Beardie Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Hi all, I am only currently applying myself to the idea of actually creating some form of turnbuckle/mounting eyelets for my rigging rather than glueing directly into holes in the plastic. After a day of twisting little bits of 0.3mm copper wire to form eyelets it suddenly occurred to me that I might be able to use very fine fly tying hooks (obviously with the hook snipped off to leave the eyelet and a length of the shank. I have some size 20's I picked up today which are tiny ooks but admittedly very slightly larger 'eyes' than my copper wire twists but I have now ordered some japanese size 24 (bleedin tiny ooks) which I am hopin will be even smaller. Anyways I was just wondering if anyone else had tried using fly hooks as eyelets or eve, inserted into micro tube to simulate double ended turnbuckles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreadeddrew Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Intriguing,never ceases to amaze me how just about anything can have a use in modelling! Good luck with your experiment, Andrew 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thorfinn Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Never used fly-tying bits, but recently picked up a set of HGW 1/32 spoke rigging eyelets (for WW1 a/c wheels) to use for the same purpose. (I've also spun my own, as you described, but used super-fine steel wire instead of copper---pretty quick work with a home-made jig mounted in a small hand drill chuck.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 18, 2016 Author Share Posted October 18, 2016 I found making them myself somewhat tricky with my large thick fingers. I found steel and brass wire a little too tough(Although I didn't have access to anything particularly fine) to get a decent (very small) eyelet and the pure copper wire, while soft enough to get an eyelet with a hole of 0.3mm is not very tough and the twist means that it presents a relatively thick profile if you wanted to stick in the end of a piece of Albion Alloys tubing whereas the Fishing hooks have shanks of below 0.4mm diameter for the size 20 I have here and hopefully the size 24 and 28 hooks will have even finer wire shanks. If nothing else I will have a good few hours of entertaining experimentation and the hooks are not exactly expensive. I bought three sets of Mitchell assorted hooks from size 10 to size 20 at £1.99 a set so that's 180 hooks for less than six pounds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobs_Buckles Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Try annealing the copper wire before twisting it. It has worked for me for over 10 years. Good luck! Von B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Paw Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Hi Beardie, I too have had this idea. I have been into my local fly fishing tackle shop and bought the smallest wire possible. I have used this wire along with Albion alloys thin brass tube to create my own turnbuckles. Is obviously it is tricky but works well. I have used the wire by itself to create eyelets on my 1:72 scale models, I can photograph this on my Revell Fokker Eindecker E III. It is a major benefit if you can create eyelets it solves the hole in the wing problem. Andrew. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 Thanks Andrew glad to hear that you have used the same thing and found it useful. I have just received one of those 'slide fit' sets of Albion Alloys tubing, I went for Aluminium rather than brass, (0.3 - 0.9) and I think it may very well make for some excellent Turnbuckles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lomcevak Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Hi Beardie, have you seen Tom Grigat videos on youtube? This one really impressed me about rigging biplanes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 Hi Lomcevak, no I haven't seen these videos before. Chap makes it look like childsplay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 Well the experiment is underway and the results so far are reasonably promising. Daiichi size 24 hook shanks and 0.5mm Albion Alloys Aluminium tubing. The shanks are just a little too big for the hole in the tubing but with patience and a very finely sharpened point I open the end up just enough to wedge the shank down into it and a dab of CA to finish. Fiddly and frustrating work but I am hoping the results will be good. It has also occurred to me that, instead of inserting the shank of an eye into the hole drilled in the wing I can, instead make the eye the terminal end of the line and thread a piece of 0.3mm copper wire through the eye and twist up as has been described above and then mount this into the hole giving a free moving terminal end so no worries about getting the angle that the rigging meets perfect as it will automatically assume the correct orientation. Once I have done a bit more I will try and figure out how to get some pics up on here for anyone who is interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Paw Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 and caI would like to see your photos Beardie as I am involved in trying out the same thing. I have just started drilling holes in the wing of my 1/72 scale Airfix Be2. with the idea of using wire loops attached to the rigging anchor points. I am trying to get to the situation where I can rig an aircraft whilst using the minimal amount of glue. I am allergic to super glue and can not use it and any thing else is very messy and can take a long time to dry. I use ez- line and have found it it can be attached with the thin Tamiya liquid glue it is not ideal. I have just ordered 45m x .003mm Rigging Bobbin Fine Uschi