Geoff_B Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 If it was an F-4 they were scanning, I'd be surprised to get an announcement anytime soon as they would need to process the data, THEN put together the CAD etc - it's not often Airfix announce something without having at least the CAD to display, if not also having the test shots ready. Having said that, anyone remember they spoke about a research trip to Yeovilton in February - nothing yet announced that would match that, and the FAAM has a Phantom too...... Actually they have two as there is another FG1 on the base that came back from the RAF and has been repainted as an 892 squadron aircraft. The one in the Carrier hall is probably better however as in original scheme and full of stencils. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_B Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Nah, that'll be a new Fulmar,Avenger, Ohka, (Sea) Vampire, Concorde, Hunter T8M... ...and then there the goodies in the reserve collection... Don't forget the Historic flight as the Sea Vixen is with them now as well. You also missed an obvious one the Martlet as they could be getting the details correct for a FAA Martlet to follow on from the Wildcat. However if Airfix were at Yeovilton and doing the Phantom, I suspect they would have probably closed the Carrier hall to allow the standard lighting to be used so they may well have measured other types in that Hall to record the data for future reference. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenshirt Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 There's no radar used, it's a laser scanner that just scans the exterior. With helos I would assume you'd get cluttered data through the large transparencies but framework of the tail booms of an H-13 or Alouette should show up ok. Then again I'm no expert on it so I'm probably talking a load of nonsense! Anyone know if they use multiple scanners or just one that gets moved around the subject to get the full data? Paul Harrison There was one photo last year at Telford of the LIDAR'd H-3 (raw image) and it showed all the bits inside that were visible from the outside. And yes they also put the LIDAR inside to capture interior detail. Pretty cool to see how the process evolved from scan it to mold it. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Well much as the Phantom is one of my all time Fave planes. (Actually its my first love in avaiation) I am guessing that an Initial tooling for the Rolls Royce version would be Very popular as it but I imagine it would then be not to hard to offer US and German Versions which I am sure would also be very welcome the world over it could be a great money maker for Airfix. Please give us some Phantoms Airfix 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troffa Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 There are three hangars of that design at DX. Ah, Inspector Lestrade I presume- I deduct that you did not read my entire post, to whit: " Unless of course it's actually in another hangar" . "The game is afoot. Not a word! Into your clothes and come!" :-) It had still better be 1/48! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus.Q1000859 Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 There's no radar used, it's a laser scanner that just scans the exterior. With helos I would assume you'd get cluttered data through the large transparencies but framework of the tail booms of an H-13 or Alouette should show up ok. Then again I'm no expert on it so I'm probably talking a load of nonsense! Anyone know if they use multiple scanners or just one that gets moved around the subject to get the full data? Paul Harrison I have worked some with the point cloud data from 3D scans. Often it is just a single scanner used. Placards are placed in the area to be scanned to represent the positions the scanner will be placed for the successive scans, the position of which is visible in the scans and is used when all the separate files from each scan position are stitched together later into a single point cloud model. What you then have is a model with many millions of points in space but no surfaces or defined objects. An operator with some skill and various software (depending on the desired output) will then generate a 3D model from the information. The laser scanner also mounts an optical camera. The output of which is invaluable in letting the operator see clearly what the point cloud represents. You tend to jump around in these video feeds from the various scans to find the contour of surfaces which can be hard to follow if they are at a shallow angle to the scanner. shallow angles and highly reflective and refractive surfaces can cause scatter and other issues so you need to know what the scan actually represents. If you google 'point cloud scan' you can see images from scans. Please remember these images are not the raw data, but just a processed visual representation of that data. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Ah, Inspector Lestrade I presume- I deduct that you did not read my entire post, to whit: " Unless of course it's actually in another hangar" . "The game is afoot. Not a word! Into your clothes and come!" :-) It had still better be 1/48! Nope, 1/72nd first! