White Knight - Short Crusader

[greggles.w]

8 hours ago, Fastcat said:

Just for information, Planet models do (or did) a long and short wing Hughes 1B in 1/48th and Kiwi Resin do a Mew Gull

 

Thanks Dave, yes I have spied the Planet Models H1s. It's nice to have them available if I really stuff up that Noix kit (don't know where I'd find another of them!).

 

I too have a Kiwi Models Mew Gull awaiting attention. Just one, labeled as the Kings Cup version.  But I note you say it might need 'some mods to the nose' to be correctly so? I might need to get in touch for more information when the time comes .. unless you post a WIP thread here sooner which I can follow!

 

8 hours ago, Fastcat said:

 

I too have a Crusader

 

This same kit or Karaya's 1/72 version? Or perhaps as I saw just the other week for sale: a much older white metal 1/72 C.A.Atkins kit?

[Fastcat]

Hi greggles,

                         The Noix kits have a really good reputation so I think you'll find the Hughes pretty decent to build. They were made by a Japanese enthusiast and it seems such a pity that they disappeared. Like a lot of good "garage" kits, they go when the maker finds it too difficult to keep up with demand or just gets fed up of pouring resin. Wonder where the moulds went. I've never seen one of his kits but the Racing and Record Breaking SIG of IPMS rated them very highly.

There was a very good article on the Hughes 1B in the Historical Aviation Album vol. XVI by Paul R Matt, complete with detailed drawings. I don't know how accurate the drawings are (some of his drawings are criticised by those supposedly "in the know" but then whose aren't?). The Planet kit is close enough to have used them. Whatever, the photos are good and very useful. One thing to watch is that the overall finish isn't the bright polished finish of the reconstruction. It's more of a dull polish, very smooth but not reflective.

 

The Kiwi Mew Gull ZS-AHM is configured for the Schlesinger Race and as such can be made into any of the aircraft which took part in that race (it's good because it has the standard canopy) but the surviving aircraft had many subsequent "go faster" mods, particularly Henshaw's. It very much depends upon which of the King's Cup Races you intend to model. In 1937, Henshaw's aircraft had a very standard nose, ie. blunt spinner, fairly upright intake. In '38, it was more like the Cape Dash aircraft, lowered rear deck, different canopy, different wheel spats, sleeker nose and pointy spinner.

G-AEKL under different owners had pointy spinner, sleeker intake (very like the Cape Dash version), standard canopy and standard wheel spats. There's a good diagram in Flight Global to illustrate this, also Henshaw's book Flight of the Mew Gull has illustrations of all the alterations he made in different races. Best advice is to choose a subject and get as many photos as possible. I've got a fair amount of info so you're welcome to anything that might help.

 

I've got the Karaya 1/48th Crusader. I had the C. A. Atkins kit but sold it when I bought the Karaya model. I'm not sure where Karaya got their information from. It differs from the Atkins model and as you've discovered, has wrongly interpreted engine helmets. I intended to make mine with the exposed engine and I bought a motor from Neomega for that purpose. It'll need the cylinder barrels shortening a little as per the original or it will appear oversized but it's not too difficult a job.

I'm stalled on aircraft at the moment. I've got a number of car kits (my main interest) to finish but articles like yours have made me dig out my aircraft stuff again, so who knows.....................?

There's also a Gloster VI by Wiener Modellbau I've started...........................  

 

Dave

Edited December 18, 2016 by Fastcat

[greggles.w]

Hello all, back at it!

 

First, an apology: I have only now uncovered Mike's thread with recommended image size guidance, and I realise now that most of my earlier posts have images which are well above the nominated size.  From here on in they should be correct ... photobucket willing ...

 

SO I've had a go at vacforming, what a magical process that is!!  Much trial & error, but it really is amazing that if it doesn't work, just put it back in the oven & the sheet pulls flat again .. amazing!  What this allowed for was many, many experiments with temp, time, vacuum power etc.

 

My chief problem was what I now know is called 'webbing' due to the tall, thin & pointy proportions of the balsa 'buck'.  With a little advice sourced online & further trial & error I got a working process, using a tall plinth under the buck to pull the buck up above the webbing .. like so - here's the first successful test form!

 

 

& here is the same test form once free of all that draped plastic ...

 

 

So it seems I have a proven process to run through!

 

However, I think I need to spend a little more time on refining the balsa buck before I get 'mass production' of the 8 cowl helmets underway:

 

- The front & top spine 'ridge' needs to be sharpened up a little, it looks too rounded;

- The rear end (seen left image above) needs to be more 'pinched', greater taper;

- & generally I need to be a little more thorough with sanding the buck to a smooth finish, as the rough surface is coming through to the plastic.

