Let's Go Retro: Shaping and Scraping the Zeppelin Lindau (Dornier) Rs II (late)

[pheonix]

I generally make small models because I only live in a small house and do not have the space to display large ones. Stevehed introduced me to the DFW R1 in his scratch build a couple of years ago, and last year I discovered the Siemens-Schuchert Werke Rs I while looking through photos on the net. I discovered the subject of this build at the same time and knew immediately that I wanted to give one a try. Fortunately the internet has made access to information on these early types much easier than it used to be: in addition there is a Windsock DataFile (no 136) which also contains information and drawings, although the drawings for the machine that I wish to model are at 1/144 scale so I have had to enlarge them to the correct scale ie 1/72. My intention with this build, as it is with all of my builds, is to demonstrate what can be done by an average modeller with simple tools and a minimum of expensive equipment, and limited skill but some patience! I hope to shape and scrape my way to something that will resemble this:

 

http://1000aircraftphotos.com/Contributions/SavinCristian/8377L.jpg

My apologies for not providing a photo but I am not sure about copyright restrictions and I do not wish to bring problems to the site by using pictures without prior permission. Incidentally the figure in the bottom right of this photo in the Homburg hat is C. Dornier. I write "resemble the above" because the picture shows the Rs II in its final form with the engines in cowlings and a simple tail unit. I intend to model the machine with the engines in cowlings but with an earlier version of the tail which looked something like this:

 

http://flyingmachines.ru/Images7/Putnam/German_Giants/62-1.jpg

 

This shows the first version of the machine with three engines buried in the hull driving the propellors by shafts: this method was found to be unsatisfactory so the hull was redesigned and four engines mounted above the hull as shown in the first photo above. Both photos show the machine on a turntable at the old Zeppelin shed at Seemoos, Lindau on Lake Constance. The second photo was taken in May 1916, the first photo in November 1916, so the changes were made very quickly. I intend to make a small diorama based on the turntable and slipway in front of the shed at Seemoos as shown in the photos so that I can display what will be for me an outsized model. However I am sure that I will not have time to complete the diorama: I will focus on the aircraft for this GB and provide a build log for the base in the appropriate section of this site later.

 

Claudius Dornier started the design of his first large flying boat in August 1914 because the Imperial German Navy wanted to know what the British Grand Fleet was doing: in particular the Germans wanted to keep an eye on Scapa Flow which was the Grand Fleet's principal base. His Rs I design was a huge biplane with a wingspan of 43.5m: it was constructed from steel alloy using airship construction practices. (Dornier was working for Zeppelin at this time). This machine was one of the first all-metal aircraft to be built and flown, when most aircraft were made from wood and linen, and held together with lots of wire, but it was wrecked in a storm on Lake Constance on 21 December 1915. Dornier's second design was very different from the first and incorporated features which were to characterise subsequent flying boats from this team. They included a very broad hull and a low aspect ratio main plane which was mounted parasol fashion high above the hull. Although the first version had engines in the hull these were quickly moved to above the hull, and drove push and pull propellors. Small stub wings were added to the rear of the hull: on later designs these became full sponsons. The tail unit was mounted on booms which were left uncovered to avoid damage from spray when taxiing. The early booms were made from lattice girders but these were quickly replaced by stronger large diameter steel tube and the central fin was replaced by a pair of fins and rudders. The elevator was of biplane form. In the final version the tail boom, rudders and elevator were simplified even more and it only remained for the design team to change the boom to a single fuselage mounted above the wing for the basic shape of the classic Dornier flying boats of the inter-war and wartime periods to emerge.

 

Here is my kit for the build: it is not quite complete as I am sure that I will require additional items as I go along:

 

 

This includes basswood for the hull, plastic sheet of various thicknesses, assorted strip, wood for the propellors, brass rod for the booms and copper wire for the rigging. I will write the instructions as I go along as usual. Additional materials will be required for the base but that need not distract us here. This will be a large project so I have made a very small start already in the form of laminating pieces of wood for the hull, and plastic for the wings and engine nacelles so that I can start marking out and the scraping and shaping some of the larger parts. These will be the engine nacelles: they are three pieces of 60 thou card and one of 20 thou which have been laminated.

 

[ 

 

The hull is going to be made from 2 pieces of 1.3cm x 16.6cm x 6.3cm basswood with a sheet 0.7cm thick between.