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giorgio N Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) Well much as the Phantom is one of my all time Fave planes. (Actually its my first love in avaiation) I am guessing that an Initial tooling for the Rolls Royce version would be Very popular as it but I imagine it would then be not to hard to offer US and German Versions which I am sure would also be very welcome the world over it could be a great money maker for Airfix. Please give us some Phantoms Airfix Realistically, making different versions of a Phantom would require different fuselages and different wings. If Airfix will offer a Spey powered variant, they may be able to mould the kit so that with a new fuselage and other parts a C/D or a J could be done. Not easy at all but could be done. Some other fuselage bits could lead to an early E. Later Es and Fs would require slats on the wings. An S would require slats too but different from the ones used on the E Really catering for all variants would require a very modular approach, with all the problems in terms of fit of such moulds. We'd talking different fuselages, maybe a common central wing section with different outer parts. Not to mention a large number of different details (tailplanes, exhausts, wheels) and a number of inserts for the different details (catapult hooks or not, antennas, etc.) Can it be done ? It sure can. Would it be worth it ? Hmmm.... not sure... Personally I would probably prefer separate kits for the UK and US variants. Edited October 9, 2015 by Giorgio N 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truro Model Builder Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Remember that the vast majority of Airfix's sales are in the UK. We are the biggest market for them, and the US or Europe is -and will always be- secondary. So if they do a Phantom, I do not think that trying to build commonality to allow Spey and J79 variants will even enter into it. The only options will be standard or RWR fin, weapons and the FG.1's slats and extended nosewheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caution Wake Turbulence Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Nope, 1/72nd first! Compromise? 1/60th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robvulcan Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Realistically, making different versions of a Phantom would require different fuselages and different wings. If Airfix will offer a Spey powered variant, they may be able to mould the kit so that with a new fuselage and other parts a C/D or a J could be done. Not easy at all but could be done. Some other fuselage bits could lead to an early E. Later Es and Fs would require slats on the wings. An S would require slats too but different from the ones used on the E Really catering for all variants would require a very modular approach, with all the problems in terms of fit of such moulds. We'd talking different fuselages, maybe a common central wing section with different outer parts. Not to mention a large number of different details (tailplanes, exhausts, wheels) and a number of inserts for the different details (catapult hooks or not, antennas, etc.) Can it be done ? It sure can. Would it be worth it ? Hmmm.... not sure... Personally I would probably prefer separate kits for the UK and US variants. Well I did not realize that but thought it may not be as simple as I had assumed. Its never simple is it. Well they do lots of spits, Harriers etc. Why not Phantoms I would prefer a non compromised model of the RAF RN types but would also welcome the other variants if they could compete with existing molds from other Manufactures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hacker Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 They had a phantom in the old range so does not surprise me if they do USN/USMC/USAF version but the real want is the RN/RAF version. We will see in the fullness of time. I see though other versions of the Beaufighter and the Whittle are coming out. Still hoping for a decent Beafort along with a host of other kits that need replacing in their range Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Compromise? 1/60th? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashman Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Could be...could be... They certainly know how popular British phantoms are! Often in swap and sell situations they are the models in highest demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent K Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Pretty sure there's a Gannet and a Buccaneer in that hanger too. Wrong hangar! They are in 3 this looks to be in 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepureness Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 either way, I am 100% sure that those 2 pictures have been taken in the same building, and providing the aircraft have not been moved, that scanner is facing the phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight_Flyer Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Well I did not realize that but thought it may not be as simple as I had assumed. Its never simple is it. Well they do lots of spits, Harriers etc. Why not Phantoms I would prefer a non compromised model of the RAF RN types but would also welcome the other variants if they could compete with existing molds from other Manufactures. With the Phantom it certainly isn't, hence it's usual to see separate boxings for C/D and E as different molds is required. British Phantoms would be a good starting point as Fujimi is the only noteworthy brand to have produced them. they're also hard to find. If Airfix managed to come up with a high quality kit then yes they could look to the other versions confident they can compete with the current offerings. