moaning dolphin Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Don't mind if I tag along in the back ground do you? I like the tutor and often see them in our plant as they come through for resprays. We had a couple of naked ones in a week or so ago, a very compact machine. Looking forward to seeing how you tackle this one! Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave665 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 8 hours ago, Pastor Rich said: I've just placed an order for the 1:33 scale paper model from Dave Winfield. We'll see how that looks once I have it! Looking at Dave's build log of the CL-41 you could be in for a treat. The kit was produced from a 3D model, so I'm wondering if Dave includes any plan views of the aircraft in the instructions. Depending on the accuracy of the model they could provide you with the drawings you need. They would be easy enough to include. If not you could always ask if they are available. They could even be done at 1/18 scale. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 14, 2017 Author Share Posted March 14, 2017 4 hours ago, moaning dolphin said: Don't mind if I tag along in the back ground do you? I like the tutor and often see them in our plant as they come through for resprays. We had a couple of naked ones in a week or so ago, a very compact machine. Looking forward to seeing how you tackle this one! Bob Hello, Bob! Yes, please do tag along. Just so you understand this is a journey and not a race. I hope to get there but am taking my time about it. Are you an AMT? Our eldest son is studying for his General right now. Thank you for coming and welcome aboard! 26 minutes ago, dave665 said: Looking at Dave's build log of the CL-41 you could be in for a treat. The kit was produced from a 3D model, so I'm wondering if Dave includes any plan views of the aircraft in the instructions. Depending on the accuracy of the model they could provide you with the drawings you need. They would be easy enough to include. If not you could always ask if they are available. They could even be done at 1/18 scale. Dave Dave/All, Well, I can answer the question of drawings in the plans for the 1:33 Tutor. No, none found here. I did purchase the Snowbirds Toot this morning. It looks well thought out and the artwork is excellent but no detailed 3-view drawings. I am very interested in your find on the builder's blog. That's an angle to chase down! (I will contact him on that front today) Thank you again for all of your interest and support! PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank00 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Why are you not starting from an existing 3d model? Like this here 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moaning dolphin Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 2 hours ago, Pastor Rich said: Hello, Bob! Yes, please do tag along. Just so you understand this is a journey and not a race. I hope to get there but am taking my time about it. Are you an AMT? Our eldest son is studying for his General right now. Thank you for coming and welcome aboard! Im not an AMT, I have qualifications from the Royal Navy which allows me to do what I do in the company (some may cruelly say I don't do a lot anyway!). Its a good thing to get into though. 2 hours ago, dave665 said: Looking at Dave's build log of the CL-41 you could be in for a treat. Oh I do wish I hadn't seen this, I have had a go at transferring a ship from paper to plastic and it is going quite well, who'd have thought I could do the same with aircraft! Interesting possibilities.......(must clear stash first, must clear stash first, must clear stash first.....) Looking forward to a long and winding journey! Bob 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 14, 2017 Author Share Posted March 14, 2017 42 minutes ago, Frank00 said: Why are you not starting from an existing 3d model? Like this here Hmmm, I was not aware of this. Worth looking into for overall form and developing cross sections. Thanks for sharing! Sorry to have added to the pile on your plate Bob! I share your pain, in 1:18th scale!! Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave665 Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) PA I've just sent you a PM regarding plans of the CL-41. But they may not be for the correct version of the Tutor. Edited March 14, 2017 by dave665 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank00 Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 Something like this can maybe help you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 15, 2017 Author Share Posted March 15, 2017 1 hour ago, Frank00 said: Something like this can maybe help you. Hi Frank00, Indeed! Thank you for sharing! I purchased this kit yesterday and may be able to use it as a starting point. It offers no details like panels so is no use in that regard. I also downloaded SketchUp 2017 and started playing with a 3D model that was shared of the Tutor. It is an interesting model but not really helpful for my purposes. My next stops are going to be the creator of the paper model and Bombardier. (They absorbed all that was Canadair