Wessex HC2 Crab Cabs Pt II (Fly Wessex - why on earth did I?)

[huvut76g7gbbui7]

Having read all of the above,I just know that this big Walter will be sublime but as to what all that computertypepatter meant,I haven't a scooby l 

Lovely pictures!

[Ex-FAAWAFU]

Does the Shapeways print have to be the entire piece, complete?  If it were me, I’d remove the strengthening plates from the print, and leave the modeller to add them (in brass or styrene), thus retaining the scale thickness.  If the limitations of the medium (3D printing in this case) “force” overscale, wouldn’t it be beeter to leave that area out rather than compromise?

 

I speak as a complete 3D printing ignoramus!

[hendie]

1 hour ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said:

Does the Shapeways print have to be the entire piece, complete?

 

Not necessarily Crisp - it can be as much or as little as the designer (or me in this case) wants. 

I had considered leaving the ribs off altogether, but felt that would just be creating additional problems further down the line.  And as a modeler, I know I'd be pretty peeved forking out for something like that and then having to do more work to get it to look right. (yeah, yeah, I know... no comments please!)

After mucking about I think I have arrived at a workable solution.  After all, isn't everything in scale modeling about compromise of one form or another?

[hendie]

Back to plastic modeling today - but only for a short while as for some reason I had the hand shakes and couldn't hold anything steady - not good when you are trying to glue delicate small parts.  So I gave up before I caused any damage and continued with the compooter modeling instead.   But first let's catch up on where I got to since last posting.

 

I finally got the windscreen glazing on to diminutive Wessex. Hooray!

 

 

I thought it was about time to expend some effort on the big one - after looking at it for a while, I spotted that there are some openings which haven't been opened.  There's no mention of this in the instructions.

I'm not sure if etch has been supplied for this orifice so I may end up having to make my own.

 

 

Once the vents and other doobries are opened up you can see inside (at least a little bit) so that prompted the manufacture of some pipework to give the impression of something going on in there.

 

 

Duly stuck in place...

 

 

I also spotted that this little vent has a lip over only the top half so, cut some tube, stick it in place...

 

 

Then when cured, a sanding stick takes care of removing the excess.  I also added the GPU socket cover from some 5 thou brass sheet

 

 

Last thing on the big Wessex was to start preparing the back end for the fuselage going together.  The etch is just slightly oversize, so lots of test fitting, a few swipes with the file, test fit etc etc.

 

 

Then back to small Wessex again.  The canopy was a reasonable fit in terms of width and height, but I did have a small gap directly in front of the sliding window on both sides.  Nothing too major - and at least the gaps are even along the length - so the easy option is to use a small section of scrap styrene.

 

 

The edges of the styrene were painted black so you can't see them on the inside, then the gap fillers were inserted into the gaps and TET run along the joint.  Once that's cured a sharp blade should take care of removing any surplus white stuff.

 

 

 

So while we're on this part of the build, it seems a very appropriate time to quote Bill's earlier question...

 

On 7/6/2018 at 7:41 AM, perdu said:

No

 

I dunno, you have to tell us...

 

Okay Bill... what's wrong with this shot?

 

 

Oh yes.... old forgetful numpty moi has gone and glued the canopy on to the fuselage without gluing the sliding windows in place first !   

Some expletives were scattered around the basement for a while before I resorted to actually think about the problem I have now presented myself with. 

So far I have half a solution.  I can get one window in place... it's not easy but it is possible.  With a bit of care and bad language, a window can be dropped inside the cockpit area.  Then with some blue tac on the end of a stick, the window can be manipulated into place... and held like so...   (prime example of the shaky handedness I mentioned earlier in this photo)

 

 

Unfortunately you can't just attach the window to some blue tac and push it through the fuselage from one side to the other... there's a cockpit in the way.  You have to just drop it in any way it wants to go, give the whole thing a shake and then try to manipulate the window into position using skill, cunning and all that sort of stuff.