 

 

The wings will be made in two sections from from three sheets of 60 thou card, laminated, shaped and then butt joined, reinforced with metal pins.

 

 

The wing and hull blocks now look like this:

 

 

......which means that I can now spend many happy hours scraping and shaping.........but I can assure all of you that I will be nowhere near completing 20% of the model, or even anything approaching that by the start date in a few days time because I will not have the time to get very much done before then.

 

Thanks for looking.

 

P

 

 

Edited September 1, 2017 by pheonix
corrected details of materials used in Rs I

[hendie]

ambitious, but I love it.

[jrlx]

Hi phoenix,

 

Welcome to the GB! That's a really ambitious and impressive project! I praise your courage and wish you the best of luck. I'll be following with great interest!

 

Your preparatory work is perfectly acceptable within the 25% rule.

 

Cheers

 

Jaime

[TheBaron]

What an epic of shapes on that aircraft - I applaud your methodology!.

Tony

[Mjwomack]

And there's me anxious about scratch building a pair of floats!

This is going to be magnificent

[pheonix]

On 8/29/2017 at 4:32 PM, hendie said:

ambitious, but I love it.

Just not too ambitious I hope!

 

13 hours ago, Mjwomack said:

And there's me anxious about scratch building a pair of floats!

This is going to be magnificent

I have scratch built floats - for the Ago float plane, and they were a bit tricky I have to admit. I had originally thought of building the hull for this from card mounted on formers, until I studied the underside of the nose....... Then I had another idea! That is one of the big advantages of scratch building, you can rewrite the instructions whenever, and as many times, as you want to!

 

P

[greggles.w]

22 hours ago, pheonix said:

That is one of the big advantages of scratch building, you can rewrite the instructions whenever, and as many times, as you want to!

Such a positive attitude- inspirational!

[pheonix]

I note that some other members who are part of this GB have nearly finished their builds, so I have been keen to get properly started and be ready to show some evidence of progress.

 

Before I start I note that here has been much discussion about tools on other threads in this GB, so not wishing to be left out I decided that I needed some new tools too. Well if I am to shape the hull I was not going to get far with the needle files that I normally use for modelling so I went out and treated myself to these: 

 

 

Not the latest in high tech or the most expensive tools around but they were within my limited budget and ideal for the task I had in mind. There was a third round file in the set but I have not had to use that yet, maybe I will later. Bought them from a hardware store round the corner and I was even able to walk to the premises rather than having to drive miles to some horrible industrial park in Kent.

 

The hull is made from a block of laminated basswood: I have not carved basswood before but would readily do so again if the need arises. It is lovely material to work with: hard but not stiff to file or sand, makes a really good smooth surface which once sealed should be easy to paint, and is robust enough to hold in a vice and not be damaged in the process. I enjoyed making this so far - I hope it continues when I do the extra work later.

 

Scraping and shaping 1

 

If you know how to carve shapes from a block of wood I apologise if what follows is tedious and I suggest that you skip this section and just look at the photos as this is intended for those who are not familiar with carving. It is not difficult, it just takes a little time, (or in my case a lot - about 5 hours for what you see at the end of this post). I started by filing the top of the hull to get the correct curved section and then I marked plan on the top surface of the block and sawed away the front corners to make things a little quicker. I also sawed away the section under the nose as I followed the line of the hull side that I had originally drawn and started to file away at the sides to get the correct plan shape. Having almost completed the filing of the sides I realised that I had made a major mistake. I had got carried away with the saw and had cut off the lower half of the bow!! I now intend to use this dud hull as a practice piece for later operations. Back to laminating three pieces of basswood and leaving the lot to dry out overnight under a pile of books: my low tech press.

 

Try number 2: this time I repeated the procedure above to the part where I cut off the corners for the bow section, but this time I made sure that I left the underside well alone. The top of the hull was once again filed to the correct profile:

 

 

 

The plan was marked on the top of the hull and a series of lines drawn at 90 degrees at fixed points to help make sure that I did not get carried away when shaping the sides:

 

 

More filing....until this shape was reached:

 

 

 

The line running across the front end of the hull becomes important at this stage because there has a subtle curve here which  I presume was to allow spray water to drain away quickly. Careful use of the file enabled me to shape the upper surface forward of the line. I worked on each side in turn using photographs to get what I think is the correct profile.