if memory serves) Thanks for your keen interest and chipping in! Your support is so encouraging!! PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 19, 2017 Author Share Posted March 19, 2017 (edited) Morning All! I took some time today for more searching for detail photos and 3-view drawings of the Toot. This included digging on contacts at Bombardier and combing through museum offerings. It's not a Tutor (although it has a VSTOL concept version in it) but I found this gem: https://documents.techno-science.ca/documents/CASM-Aircrafthistories-CanadairCL-84VSTOLhistory.pdf Sadly, I didn't find anything there (yet) that is helpful for my work; but I think I had a hit while searching old magazine articles online. It looks like AVIATION NEWS ran a story on the Tutor in 1989 that features scale plans for the CL-41. I have a copy on order so will have to wait and see if it has the detail that I'm looking for. The good news is that I have a good collection of detail photos in the bucket and digging for more. Work has kept me busy so no work on my new workspace or computer -- just increasing the size of the image archive which I will be sharing to those interested. (If I keep this up much longer, I'll have to write a book on the subject!) Cheers! PR Edited March 19, 2017 by Pastor Rich To err is human. Proof readers untie! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyverns4 Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 Hi PR, This looks like rather a lot of fun; mind if I sit quietly at the back and enjoy the unfolding story? Christian, exiled to africa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 19, 2017 Author Share Posted March 19, 2017 50 minutes ago, wyverns4 said: Hi PR, This looks like rather a lot of fun; mind if I sit quietly at the back and enjoy the unfolding story? Christian, exiled to africa Hey Christian! Mind? Please do! Thanks for coming!! I'm having fun with this so far and hope to be posting pictures soon. So forgive me if I think out loud and share the processes I go through in working on this project. Much of this is about the planning and in this case; there is little available for good (accurate) detailed technical drawings of the CT-114 (CL-41) publicly available. I have high hopes on the article I found from AVIATION NEWS and will share results as soon as I have it in hand. (It's coming from the UK) Cheers! PR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 19, 2017 Author Share Posted March 19, 2017 Here's an interesting find from the Canadian Aviation Museum from page 29 of the document by Bill Upton linked above ("The Design and Development History of the Canadair CL-84 V/STOL Tilt-Wing Aircraft"). This page discusses the VSTOL concept CL-41J that proposed using three (3) Rolls Royce RB162's as direct lifting engines in addition to the Orenda-built J85-CAN-40 for normal flight. A great topic for a "What-if" modeller! PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyverns4 Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 Many thanks for the warm welcome! Thinking aloud is great and usually helped by talking to yourself, (to arrive at the required answer). Christian, exiled to africa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 19, 2017 Author Share Posted March 19, 2017 G'day All, I've been enjoying some wake-up time today working on the Toot. Sorting out and studying photo references for details that I want to build (especially the pit and IP). I have also been working on construction drawings as a response to reading Dave Winfield's blog of his Snowbirds prototype. A review of the paper model I purchased and the blog have been a help, especially in terms of looking for problem areas before I build. One of those areas is the tail. The vertical tail and junction of the horizontal stab are very delicate in the paper model (not much to hold it together), so I am planning on building a one-piece spar that is the vertical and horizontal stab. The vertical stabilizer will have a hollow core "sleeve" so that it can be dropped onto a long tab that is part of the dorsal "keel" of the airframe. I'm thinking about making the vertical tail removable if for transportation or storage. (We'll see how that works out) I have good photo references of the forward and rear bulkheads that are the junction point between the front half of the plane and the tail section. Those will form the junction of the two major sections of the fuselage for the model. This should make it easier to do final assembly of the bits of the engine that will be visible via the tail pipe. (Keep in mind I am not planning on detailing the interior of this build so I am not planning on building the engine proper -- only the front and rear faces that are visible). Overall, I think that Dave Winfield has a winner of a design and that he, and his designer, have captured the look and feel of the Snowbirds Tutor. You can see his photo album of the completed model here. Dave also did a video on vacu-forming the canopy which was interesting. He admits to being a noob when it comes to vacu-forming so if you're looking for a solid primer on DIY canopies, I'd suggest catching