 

Once held in place by the cocktail stick, a very careful drop of TET in each corner of the window will hopefully hold it in place.  There's a few marks on the inside but nothing that can't be polished out without too much trouble.

 

 

As I said.... that's half the problem fixed - I still have another window to fit, and I cannot use the same method 'cos I just closed that window off!   Well, that's more fun to look forward to on another day.

 

Back to digital modeling.... some more time spent on the computer saw the upper swash plate being created.  It's a deceptively simple shape which gave me a few problems to begin with, but I think I eventually got there.

The frustum on top looks nasty - but that's basically a copy of what Fly have provided the modeler with.  I had to keep some elements of the Fly parts so this will fit together with the rest of their kit.

There's just enough clearance to allow the swash plate to rotate and as far as I can tell, it should all fit.   The only way to be sure is for me to order one to test.

There's one small issue though.... if I provide the model to Shapeways like this... this is how they'll print it.  As the two swash plates are joined in this model, the upper swash plate won't be able to rotate once it's printed.

 

 

So, for printing purposes, I've added three small stanchions.  This means the entire part can be printed at once (avoiding individual set up charges), and when I receive it, I can simply remove the stanchions and a quick clean up will leave me with a gearbox, and a separate swash plate that will be free to rotate - as I will be mounting this all on Ø2 mm brass tube for strength.

 

 

 

A quick upload to Shapeways and a test f selecting a few different materials tells me there's no issues with all thickness any more and everything looks good to print - provided the shapeways engineers don't get all high and mighty.

You can see in this shot that I also added some support for the jacks near the top of the gearbox. I may yet add more - this is merely to keep the jacks safe while printing/cleanup and shipping.  Once the gearbox is ready to fit, those supports can be trimmed away if desired.

and now it's time for dinner.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

[keefr22]

Model the ickle one's pilot's window open hendie?

 

Keith

[hendie]

I did think about that option Keith and will be keeping it in my back pocket if all else fails

[Phone Phixer]

I've been lurking in the background, getting totally gobsmacked by the skills on show. Time to step forward with an idea for the window.

Either:- use the cocktail stick/blue tac in reverse, stick it on the outer face of the window and wrangle it in the cockpit and pull out in place for TET application.

             or if the blue tac is not sticky enough for a secure pull, make a masking tape "tab" to hold with tweezers.

 

Keep up the stunning work.

Rob.

 

[Pete in Lincs]

What a lovely gearbox you have, Sir.

(I bet you don't hear that very often)

 

Sliding windows. They seem to have made the rain gutters on the top and front rather prominent.

However, I don't really remember the rear being much more than perspex (sliding window after all).

Can you not cut away any structure and slide the window into place?

I'll have to go look at the walkarounds now to remember how it goes.

[perdu]

I think Pete is right although I believe the back edge does have a metal frame, model the driver's porthole open

That way he can tap the ash off his fag more suitably than dropping it on the floor with the remains of his white box

 

The whole of that window frame should look 'slide-able' backwards, I'm not convinced 'taleri managed that but you have to work with what you got

 

I'd go the Tamiya tape on the outside route to insert the last one after you've cleaned the grunge off the port window's inside face

 

That 3d printing, looks like witchcraft to me...wow

[perdu]

Looking at the Italeri sliding window again, and less critically, it doesn't seem too bad a job, maybe a tad overemphatic

 

There's far worse things on that kit to carp at, so I take back some of my criticism

😕

[hendie]

10 hours ago, Phone Phixer said:

make a masking tape "tab" to hold with tweezers

 

5 hours ago, perdu said:

I'd go the Tamiya tape on the outside route to insert the last one after you've cleaned the grunge off the port window's inside face

 

That's the route I'm going to take, and hopefully remember to clean the port window before I fit the starboard side!

 

 

[hendie]

It seems like it's been forever since I posted anything of note, but checking back above it appears that 'extended period' was only a week. Funny how the mind plays tricks on you.

