Academy 1/72 Fw 190 A-8

[JimmyZ]

Hi all,

The Fw 190 group build is starting in a few weeks, and I thought I'd prepare for it by making sure I know what color paint I need, but the instruction for the Academy kit are somewhat vague with no reference to the actual colors.

I've pegged what they say is "black green" as close to Humbrol 91, however the "dark green" parts look grey on photos of other builds of this A/C.

They also show the propeller as "flat black" but I thought this period German A/C had black green props.

I'm hoping someone can hook me up with some links for info. There's a lot of info on the internet, but it seems a bit contradicting.

Cheers

Jimmy

[Jure Miljevic]

Hello, Jimmy

If you are going to stick with OOB colour scheme (III/JG54) than main colours are RLM 74 Grüngrau, RLM 75 Grauviolet and RLM 76 Hellgrau. These colours are covered by practically every producer, but if you prefer Humbrol very approximate (and I cannot emphasise this word enough) equivalents would be HG 4 or 27 for RLM 74, HG 11 or 140 for RLM 75 and HG 3 or 175 for RLM 76. The first conversion list I came across while googling is on the following link:

http://old.modelari.eu/Humbrol_Authentic_to_Humbrol.htm

Admittedly I did use 175 on Revell Fw 190 years ago, but it was in dire emergency (both MM and Xtracolour RLM 76 dried up) and even so I mixed it with some very light gray to bring it closer to what it should look like. You did indicate that you have weeks to spare so perhaps give it another thought. By the way, are those photos of your models on the bottom of your post? Judging by them I can hardly imagine why would you need an advice about the choice of paints. Cheers

Jure

[Greenshirt]

In case Jure wasn't clear, cross referencing RLM to the Academy instructions:

RLM - 70 = prop and spinner

RLM - 74 = dark areas on wings and fuselage spine

RLM - 75 = light areas on wings and fuselage spine

RLM - 76 = white areas on sides of fuselage and underside of wings

The "blue" appears to be the stripe on the fuselage and underwing panels? I'm not familiar with that marking, but if it should be blue it would be RLM - 24; use a blue with just a hint of gray (look up the color on line to satisfy your curiosity).

The "Orange" appears to be the cowl ring; should probably be RLM - 4 Gelb (yellow), use a good "Trainer Yellow" that has a little red in it, but is not an orange yellow or a true yellow.

Tim

[Jure Miljevic]

Yellow nose and outer lower wing panels in the same colour are dubious. III/JG54 equipped with Fw 190 A in spring of 1944 and re-equipped with Fw 190 D in autumn of the same year. During this period they had been serving in the west, so there would be no need for eastern front yellow identification colours. Cheers

Jure

[JimmyZ]

Hello, Jimmy

If you are going to stick with OOB colour scheme (III/JG54) than main colours are RLM 74 Grüngrau, RLM 75 Grauviolet and RLM 76 Hellgrau. These colours are covered by practically every producer, but if you prefer Humbrol very approximate (and I cannot emphasise this word enough) equivalents would be HG 4 or 27 for RLM 74, HG 11 or 140 for RLM 75 and HG 3 or 175 for RLM 76. The first conversion list I came across while googling is on the following link:

http://old.modelari.eu/Humbrol_Authentic_to_Humbrol.htm

Admittedly I did use 175 on Revell Fw 190 years ago, but it was in dire emergency (both MM and Xtracolour RLM 76 dried up) and even so I mixed it with some very light gray to bring it closer to what it should look like. You did indicate that you have weeks to spare so perhaps give it another thought. By the way, are those photos of your models on the bottom of your post? Judging by them I can hardly imagine why would you need an advice about the choice of paints. Cheers

Jure

Thanks Jure. Yes Humbrol acrylics are readily available to me and I'm quite happy with brush painting Humbrol.

Yes those are some of my builds in my signature. I'm just not familiar at all with Luftwaffe colors (this is my 2nd ever Luftwaffe build) and with Academy not giving adequate indication what colors to use, for example "dark green" could be many many different colors, and as I have no experience or knowledge on the subject the contradicting info I have found on the net just confuses me more.

Thanks for the info, it will be very helpful. I now just have to see what colors I need to get (and what I can mix myself).

In case Jure wasn't clear, cross referencing RLM to the Academy instructions:

RLM - 70 = prop and spinner

RLM - 74 = dark areas on wings and fuselage spine

RLM - 75 = light areas on wings and fuselage spine

RLM - 76 = white areas on sides of fuselage and underside of wings

The "blue" appears to be the stripe on the fuselage and underwing panels? I'm not familiar with that marking, but if it should be blue it would be RLM - 24; use a blue with just a hint of gray (look up the color on line to satisfy your curiosity).

The "Orange" appears to be the cowl ring; should probably be RLM - 4 Gelb (yellow), use a good "Trainer Yellow" that has a little red in it, but is not an orange yellow or a true yellow.

Tim

Thanks for the info Tim, it's going to be very helpful. The fuselage stripe apparently needs to be blue, but the underwing outer panels "orange" (which I thought looked closer to yellow to match the cowl ring). Interesting that you say you're not familiar with it, because I have found profile "plates" (or color profiles, whatever it's called) of this subject, but with no blue fuselage band. Could it be Academy has it wrong?

