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1/48 - McDD F-4 Phantom II family by Zoukei Mura - F-4E/EJ/EJ-Kai and G released - RF-4B/C/E in the pipe line & F-4E (late) in April-May 2024


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7 hours ago, hopkp said:

Definitely looks to be a more accurate rendition to me! (Based on those photos anyway.....)

I've always been amazed at the folks who can so easily spot that "inaccuarcy".   

 

Gene K

Edited by Gene K
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1 hour ago, Gene K said:

I've always been amazed at the folks who can so easily spot that "inaccuarcy".   

 

Gene K

Sticks out like a sore thumb to me, other people's mileage may vary, as they say.....

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Re line alert!!

I have highlighted the panel line where it's easiest to see the problem:

The new Echo model, the shape in this area is concave in the vertical direction with a smooth transition upwards, and as such looks like it should (without having the kit to put a template to it):

ZM%20Comp2.jpg

Whereas the short nose fuselage shape (same for all models released so far) is mostly convex in this area with a rather abrupt and disjointed, kinked transition upwards. Moving along the fuselage aft, the kink between the engine "shoulders" and the spine should have been smoothed out by the time you arrive at this panel line, but it is still very much there. Because the shape is still convex instead of concave, there is too much "meat" on the fuselage above/around the engines.

ZM%20Comp1.jpg

 

Hope this helps...

Cheers,

J

 

 

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On 8/9/2020 at 12:00 AM, Gene K said:

What exactly -- is it the curve around the exhaust area  ... or what?

 

Gene K

If you check JeffreyK's images you see it. It's why Zoukei Mura changed the mould for the long nose Phantoms and why there's a resin update for the short nose. Usually I'm not too fussed about small errors in kits but that one was a bit too much. I prefer the look of the Academy F4 but will probably get Zoukei's F4-F when it arrives.

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12 hours ago, Richard123 said:

... there's a resin update for the short nose. 

That's the set from JeffreyK ... who is Hypersonic Models. That set would be a great "fix" for your kit since it obviously is important to you (I respect that).  I think this correction kit will be available in Europe and  in the US, (vice from Japan where Hypersonic is) but Jeffrey can confirm that.

 

He also has items to do some corrections on your Academy kit. 

 

Gene K

(a long time, very satisfied Hypersonic customer)

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20 minutes ago, Gene K said:

That's the set from JeffreyK ... who is Hypersonic Models. That set would be a great "fix" for your kit since it obviously is important to you (I respect that).  I think this correction kit will be available in Europe and  in the US, (vice from Japan where Hypersonic is) but Jeffrey can confirm that.

 

He also has items to do some corrections on your Academy kit. 

 

Gene K

(a long time, very satisfied Hypersonic customer)

Cheers Gene, I'll take a look.

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22 hours ago, Richard123 said:

I prefer the look of the Academy F4 but will probably get Zoukei's F4-F when it arrives.

 As long as you don't look too hard as it has even more issues than Z-M, IMO.

Folks, if you can afford it, get yourself at least one Z-M Phantom kit. To quote a buddy of mine: "with every opening of the box the kit looks better and better".

Cheers,

Vedran

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3 hours ago, dragonlanceHR said:

 As long as you don't look too hard as it has even more issues than Z-M, IMO.

 

 

Vedran,

 

Wow, I've not been paying attention and have lost touch ... is there a  list/rundown of all the "issues" which the ZM kits have (besides the rear fuselage)? :huh: 

I thought the ZM Phantoms were near-perfect kits. 

 

At any rate, I'm really looking forward to the the ZM long nose  variants,  and I know I'll appreciate  and enjoy them as much as I do the  absolutely outstanding short noses.

 

Thanks,

Gene K

 

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14 hours ago, dragonlanceHR said:

 As long as you don't look too hard as it has even more issues than Z-M, IMO.

Folks, if you can afford it, get yourself at least one Z-M Phantom kit. To quote a buddy of mine: "with every opening of the box the kit looks better and better".

Cheers,

Vedran

I try not to look too hard but every time I look at the short nose Z-M F4 I see the issue with the tail. Now they've redone it I'll certainly get one of the long nose versions. It's just a shame they don't seem to be correcting their earlier mould.

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19 hours ago, Gene K said:

Vedran,

 

Wow, I've not been paying attention and have lost touch ... is there a  list/rundown of all the "issues" which the ZM kits have (besides the rear fuselage)? :huh: 

I thought the ZM Phantoms were near-perfect kits. 

 

At any rate, I'm really looking forward to the the ZM long nose  variants,  and I know I'll appreciate  and enjoy them as much as I do the  absolutely outstanding short noses.

 

Thanks,

Gene K

 

Hi Gene,

my comment was re:looks of the Academy kit, with it's longer rear canopy, chubby tail and in C/D a fat, wavy lower wing leading edge. Plus the nose/nose intakes fix.

 

OOB Z-M is the best 1/48 F-4 on the market.

