Watcher Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 A pal of mine who isn't a modeller (yet!) is making up the Trumpeter 1/72nd Wellington in the markings of a relative who was shot down and killed over Northern Germany. I promised that I'd buy him the necessary codes. I've already managed to buy him the wrong size (anyone want so very big red codes?). He brought the kit codes in and I'm looking for one letter is about 20mm tall and the other two are about 15mm tall. I've looked at the Xtradecal sets and I'm a bit confused. I suppose it would help if I knew what size codes were used on the Wellington! Can anyone help before I look an even greater fool than I do now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael51 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 I think this one might be close enough to correct. https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/X72212 What is certain is that anything listed as 48 inches in height is too large for a Wellington. One could always scale down to 1/72 in imperial, convert to metric and assess the size proximity from the other decals on the Hannants page. I would do this myself but I am an Arts graduate Regards, Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watcher Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 You and me both; any science grads round here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck1945 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 36" codes scale to 0.5" for 1/72 or approx 12-13 mm (12.7mm to be precise). 48" codes scale to 17mm. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 20mm = 20 x 72 = 1440mm / 25.4 = 56.6 inches 15mm = 15 x 72 = 1080 / 25.4 = 42.5 inches They should be 48 inch on a Wellington What size did you buy that they're too big? Trumpeter are known for making errors. If you can find a photo of the subject, or from the same squadron you'll have a better chance of getting the right sized codes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Most Wellington codes would be the same size, not two different ones. What squadron are you interested in - someone may be able to find a photo. Also the period - earlier in the war the codes were grey not red. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael51 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Black Knight said: 20mm = 20 x 72 = 1440mm / 25.4 = 56.6 inches 15mm = 15 x 72 = 1080 / 25.4 = 42.5 inches They should be 48 inch on a Wellington What size did you buy that they're too big? Trumpeter are known for making errors. If you can find a photo of the subject, or from the same squadron you'll have a better chance of getting the right sized codes I stand corrected. There were Wellingtons with what appear to be 48 inch high codes. Thank you, Black Knight. This is evident from a proper look at the Warpaint book. Also evident is the use of smaller codes, which I presume to be 36 inch versions. In that book is evidence too of Graham's observations: Grey codes preceding the Dull Red codes and codes of differing sizes on the same aircraft. On unpacking my Trumpeter Wellington 1c, there is a rather different interpretation: the red codes are very large and are larger than those in my collection of Modeldecal codes; certainly larger than the 48 inch interpretation from Modeldecal. Michael Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Even though there were rules and they should be 48 inch code letters, anything is possible Thats why reference to a photo of the subject, if possible, is always best If in doubt and there is no photo I go with what the rules said it to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watcher Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 (edited) The aircraft was a Mk III of 75 Squadron. X3396 code AA-S. Lost in September 1942. http://www.adf-serials.com.au/nz-serials/nzwellington.htm This links to a photo of a 75 Sqdn aircraft AA-K. Interestingly the letters all look the same size yet Trumpeter would have the AA smaller than the K? Thanks for your advice chaps by the way. M Edited September 1, 2017 by Watcher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watcher Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 I should also point out that I bought 1/48 codes for a 1/72 scale model. My only excuse is that I normally work in 1/48 th - other than that I just wasn't thinking! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 A google search for Wellington X3396 brought up more images of 75 sqd Wellingtons and they all have light grey 48 inch codes and red 8 inch airframe numbers There is even film of AA-J X3482 which shows it with 48 inch grey/ 8 inch red I doubt very much if AA-S was any different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watcher Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 BK, You are a star! Can you use some 1:48 scale red codes? PM your address if you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Thanks for the offer but I would have no use for them However; if you need red 8 inch airframe codes; rather than buy a full sheet, especially if you wont need them again, I reckon I could make them up from the ones I have PS; I just did a measuring on my 1.72 Wellington model and it confirms that the AA codes would be 48 inch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Slow down a little. The colour of the codes was not up to the unit, but something that changed at a specific date. So you need to confirm that the loss was at the same time as the photographs (the serials do hint at that but don't confirm it) and previous to the introduction of red codes. This last point is known but I don't have immediate access to a useful source, sorry, other than that they were grey in July 1941 instructions and red by July 1942. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watcher Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 I need to do a bit more research but I am very grateful for all your advice. I'll see if I can identify a photo from the same period (mid/late 42) and then I'll have to plump for one or other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Are we not overthinking this? AMO A.664 of 2 July 1942 promulgated not only red codes but C-Type fuselage roundels and fin flashes. Even allowing a period of grace for implementation, would not any aircraft not wearing those markings by September 42 be at risk of being shot at as a possible stool pigeon aircraft? A photo for corroboration would of course be nice. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 2 hours ago, Seahawk said: A photo for corroboration would of course be nice. And I can't find one in any of: Bowyer: Wellington At War Bowyer: The Wellington Bomber Cooksley: Wellington: Mainstay of Bomber Command Bowman: Wellington, The Geodetic Giant Freer/Parry: Wellington Squadrons in Focus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 If the relative was serving on the unit before July 1941, then he will have flown in Wellington(s) with grey codes and early roundels and in one(s) with red codes and the later roundels. If X3396 was his usual aircraft then the model would be correct either way. If you prefer to go with the examples in photographs, do it as pre-July. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Knight Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 I checked the dates of the photos, as far as I could, for the 75 sqd Wellingtons with grey codes which I found. About 10 photos. Not one was dated post-July 1942 I didn't come across any photos of 75 sqd Wellingtons with red [darker] codes or dated post-July 42 The next lot of 75 sqd photos I came across was of them with Lancasters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 10 hours ago, Graham Boak said: If the relative was serving on the unit before July 1941, then he will have flown in Wellington(s) with grey codes and early roundels and in one(s) with red codes and the later roundels. If X3396 was his usual aircraft then the model would be correct either way. If you prefer to go with the examples in photographs, do it as pre-July. Very fair point, which I'd overlooked. Like the OP, I think I'd be inclined to go for markings from a well-documented period, even if a pic of the precise aircraft hasn't turned uo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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