 

Back to it!

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[Brandy]

Nice tip, I hadn't heard that one before  and it certainly seems to work! I've heard that sealing the buck with thin CA then sanding it stops the rough finish, if that's any help......

 

Ian

Edited January 26, 2017 by limeypilot

[greggles.w]

On ‎26‎/‎01‎/‎2017 at 11:07 AM, limeypilot said:

Nice tip, I hadn't heard that one before

 

Thanks Ian.  I should have also noted two other tips which also helped:

 

- the first was when you take the plastic out of the oven, have the vacuum switched off & pull the plastic down over the buck first, then turn on the vacuum.  This means the vacuum is only pulling the plastic inward - towards the buck - and not also downward.  It seems when the vacuum pulls downward this creates excessive stretch which in turn results in webbing ... so they say!;

- the other essential tip I neglected to pass on - which I confirmed through experience - is that you need to shape the plinth so it is something of a continuation of the shape it supports, but also slightly undercut.  See image below on left - note it took a few rounds of carving the plinth to learn this lesson.  You can see how the angles of the buck are carried down into the plinth.  Otherwise you just get more webbing at the upper level where plinth meets buck ... which defeats the whole exercise!

 

 

On ‎26‎/‎01‎/‎2017 at 11:07 AM, limeypilot said:

I've heard that sealing the buck with thin CA then sanding it stops the rough finish, if that's any help......

 

Thanks again Ian, yes I had heard this too.  In fact I had applied CA as you suggest, but it didn't cover evenly & I think the lumps 'n bumps were actually from the set CA, not the balsa.  I have now attended to my re-shaping tasks, and in the process sanded the CA coat off.  I've elected just to sand with micromesh and not to CA.  The latest test form (see above) has turned out nice & smooth.  (The form is improved too, I'm very happy to report!)

 

Another coffee is in order, then back to it!

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[greggles.w]

Next, two jigs.

 

Jig 1.  To help me to scribe - using a sharpened square-section kitchen skewer - a horizontal line around the top of the cowl, where the top & side panels meet.  My scribing is pretty atrocious, so no picture of the result.  In any case it is only a very tentative scribe which will later be covered by fine piano hinge resin decal.  The scribe line will also help with final fitting of each helmet to the cowl, as the line should run parallel to the fuselage.

 

 

Jig 2.  To set out the holes in the helmets: larger forward hole for exhaust, smaller rear hole for the ignition plug which protruded from the helmet.  This jig is double ended.  Flip the part end-to-end and reverse the drill template to do the other side.  Part held in place by double-sided tape on the base.

 

 

In both cases the balsa buck stays inside to hold the shape.  Funnily enough, my buck now has four tiny holes in it!

 

After the above, buck comes out & it's time to shape the bottom to fit the cowl.  As my earlier cowl subassembly is less than perfect, each helmet will need to be fettled to suit ... so I'm going to have to keep track of each one right through detailing & painting until they're finally fixed on.  I'm thinking a bit off tape inside with a number??

 

Here's a first effort:

 

 

 

 

... on reviewing these images I think it's sitting a bit too high.  Will need to shave a little more off the bottom, both sides.

 

And I think that's where I'll finish for today.  Thanks for looking in.

 

 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[AdrianMF]

Just caught up with this and I'm blown away by the detailing. And we are on page three and you haven't touched a kit part yet You have provided some very useful vacforming tips too - I will be trying them out the next time my vacformer comes out!

 

Regards,

Adrian

[Caerbannog]

Very nice progress. you should really consider to make a mold of your cowling and sell me a resin copy :-D

René

[roadrunner]

Hello,

very impressive and instructive works.

3 hours ago, Caerbannog said:

Very nice progress. you should really consider to make a mold of your cowling and sell me a resin copy :-D

René

I'm aggry with you.

But how to cast properly such thin part?

Steph.

[Caerbannog]

Just now, roadrunner said:

Hello,

very impressive and instructive works.

I'm aggry with you.

But how to cast properly such thin part?

Steph.

 

I am in good faith Greggles finds out ;-)

[Fastcat]

Hi Greggles,

                          You're doing a fine job on these, far superior to the kit. Nice work.

 

Dave

[greggles.w]

Thanks all,

 

22 hours ago, AdrianMF said:

And we are on page three and you haven't touched a kit part yet

 

Yes, indeed Adrian this cowl has turned into quite a diversion... I glance over at the plane every now & then and think: I'm going to build that one day!!

 

18 hours ago, roadrunner said:

such thin part

 

Indeed Steph, as I was finishing up yesterday I had a new challenge to ponder: the vac cowl is quite thin just as you say, such that it 'glows' translucent.  I'm hoping that as all the parts come together & the paint goes on this effect is diminished. Not least because too much light in there reveals there are no cylinders within - & I really had thought I needn't do those too.