 

Cheers,

Vedran

 

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1 hour ago, dragonlanceHR said:

Hi Gene,

my comment was re:looks of the Academy kit, with it's longer rear canopy, chubby tail and in C/D a fat, wavy lower wing leading edge. Plus the nose/nose intakes fix.

 

OOB Z-M is the best 1/48 F-4 on the market.

 

Cheers,

Vedran

 

 

I will personally grant this position to Hasegawa...

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1 hour ago, LUCIANO007 said:

 

I will personally grant this position to Hasegawa...

As it is your right.

But to get it barely to Z-M out-of-the-box level it takes a resin cockpit, wheels, exhausts, pylons (if empty) and the arrestor hook. Hasegawa scribing is sharper tho.

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1 hour ago, dragonlanceHR said:

As it is your right.

But to get it barely to Z-M out-of-the-box level it takes a resin cockpit, wheels, exhausts, pylons (if empty) and the arrestor hook. Hasegawa scribing is sharper tho.

 

The overall looks is what is of the greatest importance for me.

And although I would never take a ruler to size, the issue on the ZM F-4 is quite obvious. But I agree, the detail is just amazing!

And I would definitely buy a late F-4E to make a Greek Phantom...

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Yes, ZM F-4C/D is the best 1/48 Phantom, but it has A LOT of flaws.
0) It is actually not F-4C/D, it is F-4J with USAF parts and without refuelling probe
1) Panel lines on the nose totally incorrect for F-4C/D
2) Top vent panel on intakes is incorrect for all versions, some panel lines on intakes are absent for all versions.
3) Probes inside of the intakes are too near to the edge of the intake.
4) Intake parts and corresponding edges of fuselage parts has too rounded, soft edges and forms very deep panel line after glueing.
5) Part behind the canopy joins with the spine part by the hinge - it makes refining this area rather difficult
6) Spine part has some wrong panel lines
7) Spine part must be bigger in width because there is NO panel line along joining of spine part with fuselage, you need to fill it, sand smooth and recreate screws.
😎 Panel lines on the top of the "shoulders" are incorrect for F-4C/D
9) Intake in the base of fin is incorrect for F-4C/D - you need to make it smaller by enlarging fin base forward.
10) Plates on the top of the fin - right side is incorrect for all versions, left side is incorrect for F-4D
11) There is no any guidance for Slime lights
12) Wrong panel lines on the tail
13) Slats has soft-to absent panel lines and needs to be adjusted to wing
14) There is no black antenna hexagon on the slat of real F-4C/D
15) Slats are incorrect in length - inner slat must be longer
16) No outer weapon pylons - tanks only.

 

For the XXI сentury kit with such price it seems to me rather bad.

 

5 hours ago, LUCIANO007 said:

 

I will personally grant this position to Hasegawa...

Hasegawa has same trouble with rear fuselage as ZM - not such obvious, but wrong.

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Anyway i dont understand the hype around ZM, why should i pay a higher price, and the kits are really expensive, if the kits have so many issues? I have built the ZM  Focke-Wulf TA -152 in 1:32 as a commission build, i was expecting its almost Tamiya quality, but its not, but why so expensive?

I hope they will release also the german F-4F,  i will buy it just to compare it with a Hasegawa one.

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2 hours ago, Harry Callahan said:

but why so expensive?

Because if you invest in the new kit today, you cannot expect on big amount of copies. Kids are not gluing kits anymore. So if you produce kits by traditional technology - steel moulds and all other things, you need to divide this cost of manufacturing by small amount of old fat maniaks.

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7 hours ago, mr_stomach said:

Yes, ZM F-4C/D is the best 1/48 Phantom, but it has A LOT of flaws ... .

Good grief. You discovered all that by yourself? You must a very large technical library, but I don't, so I respect your research.

 

Harry, The ZM kits deserve the hype [that you said you don't understand] because they are the best 1/48 Phantom kits out there ... and the price is reasonable.  That's of course an opinion, just as your concern about pricing. 

 

Gene K

ZM Fanboy

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2 hours ago, Gene K said:

Good grief. You discovered all that by yourself? You must a very large technical library, but I don't, so I respect your research.

Thanx 🙂

Unfortunately, there is no F-4 in Russia, so i mostly used my photos from Speyer Technical Museum.

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/2Y5w/MJ1chsNjm

Of course i have many other sources but these hi-res photos made first guidance to research when i began to build my F-4D

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Sergey, F-4C/Ds don't have slats. The leading edge hinged devices are blown flaps

 

Z-M goofed the canopy profile — it's too parallel in plan view, like the canopy of a MiG-23UB or Su-15UM. 

 

I hope Z-M get this right if ever they do 1/32 Phantoms, which would be gorgeous.

 

Tony 

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10 hours ago, tony.t said:

Sergey, F-4C/Ds don't have slats. The leading edge hinged devices are blown flaps.

Yes, my mistake. In russian aviation therminology all leading edge devices are prewings (предкрылки) and all trailing edge devices are postwings (закрылки).
But the fact is - division line on these blown flaps incorrectly corresponds with underwing pylon and other wing details.

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