 

 

Now for the tricky bit: to get the area of the upper hull to the rear of the line to curve downwards to meet the new side profile forward of the line. The centre line was very important because this is the highest point on the nose of the hull and was used as a guide when drawing the file across the side: more strokes and greater pressure towards the side, almost no pressure and few strokes towards the centre line. I had to work slowly and methodically and towards the end I used coarse grade glass paper to finish the job, again working on each side in turn.

 

 

Polishing was done with flour grade glass paper, and the top profile of the hull is finished.

 

 

 

I will make the steps at the rear of the hull next, but before I let myself loose on the new hull I will try out an idea on the old one first. Then I will not have wasted 5 hours of work and another block of wood if something goes wrong.

 

P

 

 

[greggles.w]

Wonderful craftsmanship! This is real boat building!!

 

Five hours can easily go by when in the zone with a material & a task such as this.  You can be very satisfied with that result.

[TheBaron]

Thank-you for a perfect outline of your methodology Phoenix - really informative and the (gorgeous) result speaks for itself. 

 

I'm looking forward to learning new skills from this build: Bravo! 

Tony

[Caerbannog]

Great project and clearly described - will follow with interest.

René

[jrlx]

Very impressed with the results! The shape you got is beautiful! Very well done

 

Cheers

 

Jaime

 

[hendie]

nice work.

[pheonix]

Thanks to all of you who dropped by and left those encouraging remarks.

On 9/7/2017 at 0:53 AM, TheBaron said:

Thank-you for a perfect outline of your methodology Phoenix - really informative and the (gorgeous) result speaks for itself. 

 

Tony

 

On 9/7/2017 at 7:14 AM, Caerbannog said:

Great project and clearly described - will follow with interest.

René

Thank you especially Tony and Rene: I am trying to explain things clearly for the reasons I gave in an earlier post and I am pleased to read that I am having some success.

 

I have completed the steps at the rear of the hull, without making a mess of things and having to start all over again. So...

 

Shaping and scraping 2

 

I cut out the whole of the lower rear of the hull - two cuts, one horizontal and one vertical. I then sanded the upper corners smooth as these will be visible when the steps are complete. Two lines were drawn on the horizontal surface to mark where the steps will be.

 

 

The third line is the centre line and is used to make measurements to keep things symmetrical. The block which I had removed from the hull was cut into three sections, using the dimensions measured from the hull horizontal surface above. The centre section was carefully put to one side and the two side pieces were first reduced in thickness with a saw and then had lines drawn on them to mark the top of the step. This surface is not completely flat: it slopes more at the front end than the rear. One side was glued to the gap in the hull rear and allowed to dry out overnight. This was filed down to the lines on each side and polished with fine glass paper to leave a flat surface as shown on this trial block which was my unsuccessful first attempt to carve the hull:

 

 

 

 

The third picture shows that the fit on the trial piece was not quite as good as I would have wanted (and achieved) on the real piece: it was after all done to prove a concept and it worked. When the one side step was finished the above operation was repeated for the other side:

 

 

The centre section had to be reduced in thickness and have the sides adjusted with some glass paper to make a really tight fit, but once it could be pushed into the gap I again drew lines on the sides to mark the edges of the hull bottom. I glued the inside surfaces of the hull, tapped the centre piece into place and let the glue set. The top could then be shaped as before with a file, polished with glass paper and the very small gaps filled with putty.

 

 

 

 

They have now been sanded smooth and I am ready to tackle the hull under the bow. You can see that I have been trying both the round and half round files on the test hull and have concluded that the half round file is the more suitable tool. I just hope that I do not make a mess of the next step as there is a lot of time invested in this piece now!

 

Thanks for looking.

 

P

[hendie]

coming along very nicely.    The key is to stop often and check/dry fit, then check again.  It's all too easy to remove just a bit too much when you're working with such soft materials

[TonyTiger66]

There's some real craftsmanship going on here  .

 

Watching in awe.

 

Very interesting and a Dornier too, great stuff 

 

Best regards

TonyT

[TheBaron]

The (very) little shaping I've done with balsa lets me appreciate the patience and skill on show here phoenix. Lovely work.

Tony

[greggles.w]

Nice work on a complex form!

[jrlx]

Superb work, shaping up beautifully! Looking forward to the next steps.

 

Cheers

 

Jaime

[AlexN]

Neat .

