pheonix Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 If the internal details of this project are anything to go by the wheel wells should be very impressive. Very interesting thread - especially the finer details that you have managed to ferret out form various sources. P 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general melchett Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 I did see the TP Martian but didn't think it too ugly...silly, definitely but not actually fugly, just two overlarge Avro 504's bunged together in the attempt at making yet another seemingly hopeless failure.... Quote I just see the General badgering Darling to come up with something sillier from the Blackburn stable. Funny you should say that as no sooner had I put down my quill than Darling just came rushing into the boudoir showing me this ...the wondrous Blackburn AD Scout.....a novel way to commit suicide methinks ! 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackAck Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Martian Hale said: It is the Blackburn Twin Torpedo Bomber. I just see the General badgering Darling to come up with something sillier from the Blackburn stable. Martian Definitely one of Blackburn's more attractive designs. The Blackburn AD Scout? Looks like an undertaker tried to get into the aerospace engineering business Edited June 21, 2017 by BlackAck 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 8 hours ago, Martian Hale said: It is the Blackburn Twin Torpedo Bomber. I just see the General badgering Darling to come up with something sillier from the Blackburn stable. Martian Sorry to interrupt a private dispute between those who generally know a great deal more about RNAS/FAA machines than I do, but the Blackburn TB (Twin Biplane) was not a torpedo bomber. It was designed to attack Zeppelin airships from above with steel darts, the idea being that the aeroplane would fly above the airship and the navigator would release the darts. The pilot sat in one fuselage, the navigator in the other 10 feet away with no means of communication except hand signals! The type was to have been fitted with 150hp Smith Static radial engines but these proved to be unreliable and so 100hp Monosoupape engines were fitted to the first prototype. 110 hp Clergets were fitted to the second without a noticeable improvement in performance. Nine were delivered to the Admiralty, 7 were deployed in 1916 at Killingholme and two kept in store. They proved to be incapable of climbing above 8000ft and were thus incapable of carrying out their proposed tasks. The type was supposed to have been able to carry three boxes of darts: to try to increase performance the Admiralty allowed this to be reduced to two but it did not make a real difference. All of the machines were broken up in late 1917. Another disaster for the Admiralty and Blackburn, who together over the years appear to have made a superb losing team. Shame about the aircrews who had to operate these and other acts of their combined folly. P 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTiger66 Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 That's really nice work on the interior Martian . Crikey, people get a bit of grief for liking Blackburn aircraft around these parts ! As for me, I love the Shark, Skua, Roc, BB, Perth, Baffin, Firebrand et al. Full of character and individuality. Moreover...the Buccaneer ! My ears are covered, I will hear no more libellous anti-Blackburnism ! Best regards TonyT 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandy Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 1 hour ago, general melchett said: I did see the TP Martian but didn't think it too ugly...silly, definitely but not actually fugly, just two overlarge Avro 504's bunged together in the attempt at making yet another seemingly hopeless failure.... Funny you should say that as no sooner had I put down my quill than Darling just came rushing into the boudoir showing me this ...the wondrous Blackburn AD Scout.....a novel way to commit suicide methinks ! ...and of course there is absolutely NO chance of that ever nosing over on landing...... What on earth were they thinking? Nothing more than an inverted pendulum! Ian 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhaselden Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, general melchett said: Funny you should say that as no sooner had I put down my quill than Darling just came rushing into the boudoir showing me this ...the wondrous Blackburn AD Scout.....a novel way to commit suicide methinks ! That's another Dastardly and Muttley special....stop that pigeon NOW!!!!! Edited June 21, 2017 by mhaselden 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackAck Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 1 hour ago, TonyTiger66 said: Moreover...the Buccaneer ! Another ugly, dismal, disaster with wings? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 3 hours ago, pheonix said: If the internal details of this project are anything to go by the wheel wells should be very impressive. Very interesting thread - especially the finer details that you have managed to ferret out form various sources. P There won't be any wheel well details, I was musing over having to plate them in as they were on the real aircraft. 