German Yellow for Tamiya Jagdpanzer 38(t) Hetzer

[Lish]

Hi,

 

I am starting to assemble a Tamiya Hetzer, the instruction booklet is calling for complex camo scheme which I not comfortable attempting at this point and time with my skill level.

 

I intend to do a straight forward German Yellow scheme. As this is a mid-production tank, would this is an accurate colour? Can't seem to find information on google. it mostly comes up with the 3 colour camo.

 

Any advice would be great full.

 

Thanks

[Kev The Modeller]

I think you'll find this late in the war all German armour was 3 colour or whitewashed for winter, that said they were in most cases leaving the factories in either red primer or the various shades of Dunkelgelb (yellow) you mention and Rotbraun (red brown) and Olivgrun (olive green) .  The other colours including Dunkelgelb was added by the units often in the field in various patterns as interpreted by the units or crews, it also wasn't usual to see only 2 colour or lighter/darker shades of colours due to shortages, thinned or mixed with lighter or whatever colour they had.

 

I've found this very useful https://panzerworld.com/german-armor-camouflage#late-war  The three colour patterns were fairly simple and there were many of them, give it a go mate.       

 

 

[JackG]

There are ways of getting around to doing just a plain colour - it would be delivered dark yellow up until sometime in August 1944, but as Kev's link indicates, troops/workshops would paint these up before issuing into combat.   You can always do a post war Hetzer sitting outside a museum, in which case you don't even have to be concerned with getting the right shade of Dunkelgelb.

 

regards,

Jack

[AgentG]

This illustrates how even factory applied hard edge camo can differ from tank to tank. Also notice how light the yellow is in this shot. My impression has been that late war dunkelgelb was more of a pale tan yellow color.

 Photo taken from the web for discussion only.

G

[Kingsman]

According to some sources - such as AK Interactive - there was a very late war set of paler shades of all 3 colours, with a possible return to the pre-war Schokobraun for Rotbraun.  But I also know that there is some controversy about this.  Certainly the 2 Dunkelgelb shades in their late war set are very much paler.

 

I used these late war shades here.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235024862-trumpeter-e-10-aachen-spring-1947/

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235024817-trumpeter-e-25-alsace-1946/

 

AFAIK, factory-applied camo was rare at best and this is therefore an interesting picture.  I thought at first that this might be post-war Czech production as pre-war Czech camo was similar to this.  But they still have the early design exhaust and an earlier pattern idler, so that's very unlikely.  I do believe this photo is actually of Hetzers destined for the Hungarian army and painted in Hungarian colours.  These drawings from tanks-encyclopaedia.com are spookily similar to the photos, noting that the right hand one is a later variant.

  

 

As noted above and in many previous threads here and elsewhere, the shade and density of the green and red-brown varied tremendously according to the thinning agent and method of application.  But also due to manufacturing variations, especially as the war progressed and ingredients were short and/or poor.  It is often said that very late war AFV left the factory in red oxide base colour (doubling as red-brown) with the Dunkelgelb issued with the green as a camouflage colour.  These weren't actually paints in the conventional sense, but tubs of pigment paste for field mixing.  Hence the wide variation.

 

A plain dunkelgelb Hetzer would certainly be appropriate.  A plain red oxide Hetzer might also be appropriate, but might attract considerable criticism.  As would whitewash over both of these colours.  As for camo, almost anything goes for field application.  My E-25 in the post linked above was painted with cotton buds to simulate being painted (daubed?) with improvised paintbrushes made from rags wrapped around straw bundles!  Yes there is at least 1 picture of a PzIV being painted thus.  The official spray gear was very rare.

 

So don't be sucked into believing that your Hetzer must be sprayed with an ultra-fine finish using expensive pre-cut masks.  The real world wasn't like that!  Yes, the factory finish in the picture above would really need masking and spraying to reproduce: but if it is actually Hungarian as I believe, it isn't an appropriate example anyway.  Search around.  I'm sure you'll find a wide variety of examples.

[Kev The Modeller]

14 hours ago, AgentG said:

This illustrates how even factory applied hard edge camo can differ from tank to tank. Also notice how light the yellow is in this shot. My impression has been that late war dunkelgelb was more of a pale tan yellow color.

 Photo taken from the web for discussion only.

G

Agent G 

 

This is a very interesting photo and as you say does illustrate differences. 

 

From my own research what became clear was during the last years of the war everything was it short supply or even impossible to get for months/weeks at a time due to the inability to move it or even make it, allied air power ruled the sky's, make do and improvise was a must and become the norm.  As a result of this colours would vary from factories/units, sometimes even captured paint was used, mixed with whatever a factory/unit had giving rise to multiple shades of colour which again differed depending where a factory or unit was.  In reality what German High Command stated and wanted would actually not be possible in reality all the time.