 

As further insurance I've identified areas within which I can paint matt black to stop the light bouncing around.

 

Thanks again all, your interest is most encouraging.

[Brandy]

You're probably going to need something in there anyway, either to mount the exhausts on, or to stop the open view through the exhaust ports. a simple lump of black painted plastic should do the trick....or, you do have the resin cylinders, and the heads won't be visible.....could you use them to make a simple mould to cast some cylinder shaped resin ones that will fill the void?

Ian

[greggles.w]

On ‎28‎/‎01‎/‎2017 at 0:41 AM, limeypilot said:

You're probably going to need something in there anyway, either to mount the exhausts on, or to stop the open view through the exhaust ports. a simple lump of black painted plastic should do the trick....or, you do have the resin cylinders

 

Yes, thanks Ian, I was prepared to address the exhausts - more on this soon hopefully - I guess I was hoping the gloom in there would negate the need for the cylinders.  But as you say, the Vector resin ones are on standby ...

 

Well today I set about mass production .. but unfortunately hit a setback straight up.  It seems in my enthusiasm to get the first vac form underway, I didn't have the sheet quite soft enough.  It was soft enough for me to pull down over the buck, but when I flicked on the vacuum it didn't pull to shape.  Instead there was a terrible creaking timbers sound, like a tall ship changing course, as the too-stiff plastic was pressing down.  By the time I reacted & switched the vacuum off, the damage was done: the plastic had pushed down the buck hard enough to crush the balsa plinth by a quarter.  Luckily no damage to the buck itself - phew! - which I can only guess might be because the cedar veneer within it gave it a little more strength, so it was the plinth that yielded under the pressure?

 

Well that set me back over an hour & half, as it threw me back into the cycle of plinth shaping & test forms ... most disheartening!

 

However, persevere!  Once back on track & underway it ran smoothly enough.  Just over an hour of production used up my sheet supply and delivered: 6x good ones - which, when combined with the two I've already processed, total the necessary 8 - plus 2x questionable ones in reserve.  Not ideal, as I would have preferred to have at least one or two equally good ones in reserve.  Guess I'll just need to be careful!

 

Here's the better six, awaiting finishing:

 

 

Two have pronounced webbing (despite following the same process??) but on close inspection the webbing sits below the part.

 

So there are a few non-modelling chores I must to attend to now.  Hopefully more time soon to free these six, then scribe, drill & trim to fit!

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[Brandy]

Have fun, we certainly are!

 

Ian

[Fastcat]

Quote

9 hours ago, greggles.w said:

6x good ones - which, when combined with the two I've already processed, total the necessary 8 - plus 2x questionable ones in reserve

 

 

Didn't the Bristol Mercury have nine cylinders?

In fact I think most radial engines have an odd number of cylinders.

 

Dave

Edited January 28, 2017 by Fastcat

[greggles.w]

38 minutes ago, Fastcat said:

Didn't the Bristol Mercury have nine cylinders?

 

Hi Dave, yes you're quite right, 9 cylinders for the Mercury.

 

However the cowl for the top cylinder was significantly different, being shaped to meet the top of fuselage fairing leading back to the cockpit.  So while the front of that helmet is the same as the other 8, it's not as tall, and quickly takes a squarish section, before a top & two triangular side cutouts for exiting airflow.

 

All of which means I'm not packing the vacform box away just yet ... I'm going to have to carve up a new buck & go through all the above again just for that one custom helmet!

 

But first to finish the other eight ...

[Fastcat]

Ah, I see, forgot the top one was different.

Keep up the good work, this is a great thread.

 

Dave

[greggles.w]

Incremental progress: 8x cowlings free of vacform sheets; trimmed; scribed & drilled:

 

 

 

Next a bit of tidy up & shape each to fit the cowl.

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[roadrunner]

Hello,

great work!

 

[Fastcat]

These are looking great and a vast improvement over the kit. Not sure where Karaya got their information from but it doesn't seem like they looked overly hard at photos. Neat mouldings let down by sloppy research.

You're doing a great job on this.

 

Dave

[greggles.w]

Thanks all!!

 

8x shaped to fit the cowl. I figure after the work to date I'm allowed the indulgence of a test fit.  Helmets seen here sitting over rolled Tamiya masking tape 'cylinders' ... all a bit wonky as a result .. but enough to let me think I might just pull this off!!

 

 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by greggles.w
Farewell Photobucket!

[lunarhighway]

very impressive!

[Brandy]

Beautifully done, well worth the effort!

 

Ian

[Gary West]

Well that certainly isnt "straight out of box" - very nicely done