2 hours ago, general melchett said: I did see the TP Martian but didn't think it too ugly...silly, definitely but not actually fugly, just two overlarge Avro 504's bunged together in the attempt at making yet another seemingly hopeless failure.... Funny you should say that as no sooner had I put down my quill than Darling just came rushing into the boudoir showing me this ...the wondrous Blackburn AD Scout.....a novel way to commit suicide methinks ! 2 hours ago, BlackAck said: Definitely one of Blackburn's more attractive designs. The Blackburn AD Scout? Looks like an undertaker tried to get into the aerospace engineering business Old hat General. Somewhere I have some moulds I carved for this in 1/48 scale, don't know where mind. I suspended the project when I could not find out how the control wires got from the fuselage to the empennage. If I could get more gen on the subject I still may well have a bash at it. 2 hours ago, pheonix said: Sorry to interrupt a private dispute between those who generally know a great deal more about RNAS/FAA machines than I do, but the Blackburn TB (Twin Biplane) was not a torpedo bomber. It was designed to attack Zeppelin airships from above with steel darts, the idea being that the aeroplane would fly above the airship and the navigator would release the darts. The pilot sat in one fuselage, the navigator in the other 10 feet away with no means of communication except hand signals! The type was to have been fitted with 150hp Smith Static radial engines but these proved to be unreliable and so 100hp Monosoupape engines were fitted to the first prototype. 110 hp Clergets were fitted to the second without a noticeable improvement in performance. Nine were delivered to the Admiralty, 7 were deployed in 1916 at Killingholme and two kept in store. They proved to be incapable of climbing above 8000ft and were thus incapable of carrying out their proposed tasks. The type was supposed to have been able to carry three boxes of darts: to try to increase performance the Admiralty allowed this to be reduced to two but it did not make a real difference. All of the machines were broken up in late 1917. Another disaster for the Admiralty and Blackburn, who together over the years appear to have made a superb losing team. Shame about the aircrews who had to operate these and other acts of their combined folly. P On behalf of the General and myself we stand corrected. Although I do have an article from a French magazine somewhere which shows one of these or a Blackburn design very much like it with a torpedo slung between the floats. 2 hours ago, TonyTiger66 said: That's really nice work on the interior Martian . Crikey, people get a bit of grief for liking Blackburn aircraft around these parts ! As for me, I love the Shark, Skua, Roc, BB, Perth, Baffin, Firebrand et al. Full of character and individuality. Moreover...the Buccaneer ! My ears are covered, I will hear no more libellous anti-Blackburnism ! Best regards TonyT Quite right Sir I though we were supposed to be living in a multi-cultural, multi-faith and multi-beauty society! 1 hour ago, limeypilot said: ...and of course there is absolutely NO chance of that ever nosing over on landing...... What on earth were they thinking? Nothing more than an inverted pendulum! Ian It coulsd have done with some longer landing skids methinks as well as a wider track undercarriage. 1 hour ago, mhaselden said: That's another Dastardly and Muttley special....stop that pigeon NOW!!!!! Now there's a thought for a different kind of Group Build! 1 hour ago, BlackAck said: Another ugly, dismal, disaster with wings? Shame on you sir! With the exception of the much mourned TSR2, it is probably the best low level strike aircraft ever. Martian 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 2 hours ago, TonyTiger66 said: That's really nice work on the interior Martian . Crikey, people get a bit of grief for liking Blackburn aircraft around these parts ! As for me, I love the Shark, Skua, Roc, BB, Perth, Baffin, Firebrand et al. Full of character and individuality. Moreover...the Buccaneer ! My ears are covered, I will hear no more libellous anti-Blackburnism ! Best regards TonyT ...not to mention building the lion's share of the most "iconic" Naval aircraft of them all, the Blackfish / Swordfish. Though in reality I'm with you on this anti-Blackburn stuff, normally this sort of bias is aimed at Fairey's own stable of 'character'. Me, I love all these wacky designs - the Handley Page Type G (which looks like a cross between a Stearman and a boomerang), Sopwith Bat Boat (a natty Gunbus / dugout canoe hybrid), Caproni CA41 Triplane (the unholy spawn of a pair of mating 0/400s and some giant pram wheels), Westland Walrus (Somerset's tribute to the Blackburn...), Barracuda V (I'll defend the Mks 1-3 all day, but the Mk 5 was a monstrosity), and Short Seamew... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 2 hours ago, limeypilot said: ...and of course there is absolutely NO chance of that ever nosing over on landing...... What on earth were they thinking? Nothing more than an inverted pendulum! Ian Now that is truly remarkable! Give the pilot a pusher engine...and then build up the nose really high so he can't see forward anyway. Mind yiu, if that was the AD Scout, what on earth did the BC Scout look like? 