Tornado when "parked",question on the position of the wings

[Shaun]

4 hours ago, Des said:

Mentioned six months ago , there was a photo but it has been 'Photoboxed'.

Seen a few parked at 45, and swept...

[At Sea]

On 02/10/2017 at 7:37 PM, Shaun said:

Seen a few parked at 45, and swept...

I read somewhere that German Tornados parked swept at 45 degrees as a routine becasue of the size of their HAS.  If you always park sweept at 45 you can't forget to park swept at 45!

[Shaun]

On 10/22/2017 at 11:36 PM, At Sea said:

I read somewhere that German Tornados parked swept at 45 degrees as a routine becasue of the size of their HAS.  If you always park sweept at 45 you can't forget to park swept at 45!

Yes, that is true the Tornado has a bigger wing span than the previous German cold war jets. so 45 sweep was the normal parking position..

[xvtonker]

If you're building an IDS variant then the wings are normally fully forward when parked. 

 

Someone mentioned the wing sweep selector restrictor. This was introduced in the first Gulf War (Op Granby) when the RAF GR.1's were fitted with the larger Hindenberger tanks.

 

If the wings were fully swept the fins on the tanks contacted with the tailplanes. The restrictor plate was added to prevent the wings being swept too far and to prevent the tank fins hitting the tailplanes.

 

XVTonker  

[At Sea]

1 hour ago, xvtonker said:

If you're building an IDS variant then the wings are normally fully forward when parked. 

 

Someone mentioned the wing sweep selector restrictor. This was introduced in the first Gulf War (Op Granby) when the RAF GR.1's were fitted with the larger Hindenberger tanks.

 

If the wings were fully swept the fins on the tanks contacted with the tailplanes. The restrictor plate was added to prevent the wings being swept too far and to prevent the tank fins hitting the tailplanes.

 

XVTonker  

Unrelated to Tornado tanks but XV related:

I heard a rumour that 15 Squadron Tornados and either 56 or 74 were at Deci with their Phantoms. 

 

The Phantom's were tagged with the XV fin tag and there was a flap made about it and the perpetrators were ordered to remove the XV's from the other Squadron's aircraft.

This was duly done...

 

...including the first 2 letters of the serial numbers as well, XV492 etc etc.

 

True?  (hope so, it's a good story!)

[xvtonker]

On ‎26‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 12:16 AM, At Sea said:

Unrelated to Tornado tanks but XV related:

I heard a rumour that 15 Squadron Tornados and either 56 or 74 were at Deci with their Phantoms. 

 

The Phantom's were tagged with the XV fin tag and there was a flap made about it and the perpetrators were ordered to remove the XV's from the other Squadron's aircraft.

This was duly done...

 

...including the first 2 letters of the serial numbers as well, XV492 etc etc.

 

True?  (hope so, it's a good story!)

It's true.

 

Two of the XV Sqn linies dressed up in WRAF KD dresses and went down the 56 Sqn line removing all fuselage serial numbering and just leaving the XV and adding the XV to each aircraft fin.

 

The 56 Sqn JENGO came storming across the XV Sqn line hut demanding the dirty deed was undone. He was reassured by our Flt Sergeant that the damage would be removed and he went away happy, not knowing that he had also been 'zapped' on his back with a XV Sqn sticker!! 

 

Later that week me and a propulsion Chief went across to the officers accommodation and, after having had a number of drinks with our aircrew proceeded to dismantle the 56 Sqn upright piano that had been brought over from the UK so they could shoot it up on the Capo Frasca ranges.

 

All we had between us was a Dzeus key, a Swiss army knife, and plenty of cold beer.

 

After a couple of hours the piano resembled an Ikea flat pack all neatly laid out on the floor, so we discreetly disappeared back to the Sgt's accommodation to wait for the fallout.

 

Needless to say the Shifty Fix aircrew were non too pleased, but hey ho... good times.

 

XVTonker  

[At Sea]

Thanks for that.

 

[Sundowner14]

On 10/27/2017 at 4:58 PM, xvtonker said:

It's true.

 

Two of the XV Sqn linies dressed up in WRAF KD dresses and went down the 56 Sqn line removing all fuselage serial numbering and just leaving the XV and adding the XV to each aircraft fin.

 

The 56 Sqn JENGO came storming across the XV Sqn line hut demanding the dirty deed was undone. He was reassured by our Flt Sergeant that the damage would be removed and he went away happy, not knowing that he had also been 'zapped' on his back with a XV Sqn sticker!! 

 

Later that week me and a propulsion Chief went across to the officers accommodation and, after having had a number of drinks with our aircrew proceeded to dismantle the 56 Sqn upright piano that had been brought over from the UK so they could shoot it up on the Capo Frasca ranges.

 

All we had between us was a Dzeus key, a Swiss army knife, and plenty of cold beer.

 

After a couple of hours the piano resembled an Ikea flat pack all neatly laid out on the floor, so we discreetly disappeared back to the Sgt's accommodation to wait for the fallout.

 

Needless to say the Shifty Fix aircrew were non too pleased, but hey ho... good times.

 

XVTonker  

Shifty Fix never had a sense of humour!! Tiger, Tiger, Tiger!!

[tweeky]

Quote

I read somewhere that German Tornados parked swept at 45 degrees as a routine becasue of the size of their HAS.  If you always park sweept at 45 you can't forget to park swept at 45!

The German and Italian Jets didn't have fuel in the Fin unlike RAF one, When I was refuelling RAF Tornado's I always switched off the Fin and Rear groups until the front and wings were partially full. Stops them sitting and begging 

  

Edited April 24, 2021 by tweeky

[Filler]

Sorry to bring back this old chestnut again, but whilst I think that I do understand the following:

 

RAF Tornado F3 (ADV) can and regularly did park up with wings swept fully back (67°).

 

RAF GR1/4 did not park up with wings fully swept (under normal operations) and would be seen parked in the forward position (25°)

 

Luftwaffe Tornado IDS were mostly parked up with their wings at 45 degrees of sweep. (https://www.keymilitary.com/article/luftwaffe-under-test) and (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Fliegerhorst_Büchel.jpg)

 

Stuff I still don't understand:

 

Marineflieger and AMI Tornado IDS's. I assume the German Navy did the same as the Luftwaffe (45°). Italian Tornados, well they always seem to be the most difficult to learn anything about.

 

I guess the other thing I am interested to know about is flaps and slats. I imagine at 67° they would have to be retracted. At 25° I expect it is optional but what was normal? At 45° I do not know, but guess they'd be retracted.

[Shaun]

Flaps slats can only be deployed with wings fully forwards..

A limit switch prevents wing sweep when deployed.

I've heard of a story of an RAF jet in maintenance that had this feature by pasted for rig testing and between shifts this information was not passed on and the wings were moved aft and the flaps inpacted the fuselarge sides!!

[Jabba]

It happened at St Athan. I saw the results of that damage, well the repairs.

[tweeky]

Quote

It happened at St Athan. I saw the results of that damage, well the repairs.

Cottesmore also.

 

Edited May 22, 2021 by tweeky

[Ossington 2]

Was it true that early in squadron service ( I left in 85, so a little out of touch) that it was usual to plug in a hydraulic rig and cycle-through all the control surface permutations as part of the Built In Test Equipment set up. (BITE was seen as quite innovative at the time)

Somewhere, a wing swung forward (or back) and whacked a hangar wall.  

[DougC]

Pretty sure you could have Manoeuver Slat at 45 Wing, but no Flaps.