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightningboy2000 Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Wrong hangar! They are in 3 this looks to be in 4. The roofs of both are exactly the same apart from Owl droppings and Wasp Spider cobwebs! No-one's mentioned the Buccaneer yet which sits in the corner of Hangar 4. That scanner as it stands could easily scan that Bucc in one go if it's where I think/know it is. Since no other manufacturer has tooled a new 1/72 Buccaneer yet then we might be in with a treat. I'm sure there are enough Fujigawa 1/72 Phantoms out in the ether to be getting on with. Apart from that, Airfix were spotted scanning the T-33 which isn't located in any of the Belfast Truss hangars, so they must have been scanning more than one airframe. Me, I'm dearly hoping they will down scale their 1/48 Javelin! Martin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomphan92 Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Agree, as much as I would like a new spey you can still get the fujimi ones and they are decent kits. You cant get a decent Buccaneer so if it came to a choice I'd go Bucc all the way!! I've said on another thread that being the anniversary of the gulf war it is the absolute right time to do one. Airfix have said themselves that the plan to release specific kits to coincide with historic aviation anniversaries' has been a massive success so why stop now!! I'm in sales and marketing myself and based on how well that department within Airfix seems to have done recently I'd find it ridiculous if they didn't do a Bucc for a January 16 release, that said I have the same opinion reference a Victor, if I was in their Sales/marketing department I'd be asking why that isn't on the cards for January as well. From a business point of view they could release a new Buccaneer and Victor as part of a limited edition gulf war set along with a Tornado GR1, lets be honest they could price it at £60 and we'd all buy it, take the two new kits that we're desperate for and throw the tornado away!! Why do it - cos it gets rid of the old stock of the old tornado mould which then allows them to start work on a long overdue retool without loosing any money!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich G Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 The fast jet subjects in the Airfix catalogue like the phantom, tornado, jaguar and buccaneer all need bringing up to date so it would be nice to have Airfix look at these subjects. The fact that the Phantom they are potentially scanning with their LIDAR scanner is an FGR.2 means they could do an FG.1 as well. I would expect an FGR.2/FG.1 boxing as they love to cover the British only subjects, but I would love it if they covered the major US and export versions as well, hopefully they are also scanning a couple other aircraft at the same time! If I was running Airfix and was given permission to scan the aircraft at Duxford I'd scan everything they have!! Rich 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomphan92 Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Yeah why not, if you're given the freedom of Duxford scan everything and then take your pick as to the order that you kit the subjects!! I was bought up sitting at the end of 09 at wildenrath so nothing would please me more than a new FGR2 with a pile of decals for 92 and 19. Fed up with searching, finally finding and then having to pay a fortune for fujimi kits, and after all that there's no decent decals available anyway!! But still, they can be found, a Bucc however, no chance, that's a kit we need even more so. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich G Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 When you look at the last few years of Airfix offerings, we haven't had many modern subjects as they have mainly stuck to the pre WW2, WW2 and early post WW2 era. We obviously have the Lightning F.2a and F.6, Bae Hawk, Harrier GR.1/3 and that's about it for any 70's, 80's and 90's era aircraft so far. I'm glad that we're getting a new Seaking HC.4 and hopefully some further versions after that, but there are so many other aircraft which they could easily research and provide, particularly the Tornado, Jaguar, Buccaneer, Typhoon and possibly a jet provost. I need to whisper now................also it would be nice to have a victor and vulcan..............you never know! Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VMA131Marine Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 When you look at the last few years of Airfix offerings, we haven't had many modern subjects as they have mainly stuck to the pre WW2, WW2 and early post WW2 era. We obviously have the Lightning F.2a and F.6, Bae Hawk, Harrier GR.1/3 and that's about it for any 70's, 80's and 90's era aircraft so far. I'm glad that we're getting a new Seaking HC.4 and hopefully some further versions after that, but there are so many other aircraft which they could easily research and provide, particularly the Tornado, Jaguar, Buccaneer, Typhoon and possibly a jet provost. I need to whisper now................also it would be nice to have a victor and vulcan..............you never know! Rich Shackleton and Nimrod should count as 70's/80's era aircraft. There's also the Lynxes and Merlin HC.3 in 1/48. Don't forget that Airfix did a new tool Harrier GR.7/9 as well. Per Airfix's most recent announcement, the JP T.3/3a is coming next year. But, point taken that the Tornado, Jaguar, Buccaneer and Typhoon are still only represented by legacy tooling from the pre-Hornby era. The Tornado and Typhoon are particularly poor in comparison to competitors' kits that are available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truro Model Builder Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 A modern Typhoon could be a very good option for Airfix. Shows that they are 'bang up to date'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhantomBigStu Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 agree, hasegawas is exellent, but unless you buy them one at at time from japan, ain't cheap at all (and even then hardly cheap), an airfix one would do well, 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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