 

Not much has been done in the interim really. Mojo has been a bit wanting these last few weeks and traveling a lot hasn't helped, but I thought I'd throw up some piccies before I head off to sunny Detroit for a week.  On the plus side, I'm looking forward to getting back to a lovely little Lebanese restaurant we found there last time around.

To save you scrolling back up to see what I'm havering on about, and getting yoyoitus in the process I'll just repost the picture here again... Last time around I was harping on about some gaps between the cabin windows and the fuselage.   Coulda been my fault entirely but since this is an italeri kit, I'm blaming them.  My remedy was to glue in these bits of plastic sheet to close up the gap.

 

 

The surgery worked - here's litle'un with the ears trimmed back.   Oh, by  the way... the sliding windows got glued on eventually using the tamiya pullme tab method.  I did mess up one window but thankfully since this was a kitbash, I had a spare lurking in the background.  There is a bit of a step between the window bottom edge and the fuselage though

 

 

I tried to take care of that with some filler smeared over.

 

 

Though I'm not too sure how successful that effort was - primer will tell I'm sure.  Got her masked up over a couple of evenings.

 

 

While the mojo was wandering I didn't want to begin anything too taxing so ended up fixing the center overhead console - The rotor brake lever had broken off some time ago so I had to make a replacement.  The ball on the end is just PVA glue.  Some piping still to be added to that later.

 

 

Followed by a job I had been putting off for a long time - fitting the seats up front.  I had been having trouble trying to figure out a good fixing method for these since the kit location points are as useful as a chocolate ashtray.

Eventually I settled in pinning as a method - that meant drilling the back of the seats and fitting some stainless steel wire.

 

 

Once I dry fitted the seats in position I simply pushed a little bit harder and the two wires punctured the foil I am using as soundproofing, leaving two nice little tell tale vampire bites in the soundproofing.  I then drilled through the punctures and the seats could then be fitted.

 

 

and that brought all work on the big one to an end.  The good news is that the parts I ordered from Shapeways should be here by the time I get back from Detroit - if they are anywhere near correct, I should be able to start work on the big one again soon.

 

Okay, back to the little one again.... Anyone see any issues here? 

 

 

I tried revamping the (wait... what's with the recurring vampyre theme in this post?) the debris guard on the nose by removing the center section. (Stuck on here with dirty blue tac)

It does look better than I thought it would but there's no way it could be called pretty is there?  Another issue is that now there are only two vertical bars when there should be three. And that is ignoring the issue that there is a hole in the 'mesh' caused by a short shot.  Grumble Grumble... That's gone into the 'I'll think about how to deal with that later sometime' corner.

 

 

After all that, the mojo really went on vacation somewhere so I contented myself with piddling about adding little bits of sticky-outy things that italeri did not include on either kit.

Here, handles are being made from stainless wire.

 

 

Followed by lots of little bits of white plastic scattered in a seemingly random fashion (you can just about see the handle fitted just under the cabin window)

 

 

Much less blunderbussing on the port side though

 

 

I really need to throw some primer on all this to see what kind of a state it is in and how much clean up work is required.   Maybe next weekend

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Azgaron]

Very nice work!

 

Håkan

 

[TheBaron]

Frustummery and vampiring: this has all gotten most Gothic hendie!

 

(Why do I picture you looming over the bench swathed in black velvet and a storm playing upon the skylights?)

 

Both virtual and physical modelling of the highest order - an elegant solution to the classic 'two-part rotor problem' re:Shapeways btw!

[Terry1954]

This thread continues to get me all Wessexed up. I have been looking at these lovelies lately and wondering which way to go for my Telford project. 1/144 or 1/72?. Our club stand has a "Military in Dorset" theme this year, so am considering a Portland based Wessex of some description, or maybe a brace of them!

 

 

Decisions decisions.......

 

Thanks for continuing to inspire!

 

Terry

[Hamden]

 

More steady progress, both looking outstanding with ALL YOUR attention to the smallest detail!