the video from Dr Paul Budzik about doing vac canopies, or any of a number of other advanced modelers online, if to learn that art. If you're into paper models or want to join in building one of these now, or in the future, I recommend ordering one of his kits and give it a go. The paper models are $8 (USD) each, downloadable and look fun! Thanks for stopping by! PR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 Good Evening All, The crew is back from church and enjoying some quiet time before bed. That affords me some minutes on the Tutor! I've been thinking about the size and measurements of this project. I hope to donate this build in the future and think that 1:18 scale isn't quite right. The 1:1 dimensions of the Tutor are: Wingspan: 11.12m Length: 9.75m Wanting a build big enough to be seen while not so big that it is imposing, I've decided to change the design to 1:10 scale. That makes for easy conversion of measurements and a good sized plane for display. That will give me a model of 111.2cm wingspan and 97.5cm length. This should give me a cockpit large enough to see some detail as I hope to build. So 1/10 scale it shall be! I am considering finding a museum with a specimen to get measurements and photos from! Hopefully that can happen late Spring to early Summer during a planned trip to Ontario. My periodicals have been shipped and are on the way. I can't wait to see if they have the details that I need to get started on the basic airframe plans. More soon on that front! Thanks for stopping by! PR 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_W Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Looks interesting. I see a touch of Provost in there, and a pinch of T37. All with a dash of Canadian chutzpah. Oh, and there is a bloke on here does instrument decals, models a bit too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave665 Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) Wow a square metre of Snowbird... that is BIG! I had seen that the Tutor was in an old copy of Aviation News. They will be 1/72 scale plans so they fit on a page of the magazine. If they are typical of the time they are likely to be hand drawn. You may struggle to get them to 1/10 scale with the required detail. It's a shame that Dave Winfield doesn't include 3-view drawings in his paper model. The ones included in other 1/33 scale kits like the P38 Lightning and F7F Tigercat by Fly Model look very good. There are certainly a lot of good photos of the Tutor out there. But have you seen the video at the top of this page at LearnToFly.ca? It begins with Captain Parker doing a walk around check of the Tutor and a detailed look around the cockpit. Has some interesting stuff on the cockpit of a Snowbird. Dave Edited March 23, 2017 by dave665 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 2 hours ago, John_W said: Oh, and there is a bloke on here does instrument decals, models a bit too. Hi John, Indeed! I believe you're talking about Peter of Airscale fame? I have been following his work since his Sea Fury and, like many around here, love his work and admire his artistry. Great stuff and inspirational to this project. I started this project with using his modern jets kit as core to the pit in mind, but have decided on doing my own instruments, placards and stencils as graphics has been my speciality for over 30-years. I will be experimenting with doing my own photo-etch as well for instrument bezels but cannot imagine not having questions for Peter along the way! 2 hours ago, dave665 said: Wow a square metre of Snowbird... that is BIG! I had seen that the Tutor was in an old copy of Aviation News. They will be 1/72 scale plans so they fit on a page of the magazine. If they are typical of the time they are likely to be hand drawn. You may struggle to get them to 1/10 scale with the required detail. It's a shame that Dave Winfield doesn't include 3-view drawings in his paper model. The ones included in other 1/33 scale kits like the P38 Lightning and F7F Tigercat by Fly Model look very good. There are certainly a lot of good photos of the Tutor out there. But have you seen the video at the top of this page at LearnToFly.ca? It begins with Captain Parker doing a walk around check of the Tutor and a detailed look around the cockpit. Has some interesting stuff on the cockpit of a Snowbird. Dave Dave, Yes! A square meter for the Tutor. Thanks for the advance report on the article! I'm really looking forward to getting it and expected that any illustrations would be at 1:72. That's not a problem as I plan on using those as template for a fresh drawing in CorelDraw. (Another product of Canada) Contacting Dave Winfield is still on my radar as well as Bombardier, even a museum or two for drawings, but I am assuming that I will not find much and may resort to finding a Tutor to get measurements from for greater detail. Getting the cross-section and profiles right are of most importance to me right now. The core build-up will take a bit of work so I am expecting (and hoping) for my travels to be blessed with a Tutor along the way. Thank you for the link to LearToFly.ca. I am aware of the site