machines had the same engines and were the same basic airframe, why did the RN Phantoms need the vents and the RAF ones didn't?

 

I've also had a chance to go through the kit parts and read the instructions this weekend whilst waiting for paint ( on door frames) to dry. I've also re-read the article in the November issue of Airfix Model World. I am really surprised at number of variations you can do from the one kit,  wings folded, not folded, slatty things extended or not and the axuiliary air intake doors open or closed !

 

Can I ask, what was the purpose of the axuiliary air intake? and were the doors opened and closed automatically or did the pilot do it manually? I've seen loads of photos with them open whilst in the launch position or parked on the deck of the Ark.

 

Sorry if the Qs seem a bit silly buy I joined the FAA in the early 80s once all the real fixed wing aircraft had gone ! !

 

Regards

 

MM....

 

 

[mcdonnell]

I hope I’m mistaken but I think the vents above the jet pipes are also missing from the New Airfix kit? They are evident with the Fujimi rendition.

 

[Rhino]

Missile-monkey. The FG.1's and FGR.2's both have the slots above the intakes, as does every mark of the Phantom. These are there to slow down the air going through the intake at supersonic speeds, as well as the variable intake ramps. This is because engines don't tend to enjoy supersonic air.

I don't know what the doors are for, they are exclusive to the Spey engined Phantoms, and I believe they are automatically operated.

Parts D6 and D7 are for the rear where the grill above the engines are, but as has been suspected, they are not there. Again, all marks of Phantom has these.

[71chally]

I believe the four doors actually have two purposes despite generally being called auxiliary inlet doors.

 

My understanding is that the bottom pair of doors are auxiliary inlets for the engines, but the fuselage side doors are for discharging spill bypass air from the Spey turbofan engines.

They are operated automatically and you see they are widest open during take-off (I guess for full power demands), they can also be seen open while taxying (but not always) and quite often they seem to be open ajar while parked and shut down.  

[missile-monkey]

32 minutes ago, Rhino said:

Missile-monkey. The FG.1's and FGR.2's both have the slots above the intakes, as does every mark of the Phantom. These are there to slow down the air going through the intake at supersonic speeds, as well as the variable intake ramps. This is because engines don't tend to enjoy supersonic air.

I don't know what the doors are for, they are exclusive to the Spey engined Phantoms, and I believe they are automatically operated.

Parts D6 and D7 are for the rear where the grill above the engines are, but as has been suspected, they are not there. Again, all marks of Phantom has these.

 

3 minutes ago, 71chally said:

I believe the four doors actually have two purposes despite generally being called auxiliary inlet doors.

 

My understanding is that the bottom pair of doors are auxiliary inlets for the engines, but the fuselage side doors are for discharging spill bypass air from the Spey turbofan engines.

They are operated automatically and you see they are widest open during take-off (I guess for full power demands), they can also be seen open while taxying (but not always) and quite often they seem to be open ajar while parked and shut down.  

Rhino , 71Chally ,

 

Thank you for that. Every day's a school day..

 

Regards

 

MM...

[Dave Swindell]

35 minutes ago, Rhino said:

Missile-monkey. The FG.1's and FGR.2's both have the slots above the intakes, as does every mark of the Phantom. These are there to slow down the air going through the intake at supersonic speeds, as well as the variable intake ramps.

The slots/vents above and below the intakes are the outlets for the intake boundary layer air. The vertical plate just forward and inboard of the air intake plus the plates  inside the intake were pivoted and could be moved in and out by rams to vary the intake area (and therefore the mass flow and speed of the air at the compressor inlet). The outer face of these plates is perforated with hundreds of tiny holes, through which the turbulent boundary layer of air flows, this is then channelled to the vents behind and either above or below the splitter plates, where it exits into the slipstream.

[Jabba]

1 hour ago, 71chally said:

I believe the four doors actually have two purposes despite generally being called auxiliary inlet doors.