 

[pheonix]

On 9/9/2017 at 3:27 PM, hendie said:

coming along very nicely.    The key is to stop often and check/dry fit, then check again.  It's all too easy to remove just a bit too much when you're working with such soft materials

Thanks for the compliment hendie. That is really good advice: it is what I have had to do with the bows as I will report shortly.

 

On 9/9/2017 at 10:07 PM, TonyTiger66 said:

There's some real craftsmanship going on here  .

 

Watching in awe.

 

Very interesting and a Dornier too, great stuff 

 

Best regards

TonyT

Thanks Tom. Yes this is a Dornier which I do not think we will see as a kit for a long while yet, unlike all those Russian jet flying boats!

On 9/9/2017 at 11:29 PM, TheBaron said:

The (very) little shaping I've done with balsa lets me appreciate the patience and skill on show here phoenix. Lovely work.

Tony

Thanks Tony. Actually this is basswood (lime) not balsa. Lime is harder and therefore takes more working. I did not think that balsa would be strong enough for this model and I am nor willing to try to mould this hull - it is simply too big to make without a vacuform machine which I do not have.

 

On 9/10/2017 at 3:12 AM, greggles.w said:

Nice work on a complex form!

Thanks Greggles. I really appreciate your positive and encouraging comments.

 

On 9/10/2017 at 4:15 AM, jrlx said:

Superb work, shaping up beautifully! Looking forward to the next steps.

 

Cheers

 

Jaime

Thank you Jamie. I hope that this next post will also impress you!

 

On 9/10/2017 at 8:42 PM, AlexN said:

Neat .

 

Thank you Alex. Your support is also greatly appreciated, especially when things do not work out as planned - ie. first attempt at the hull!

 

I have completed the scraping and shaping of the bow, and managed to do so without taking off too much material, and I have kept it symmetrical. I do have a card former which was made from one of the section drawings in the DF but the problem is that it only applies to one part of the bow - the rest has to be estimated by Mk 1 eyeball. I used a half round file for this task as the curve is larger and flatter than the round file. This gave a broader curve and made the overall shaping easier, but I also had to take care not to remove too much wood. I had drawn the centre line on the bottom of the hull before I started - this was essential if the bow sides were to be symmetrical. I carved one side first so that it was almost complete, and then I carved the other until it was in the same state. I took out material from the mid point between the centre line on the bottom of the hull, and the line on the side of the hull marking the vertical section. To start with the edge of the wood looked awful but by gradually extending the line of cut laterally in both directions by using the curve of the file blade, and continuing to remove material from the central area, the desired shape gradually appeared. Finally I took a little wood off each side alternately as shown in the photos below, until I judged that the keel was thin enough and the curve was as close as I could get to the card former. I have never shaped a bow before - this was a first attempt, so please be considerate and leave the micrometers in the back pocket when looking at it!

 

The pencil marks on the port (left) side show where I still need to take off more wood. By marking the area in this way the other areas are not accidentally worn away and the desired shape lost.

 

 

This second view shows the marks on the starboard (right) side of the nose where I had previously used the file. This area had also been marked with a pencil as shown above.

 

 

The left and right sides respectively of the completed hull showing the line where the vertical sides meet the planing (under) surface. The marks at the rear are filler used to smooth the joint where I replaced the wood when making the stepped rear as described in the previous post.

 

 

 

I have also finished scraping the underside of the hull - you will see that there are two small longitudinal steps towards the rear. These were taken down with the flat file by gently putting pressure on the file as I drew it forwards and backwards, following a pencil line that I had marked previously. All of the hull has been polished with fine grade glass paper.

 

 

The hull is now semi-complete: I have still to drill out the cockpit opening and add details and then drill approximately 40 holes for various attachments: more on that later. First the retro bit: I have to fill and seal the wood grain and to do that I will use a very old and for me well tried method - a mixture of talcum powder and shrinking dope - a la Airfix Magazine sometime in the early to mid 1960's!

 

Memories, memories..... 

 

Thanks for looking.

 

P

[jrlx]

This is a real work of art Beautiful shapes and superb craftsmanship on show!

 

Cheers

 

Jaime

 

 

[Brandy]

I'll second that! It could almost be put on display as it is!

 

Ian

[TheBaron]

I will have to third the above comments due to a lack of sufficient superlatives. This is immensely satisfying work sir.

Tony

[greggles.w]

& fourth! Superbly crafted!