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: Now that is truly remarkable! Give the pilot a pusher engine...and then build up the nose really high so he can't see forward anyway. Mind yiu, if that was the AD Scout, what on earth did the BC Scout look like? It looks like the designer had been to one of the General's cocktail parties before he sat down to design it. Either that or he used the General as a consultant on the project. Martian 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleeperService Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 You're slipping Martian when has being concealed by later work ever stopped you adding detail. You could make the covers removable although I accept ascertaining what pipe closures, loose cable securing arrangements and other trivia were employed would be tricky. The brick is quite a handsome aircraft but in a manly John Wayne way rather than beautiful. I can almost see some grim faced designer 'See how those lines curve together? we don't do that here. Where do you think you are Hawkers? Bring the sides in at odd angles with bits of the engine showing but mind that they're not regular serviced bits. That'd be a bit soft too.' Cue lad (likely 30ish) backing out doffing his cap. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackAck Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Martian Hale said: Shame on you sir! With the exception of the much mourned TSR2, it is probably the best low level strike aircraft ever. Martian I think the banana jet was one of their (if not the) prettiest aircraft. I'd hate to be seen as being un-Fairey critical.. Edited June 21, 2017 by BlackAck 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 12 minutes ago, SleeperService said: You're slipping Martian when has being concealed by later work ever stopped you adding detail. You could make the covers removable although I accept ascertaining what pipe closures, loose cable securing arrangements and other trivia were employed would be tricky. The brick is quite a handsome aircraft but in a manly John Wayne way rather than beautiful. I can almost see some grim faced designer 'See how those lines curve together? we don't do that here. Where do you think you are Hawkers? Bring the sides in at odd angles with bits of the engine showing but mind that they're not regular serviced bits. That'd be a bit soft too.' Cue lad (likely 30ish) backing out doffing his cap. I do like my models to look believable (says the man who built the Haunebu!) and I just could not even begin to figure out how it worked. So there layeth the project until further enlightenment becomes available. 11 minutes ago, BlackAck said: I think the banana jet was one of their (if not the) prettiest aircraft. I'd hate to be seen as being un-Fairey critical.. I am glad you seem to see the light although I suppose its a pious hope to hope that the jokes will improve? Martian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 42 minutes ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: ...not to mention building the lion's share of the most "iconic" Naval aircraft of them all, the Blackfish / Swordfish. Though in reality I'm with you on this anti-Blackburn stuff, normally this sort of bias is aimed at Fairey's own stable of 'character'. Me, I love all these wacky designs - the Handley Page Type G (which looks like a cross between a Stearman and a boomerang), Sopwith Bat Boat (a natty Gunbus / dugout canoe hybrid), Caproni CA41 Triplane (the unholy spawn of a pair of mating 0/400s and some giant pram wheels), Westland Walrus (Somerset's tribute to the Blackburn...), Barracuda V (I'll defend the Mks 1-3 all day, but the Mk 5 was a monstrosity), and Short Seamew... You will not be surprised to learn then that I scratch built a 1/48 Batboat a few years ago? Can't agree about the Barracuda Mk5 though, gorgeous looking aircraft and no, that's not the beer goggles talking as I haven't had any yet! Wait 'til I really start raving! Martian 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general melchett Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 Quote What on earth were they thinking? Nothing more than an inverted pendulum! Yes but at least he can see his house from up there...and he had an unimpeded, front seat view of his own demise to boot. Crisp, Quote Me, I love all these wacky designs - the Handley Page Type G (which looks like a cross between a Stearman and a boomerang), Sopwith Bat Boat (a natty Gunbus / dugout canoe hybrid), Caproni CA41 Triplane (the unholy spawn of a pair of mating 0/400s and some giant pram wheels), Westland Walrus (Somerset's tribute to the Blackburn...), Barracuda V (I'll defend the Mks 1-3 all day, but the Mk 5 was a monstrosity), and Short Seamew... You must add to that the Fairey Pintail...Fairey's half-hearted attempt at producing an aircraft to rival the worst of Bob Blackburn's creations... Martian, Quote Either that or he used the General as a consultant on the project. If I'd been consultant on the project I would have had added a few more wings so that he could sit even higher, added a step-ladder for the poor blighter, (even the Blackburn had one of those) and maybe fitted pram wheels to the wing tips much like Darling's moped to keep the thing upright, though apparently the widely spaced skids under the fins were supposed to do that...mind you if all else failed, (and it probably did) it would make a fine agricultural tool for digging furrows strapped behind a couple of Lincolnshire finest Shires... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 20 minutes ago, general melchett said: You must add to that the Fairey Pintail...Fairey's half-hearted attempt at producing an aircraft to rival the worst of Bob Blackburn's creations... I see what you mean, General, but I can see in the Pintail a few hints of the Flycatcher - and anyone who disses that glorious machine will be asked to step outside forthwith. Martian, no, I'm not surprised to learn that you have built a Bat Boat. Frankly, I would only raise an eyebrow slightly if you told me that you'd actually flown one... Amywyay, setting aside this dreamy talk of gorgeous design classics, I forgot to say how fine your Roc is looking. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general melchett Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 Quote I'm not surprised to learn that you have built a Bat Boat. Frankly, I would only raise an eyebrow slightly if you told me that you'd actually flown one... He looks the height of sartorial elegance what with his mask, underpants over his tights and cape flapping away in the breeze... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in Lincs Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 No one seems to have mentioned the Blackburn Roundabout. Another one that couldn't get off the ground. (Sorry, it's past my bedtime) 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 4 hours ago, general melchett said: He looks the height of sartorial elegance what with his mask, underpants over his tights and cape flapping away in the breeze... 4 hours ago, Ex-FAAWAFU said: I see what you mean, General, but I can see in the Pintail a few hints of the Flycatcher - and anyone who disses that glorious machine will be asked to step outside forthwith. Martian, no, I'm not surprised to learn that you have built a Bat Boat. Frankly, I would only raise an eyebrow slightly if you told me that you'd actually flown one... Amywyay, setting aside this dreamy talk of gorgeous design classics, I forgot to say how fine your Roc is looking. Thanks Crisp. Fret ye not about people dissing the Flycatcher, they will be having an interview with me and the blurglecruncheon to "re-educate" them. As to the Batboat, despite vicious rumours to the contrary, even I am not quite that old. I think the problem is that some people mistake my progressive way of thinking for galloping senility. 4 hours ago, general melchett said: He looks the height of sartorial elegance what with his mask, underpants over his tights and cape flapping away in the breeze... You horrid General! Who gave you permission to leak details of my party frock for Telford? I shall be invoicing you for the replacement I shall now have to purchase! 3 hours ago, Pete in Lincs said: No one seems to have mentioned the Blackburn Roundabout. Another one that couldn't get off the ground. (Sorry, it's past my bedtime) That's as bad as one of Blackack's jokes! No, its worse, at least he has the excuse that he is a colonial!. I shall reflect of some suitable punishment overnight. Take him down someone! Judge Martian PS: Remind me how I got myself into all this! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackAck Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 28 minutes ago, Martian Hale said: That's as bad as one of Blackack's jokes! No, its worse, at least he has the excuse that he is a colonial!. I didn't realise Dulwich was the colonies. Croydon must be postively Antartic. Is this helping my case? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 22, 2017 Author Share Posted June 22, 2017 4 hours ago, BlackAck said: I didn't realise Dulwich was the colonies. Croydon must be postively Antartic. Is this helping my case? I see, you only live in the US, my apologies Sir. However this has no bearing on the woeful standard of jokes. Our thoughts go out to Mrs Blackack who presumably has put up with them all the time. Martian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshanks Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Nice detail............ Kev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corsaircorp Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 That's as bad as one of Blackack's jokes! No, its worse, at least he has the excuse that he is a colonial!. I shall reflect of some suitable punishment overnight. Take him down someone! Judge Martian PS: Remind me how I got myself into all this! Hem ! At least partially because a bent wing bird fan has told you that you would'nt dare to have a Roc float plane target tug.... Cannot apologize about all this because, lots of humor, nice photos of rarities and a very building of a Roc Sincerely. Corsaircorp 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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