 

My understanding is that the bottom pair of doors are auxiliary inlets for the engines, quite often they seem to be open ajar while parked and shut down.  

 

You could easily walk into the lower ones when the aircraft was on the ground and put a small dent in your forehead if you did not watch out when walking under the aircraft. Guess who did this a couple of times, you would think that I would learn after the first time.

[RobertF]

Just ordered mine from the Big H together with the Xtradecal stencils.

 

This is definitely the wrong year to stop buying new kits in order to get some of the stash built.....  but I'm not complaining!

 

Robert

[Rabbit Leader]

11 minutes ago, RobertF said:

Just ordered mine from the Big H together with the Xtradecal stencils.

Just curious... I can see why one would buy the Xtradecal Stencil set(s) to compliment the Fujimi kits, however why would you need this sheet for the Airfix model? 

The kit already comes with a comprehensive set of Stencils and I would think that like all Airfix / Cartograph sheets of late, they would be more than usable.

 

Anyway - as I said above, just curious.

Cheers and enjoy the build.... Dave 

  

[PhantomBigStu]

Odd one, airfix sheet is is very comprehensive and whilst I’ve not had a recent sheet, quality wise I’ve found cartographs easier to work with than xrtradexal 

[06/24]

If I wanted to do a Leuchars/RAF FG.1 at some point, what mods would I need? Standard length nose leg, vents as per RN version. What else? Was the slatted tail fitted to RAF airframes? I saw @Duncan B's post that the cat hooks were retained on ex Navy examples, did the RAF only ones have them as well?

 

[Max Headroom]

The non slatted tailpanes are good for the RAF FG.1. No doubt Duncan B will be able to answer about cat hooks.

 

Trevor

[Rhino]

17 minutes ago, Max Headroom said:

The non slatted tailpanes are good for the RAF FG.1. No doubt Duncan B will be able to answer about cat hooks.

 

Trevor

The FG.1's retained the slotted tailplanes. Basically, the FG.1 kit has all you need for a RAF FG.1. Note that the double extending oleo was locked, but still fitted. Also, a few slotted tailplanes made their way onto FGR.2's.

Cat hooks were retained as well.

The RAF FG.1's gained the ILS aerials included in the kit, while the RN never had them fitted.

[Giorgio N]

18 hours ago, Dave Swindell said:

The slots/vents above and below the intakes are the outlets for the intake boundary layer air. The vertical plate just forward and inboard of the air intake plus the plates  inside the intake were pivoted and could be moved in and out by rams to vary the intake area (and therefore the mass flow and speed of the air at the compressor inlet). The outer face of these plates is perforated with hundreds of tiny holes, through which the turbulent boundary layer of air flows, this is then channelled to the vents behind and either above or below the splitter plates, where it exits into the slipstream.

 

Just one small correction: the plate before the intake does not move to change the area of the intake but to change the angle and position of the shock waves before the intake in supersonic flight.

I know, it's just annoying nitpicking..

Edited January 15, 2018 by Giorgio N

[71chally]

3 hours ago, 06/24 said:

If I wanted to do a Leuchars/RAF FG.1 at some point, what mods would I need? Standard length nose leg, vents as per RN version. What else? Was the slatted tail fitted to RAF airframes? I saw @Duncan B's post that the cat hooks were retained on ex Navy examples, did the RAF only ones have them as well?

The RAF FG.1s were exactly the same as the Navy ones, but I understand that the extendable nose gear function was disabled.

The vents thing is the same on every British Phantom, be they FG.1 or FGR.2, as was the majority of both marks, Navy & RAF, gaining the modification to fit the squared off fin top mounted RWR from the mid 1970s on.

As Rhino says, after Navy service in RAF hands the FG.1s gained the distinctive fin mounted ILS aerials, and some got the ex tank sight that was mounted in the window port side between the two main canopies.