 

  Roger

[heloman1]

Looking good Alan. will the MRHGB be available in 48th scale, it looks superb. You asked if anything was wrong withthe 'little Wessex'. Yes, I thik he nose mounted aerial construction should be slitghy to port not on the centerline. Otherwise both builds are looking great.

 

Colin

[huvut76g7gbbui7]

Here's a couple of the engine for you:

 

[hendie]

On 7/16/2018 at 4:56 AM, Terry1954 said:

Decisions decisions.......

 

I'd go for anything but the HAS - which to me always looked as if someone was having a poor joke at the Wessex' expense.  (now, that'll rifle a few feathers!)

Back from my travels again, Detroit chalked off the list, Illinois all but forgotten.

 

On 7/16/2018 at 1:33 PM, heloman1 said:

will the MRHGB be available in 48th scale

 

I'm not sure Colin.  (see later in this post...)  At 1/48 I may be able to produce a 'starting block' for folks who are willing to undertake a bit of scratching, but a lot of detail will either i) Have to be left off entirely, or ii) Modified in such a way as to meet Shapeways acceptance criteria - which may in turn end up looking way over scale, and almost as bad as an italeri attempt.

 

 

So, back home to find (not unexpectedly) oodles of work waiting for me, and all needing done yesterday of course. Hey, at least I won't get bored at the day job.  A little relaxation was called for in the shape of Wessexery. 

And... how did that turn out?

 

well sort of'ish

 

While I was being shaken to bits by Detroits dilapidated road system, a few packages had arrived in my absence.  To wit - a bunch of resin rivets by Masterclub.  In some areas the Fly kit is very soft in detail due to poor molding and needs something to lift it out of the doldrums.  I had seen these put to good use in Akira Watanabe's excellent Fly Wessex build

I also use Akira's website quite a lot for reference photo's - he really has a great collection - all taken with an eye for the modeler.  Well worth checking out.

 

 

This should be fun... these are the 0.5 mm head rivets, each rivet having to have the corresponding hole individually drilled.  In this case with a 0.4 mm drill.

 

 

and guess who discovered that they broke their last 0.4 mm drill a while back and didn't replace it yet?

 

So, onto other things then.  This time some more handles adding a bit of detail to the cabin door

 

 

Then after ratching about in the basement for a while  I discovered that there really wasn't a whole lot I could do so I fired up the compressor and primed the small one.  Surprisingly there wasn't as much clean up required as I thought there would be.

I'm not really happy with the front end of this

 

 

and it reminds me of this little mite from years past

 

 

However, from other aspects it appears more Wessex like.

 

 

The seam around the nose door needs some brickwork to close up some nasty gaps. I seem to remember stating Out of the Box - Warts and All - this may be a carbuncle that stays, who knows?

 

 

A few other bits were primed, and then I discovered that I also ran out of my favorite grimy flat black paint as well.... something was telling me to give up this weekend!

 

So in the absence of being able to do any quantifiable work in a forward direction I took a look at some other bits which had arrived during my little sojourn.  Let's begin by taking a look at Fly's offering...

In my opinion, rather spindly and weak looking, lacking in detail and missing some obvious features of the 1:1  (just my opinion though).  My fear would be that the trailing leg will not stand the test of time - it's pretty thin and Fly haven't molded it well and I think the plastic will be subject to noticeable creep before too long

 

 

Here's the printed alternative.  I've made the axle as thick as I could while still looking reasonably in scale.  The printed plastic is strong, but not tough.  Provided it doesn't get a sharp knock it should alright though.

 

 

I'm happy enough with the axle so I'll put that into the SW offerings when I get a chance.

 

 

Which brings us to the last of the printed parts, and probably the bit most folks have been waiting for (at least I was...)  The main rotor gearbox.

I separated the upper wash plate - my pronged attachment method for shipping worked quite well, then cleaned out the through holes with a Ø2.0 mm drill to accept some brass tube later

 

 

then gave it a quick squirt of primer and voila! some detail magically appears

 

 

though in my haste to see what it all looked like, I omitted to remove all the wax carrier left on the part by the shoddy wax removers back at Shapeways

 

 

It's not as bad as it looks, well, it is really, however all that wax residue is easily removed by some scraping with the back edge of a blade. The plastic is so hard it doesn't get damaged by the blade and the wax residue just falls off.