but have not yet gone through it. I will be watching with interest! Thanks for chiming in guys and as always, thank you for stopping by! PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 An item of interest: I had thought to post this to Peter's (Airscale) build of Race #80 but rather than hijack his post with another builder's project, I decided to put it into my own. http://www.spitfireinmyworkshop.net/book/ Spitfire In My Workshop This may be old news to some but it's new to me and I like it so here it is! Another builder in litho who spent a decade building a model and made a book out of the project. Looks like I'll have to make room on my bookshelf for just one more title! Cheers! PR 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 26, 2017 Author Share Posted March 26, 2017 A quick update: I have been swamped with work but have managed to collect more references over the week and study photos of the cockpit that I may become familiar with what I am going to build. So far the pit looks straight forward and should be a good exercise for a scratch-build. Many thanks to Tony Edmundson for sharing his photo collection and knowledge having worked on the Tutor. I am still waiting for the items on order to arrive and still have that desktop computer to rebuild for doing the CAD work. May your week be a blessed one! PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted March 28, 2017 Author Share Posted March 28, 2017 Hello guys and gals! My Christmas 1988 back issue of AVIATION NEWS MAGAZINE arrived today and I hit the jackpot! Excellent three view drawings with cross sections of fuselage and wings. Drawings for both the CL-41A and G-model. They are of very good quality and occupy the centerfold of the magazine. A lift of a couple of staples and I'll be scanning soon but redrawing the artwork to scale will have to wait a couple of weeks due to a business trip; but expect my artwork to be available once done! This is a major hurdle traversed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted April 29, 2017 Author Share Posted April 29, 2017 (edited) Greetings All! Back in town from my business trip and have made some progress in my workspace and tools. It may not be much to look at but this is where I'll be doing the digital portion of this build. Some shopping yielded a folding table, Dell ATG 6430 and 26" monitor and laptop and a copy of Corel Graphics Suite X8. I'm used to CorelDraw 10 so X8 will take a little for me to get used to. Our youngest sons are into bobble heads thus the Bobble Vader. (Our dog loves making off when them as well. Apparently, she thinks they make great chew toys). The CF-100 is my inspiration to finish the CT-114 as that may be my next scratch build (that or a P-38 from my huge Guillows kit). The books are either Bibles or church planter-related. The Redbox DVD is "Hillsong The Movie". Sorry, no red staplers but it is a Swingline! : ) Here are the print references I found. Some of you may recognise them from your diggings online to help with this project... ...and the gems held within... Coupled with the walkaround photos sent by Tony E (as well as those that I collected online) and the paper model from Dave Winfield I bought before my trip and I think we have an excellent start to this project. Too much more and I'll have to write a book pooling all of this stuff into one place! Time to get scanning and start the drawings for the 1:1 plans. Thanks for coming by! Cheers! PR Edited April 29, 2017 by Pastor Rich To err is human. Proof readers untie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted May 10, 2017 Author Share Posted May 10, 2017 Greetings All, Work has kept me busy as has to get our boys through the rest of the school year so not much to show for the CT-114. While trolling around online I found these stories I thought I would share: http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/joint-snowbirds-patrouille-de-france-flyby-set-for-945-a-m Snowbirds Rock Parliament Hill (Video feat. Paul Faulkner #11) <--- Perhaps a long lost relative? http://vancouverisland.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1101156 Snowbirds in Comox for Canada 150 Season Practice Pastor Rich Faulkner (aka "PR") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Rich Posted May 25, 2017 Author Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) Greetings All, Sorry gang, but I have not made progress on my build due to work and school schedules. I did however find an interesting video via The Aviationist that I felt worth sharing. It is the story of a B-58 crew on a training flight out of Carswell, AFB that suffered a gear failure on take-off and ended their mission at Edwards, AFB having flown with gear down the whole way! In air refueling and all!! An impressive feat by a crew that exemplified professionalism in my view. See the video at : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZu_ONVE90Y I hope you enjoy the video and hope to have something for you to see (of a modelling variety) here soon. PR Edited May 25, 2017 by Pastor Rich To err is human, proof readers untie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now