[06/24]

Thanks gents. Might just have to treat myself to a second one then 

[iainpeden]

19 minutes ago, 06/24 said:

Thanks gents. Might just have to treat myself to a second one then 

Just 2!

The minimum has to be seven:

RN round fin - Yellow Bird

RN square fin - Omega

RAF - camo - round fin - high viz markings

RAF - camo - round fin- tone down markings

RAF - camo - square fin

RAF FG.1  - grey.

RAF FGR.2 - grey

Then you get into the coloured fins and the specials and the subtle changes of marking!

[Dave Fleming]

10 hours ago, PhantomBigStu said:

Odd one, airfix sheet is is very comprehensive and whilst I’ve not had a recent sheet, quality wise I’ve found cartographs easier to work with than xrtradexal 

 

10 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said:

Just curious... I can see why one would buy the Xtradecal Stencil set(s) to compliment the Fujimi kits, however why would you need this sheet for the Airfix model? 

The kit already comes with a comprehensive set of Stencils and I would think that like all Airfix / Cartograph sheets of late, they would be more than usable.

 

Anyway - as I said above, just curious.

Cheers and enjoy the build.... Dave 

  

 

I was intruiged (and slightly bemused) to note that the RN stencil set was the third top seller in the Hannants chart last week. I can only think that this is people buying 'sight unseen' and assuming that aftermarket is always 'better' than kit. Certainly something that's not the case with the Phantom, as the decal sheet is superb and has far more stencils than the Xtradecal one

2 minutes ago, iainpeden said:

Just 2!

The minimum has to be seven:

RN round fin - Yellow Bird

RN square fin - Omega

RAF - camo - round fin - high viz markings

RAF - camo - round fin- tone down markings

RAF - camo - square fin

RAF FG.1  - grey.

RAF FGR.2 - grey

Then you get into the coloured fins and the specials and the subtle changes of marking!

 

19 Sqn had at least one grey one without the RWR..... just saying

[RobertF]

10 hours ago, Rabbit Leader said:

Just curious... I can see why one would buy the Xtradecal Stencil set(s) to compliment the Fujimi kits, however why would you need this sheet for the Airfix model? 

The kit already comes with a comprehensive set of Stencils and I would think that like all Airfix / Cartograph sheets of late, they would be more than usable.

 

Anyway - as I said above, just curious.

Cheers and enjoy the build.... Dave 

  

Simple reason for that, really: I saw the list with available decal sheets and got as greedy as a one-eyed dog in a meat market. So the brain cells shut down. 

 

Of course, when I later discovered that the Airfix decal sheet is very comprehensive, it was too late to change my order.

Now don't tell my daughter, I'm always lecturing her not to fall for impulse purchases and first do some market research. I think I may pipe down a bit on that lecture....

 

But I'm sure the build will still be great fun!

 

[Rabbit Leader]

4 minutes ago, iainpeden said:

Just 2!

The minimum has to be seven:

RN round fin - Yellow Bird

RN square fin - Omega

RAF - camo - round fin - high viz markings

RAF - camo - round fin- tone down markings

RAF - camo - square fin

RAF FG.1  - grey.

RAF FGR.2 - grey

Then you get into the coloured fins and the specials and the subtle changes of marking!

Im also trying to think of a similar list, however trying to just restrict it to five. I would also like to portray differences in aircraft configurations and weapons load out. I’ll just have to get one of these Airfix RN FG.1’s to build in Catapult launch mode, and a few FGR.2’s one of which will be modelled in maintenance mode to show off that great looking radar. Then there will be open and closed canopies and schemes to represent both strike and air defence Squadrons. 

 

To be honest - I’m really struggling. The more I research, the more kits it appears I need! 

 

Cheers and really hoping that this kit does wonders for Hornby Hobbies balance sheet - those hard working guys and gals all deserve it. 

 

Cheers.. Dave 

[Dave Fleming]

Reminds me of thirty years ago when the Fujimi one came out and people were ordering them by the crate! I think I built 10 of them in fairly short order!