Comparison time again - I'll leave it to you to decide which is more realistic. (note - not all the extras have been fitted to the kit version, but I don't think you need those to see the difference)

 

 

and from another angle

 

 

A quick dry fit.... looks about right from a casual glance. That should fool most onlookers

 

 

and from the other side, lets take a look at the kit parts first

 

 

Sorry, that's just not going to do it for me.

 

Versus, the easy 3D printed option....

 

 

Doesn't that look just a little itsy bit better?   It does to me.

 

I will be redoing the solid model though.  What you can't see from these photo's is that the fit of the gearbox assembly through the mesh is very tight.  Possible but tight.  I'm going to redo the top end and remove about half a millimeter from the diameter at the swash plate, bring the jacks in closer to the swash plate by the proverbial gnat's curly and also make the jacks just a tad narrower.  That should give a nice close fit.

I am however keeping the height of the gearbox the same height as the height to width ratio looks pretty close based on the photo reference materials.  Note that the height of the cabin ceiling in the Fly kit is not the same as the floor lever of the transmission deck - that is level with the bottom edge of the beetle-back which is the horizontal edge you can see on the left of the picture.

I will add some spacers on the bottom of the printed MRGB to help those who will just be plopping it into position without any substantial airframe modifications.

 

So where were we then.... ran out of drills.  Ran out of Paint.  Need to redo gearbox.  I'd call that a modelers win!

 

 

 

[hendie]

Oops!  I didn't answer Colin's question fully.

 

If I was converting the MRGB to 1/48 it's very likely that I would have to lose or modify the 4 sets of vertical ribs on the gearbox.   I could remove the ribs entirely leaving just the mounting boss at the base as a guide for attaching new ones, or I could make the 2 separate ribs into one solid rib, though I'm not sure how that would affect the overall look of the gearbox.  The jacks may also have to change substantially in order to be printed - I won't know until I've made the modifications and uploaded it to Shapeways

I'd also need someone to provide some base dimensions for me to work off since I no longer have a 1/48 kit available to work from (no, I'm not stripping down the Hotel kit !!!)

While this looks okay in the Fly model, by the time I scale it up to 1:1 then back to 1/48, it may be completely wrong for italeri's version of 1/48

[Azgaron]

Very nice work!

 

Håkan

 

[TheBaron]

Glad that  you're back safe from Detroit hendie. Love your positivity in running out of paint and drills and yet ending on such a note of triumph! 

 

'Terror Fish' - perfect!

 

That SW work looks immaculate - almost sci-fi in form - and is a perfect demonstration of how digital tools can enhance a build. 

 

I hesitate to ask if it'll be getting Alcladded...

[perdu]

Since you can't really be OOB if you hack that stupid, ludicrous comedy nose filter about I would declare that bit a draw and the rest of the Italian job excellent

 

Very nice when we remember the junk you had to start with

 

As for the main rotor gear box for the big boy, wow and wonderful

 

So now you're going to fettle it a bit more...

 

Well I'm not surprised and must admit I'd leave it alone

 

(Oh arr, Fly did an acceptable tail leg this time, look at the Italeri thing but the printer did it better and nicer)

[hendie]

13 hours ago, perdu said:

Well I'm not surprised and must admit I'd leave it alone

 

I would if it was a one off and just for me, but since I'll be putting it up on Shapeways (eventually),  I need to fettle it a bit to make it easier for the average user to install.

 

[wellsprop]

On 7/23/2018 at 10:37 PM, hendie said:

 

I would if it was a one off and just for me, but since I'll be putting it up on Shapeways (eventually),  I need to fettle it a bit to make it easier for the average user to install.

 

 

I've only recently thought about using Solidworks to create parts for RP for modelling!

 

Impressed by your gearbox work