van der Rosten to replace the ez- line thread I have been using. I have used an entire spool! Do share the results of your experiments I would be very interested to see what is going on. Andrew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 An entire spool? You must have been very busy! Is it only the superglue fumes you are allergic to? If so, have you tried wearing an organic vapour mask while using it? You can get the lightweight, disposable paper ones these days or the reuseable type. If you have a spray booth with extractor I would work inside that at the same time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Paw Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Yes I was surprised my self when I came to the end of my ez line. I have completed 22 1/72 WWI bi planes so I suppose it has done well. I have replaced it with the Uschi stuff at 0.03 mm and is thinner than the ez line I have been using. I think it will be more in scale for the scale I do. I have tried everything to try and use super glue. I started with paper masks and have now got full face mask like the one that Walter White uses in breaking bad!! I have an extractor fan in my spray booth in my shed but even with all of this I still react badly to the fumes. I use two part epoxy for some bits and thin Tamiya glue for others. Both not ideal. The super glue that is the least smelly is the thick stuff but even that will get me in less than 5 minutes. The symptoms are very similar to flu. Andrew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 Sorry to hear that Andrew, it sounds like you are exceptionally sensitive to it. I think I have a slight reaction to it as I do feel some iirritation in my nose for a day or so after using superglue in any quantity. Unfortunately I don't think there is anything else in existence which has the same kind of high speed setting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redcap Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 On 10/20/2016 at 10:51 AM, Beardie said: Hi Lomcevak, no I haven't seen these videos before. Chap makes it look like childsplay Thats how I do it as well...but his short clip is doubtless heavilly edited to show he gets it all lined up and passes the thread through first time - every time.......ask me how I know! Gary 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 Harrruuuummmmppppphhhh!!!!! I think I might be close to giving up on making turnbuckles. The smallest I can conceivably go in emulating the real thing is 0.4mm diameter and I think to be honest that even this is far too thick. I have been perusing various images of real and replica WWI aircraft on this here internet and, when you study them the turnbuckles are only fractionally broader than the wires and, as far as I can see there is no way of even coming close to replicating them at 1/32 scale or below. I think no matter what is attempted it will never be a truly accurate representation of turnbuckles. Very very frustrating! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephLalor Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 With my skills I'd probably have better luck employing midges to make scale turnbuckles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 I did consider training ants in the art of rigging, or perhaps fleas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Paw Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 19 hours ago, Beardie said: Harrruuuummmmppppphhhh!!!!! I think I might be close to giving up on making turnbuckles. The smallest I can conceivably go in emulating the real thing is 0.4mm diameter and I think to be honest that even this is far too thick. I have been perusing various images of real and replica WWI aircraft on this here internet and, when you study them the turnbuckles are only fractionally broader than the wires and, as far as I can see there is no way of even coming close to replicating them at 1/32 scale or below. I think no matter what is attempted it will never be a truly accurate representation of turnbuckles. Very very frustrating! I make 1/72 scale aircraft so obviously do not use turn buckles. I am making a wingnut wings 1/32 scale Hi Beardie I have come to the same conclusion. When you look at photos of the aircraft from any kind of distance it is impossible to see the turn buckles. I will not be adding buckles to my wing nuts kit but instead bulk up the end of the rigging ever so slightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardie Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 One thing that has occurred to me is to pre-prepare rigging using fine twisted wire eyelets (0.1mm wire) and tying the EZLine to them using a fishermans half bloodknot which resembles the method in which the multi strand wire of the cables is fixed in the real rigging with a touch of silver paint over the knot. I am going to order some 0.4mm aluminium tube and try this with twisted fine silver coloured wire eyelets inserted into the ends of the tube as this is the absolute smallest I think I can create. I still haven't figured out how to use photo-sharing yet but if you PM me your email address I can send you a photo of my efforts so far with the 0.5mm tubing and hook eyelets. There is this strange mental problem where you know that they should be there and they are not even though, in reality you wouldn't be able to see them. In all honesty, without my glasses I can't even make out detail on the 0.5mm turnbuckles I have created so far. I am working on a Roden Albatros D.I at the moment which I hopt to work up quite quickly and I will be using my turnbuckles to see what kind of effect they give. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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