Yellow nose and outer lower wing panels in the same colour are dubious. III/JG54 equipped with Fw 190 A in spring of 1944 and re-equipped with Fw 190 D in autumn of the same year. During this period they had been serving in the west, so there would be no need for eastern front yellow identification colours. Cheers

Jure

hhrrmm, meaning I should probably consider leaving the yellow cowl ring and underwing panels in camo?

[Jure Miljevic]

Hi, Jimmy

In John Weal's book Jagdgeschwader 54 Grunherz (Osprey 2) there is a colour profile of that plane in its June 1944 guise at Villacoublay. Nose and wingtips are in their usual camouflage colours and there is a Grünherz under the canopy rails and the III/JG54 blue band marking near the tail. I did not find a photo of that plane, but in my opinion it is save bet she never got yellow eastern front markings while serving with this unit.

Your models look impressive. Which technique did you use for shadowing panel? Decades ago I read about applying diluted thinner along the panel line and than adding a drop of thinned black paint to create soft, nearly transparent shadow. It sounded plausible, but I got my first airbrush before I dared to actually try it out. By the way, what is that with a missing roundel on the early Spitfire's wing? Cheers

Jure

[JimmyZ]

Hi, Jimmy

In John Weal's book Jagdgeschwader 54 Grunherz (Osprey 2) there is a colour profile of that plane in its June 1944 guise at Villacoublay. Nose and wingtips are in their usual camouflage colours and there is a Grünherz under the canopy rails and the III/JG54 blue band marking near the tail. I did not find a photo of that plane, but in my opinion it is save bet she never got yellow eastern front markings while serving with this unit.

Your models look impressive. Which technique did you use for shadowing panel? Decades ago I read about applying diluted thinner along the panel line and than adding a drop of thinned black paint to create soft, nearly transparent shadow. It sounded plausible, but I got my first airbrush before I dared to actually try it out. By the way, what is that with a missing roundel on the early Spitfire's wing? Cheers

Jure

Thanks Jure! That put's me at ease with now following the Academy painting instructions to the letter.

Thanks for the complement, I'm still learning and trying to improve techniques and equipment. I don't always do shadowing for the panel lines, but since I don't use an airbrush, my best success was with dry pastels where I use black (or dark brown) applied by a soft brush along the panel lines. I've tried other methods but had zero success with it. The nice thing about pastels is it's hard to mess it up, and hard to overdo the effect.

The missing roundel on my early Spitfire Mk.I was "missing" on the real subject as well. There's a couple of photos on the net showing these early Spit's "missing" roundels. On this link there is one photo showing such A/C

http://www.network54.com/Forum/149674/thread/1349788929/Mono+B+roundel+on+early+Spitfire

Cheers

Jimmy

Edited June 22, 2016 by JimmyZ

[Jure Miljevic]

Hi, Jimmy

Thank you for information and link to USAF style Spitfire roundels. Perhaps I attach too much importance to airbrushing as I did not even think about pastels. Well, live and learn. Cheers

Jure

[JimmyZ]

Thanks to all the info here I think I've pretty much got the exterior covered now. Off to the hobbyshop to procure some paint!

However, any ideas on the interior? As far as I can tell the cockpit should be RLM 66. But as far as Humbrol goes, 224 or 79 seems to be the closest when comparing on my computer screen.

And the wheel wells & bay cover insides? Were they the same color as the underside by this stage of the war?

[Seawinder]

Thanks to all the info here I think I've pretty much got the exterior covered now. Off to the hobbyshop to procure some paint!

However, any ideas on the interior? As far as I can tell the cockpit should be RLM 66. But as far as Humbrol goes, 224 or 79 seems to be the closest when comparing on my computer screen.

And the wheel wells & bay cover insides? Were they the same color as the underside by this stage of the war?

Most likely (almost certain) color for wheel wells, bay cover insides, and struts for that matter, is RLM 02. It's called gray, but it's decidedly greenish. Humbrol apparently has it: no. 240 in the acrylic line.

[PattheCat]

Just busy with Airfix new tool 1:72 Wurger and used Humbrol enamels for
RLM02: 240 wheel wells and inside the engine cowling
RLM66: 67 cockpit.

RLM70: 91 (241), you could also give Gunze H65 a try (used it on a bf109) propeller blades

For RLM 74, 75 and 76 I've got both Humbrol (32,140,247) and Gunze acrylics (H68, H69, H417). But I really can't tell what's the best choice. I didn't use the Gunze yet. Just a "feeling" that humbrol 140 isn't quite right for RLM75.

Sorry, pictures are too dark.

Edited June 23, 2016 by PattheCat

[JimmyZ]

Thanks PattheCat and Seawinder!

[dfqweofekwpeweiop4]

Beware, this kit builds into a horrid looking Fw190. I built one once and thought it didn't look right at all and I'm not usually that good at spotting such things. I would suggest treating it as a practice build or use your skills on a more deserving Fw190 kit such as any of the Eduard or 1990's Hasegawa tool kits.

thanks

Mike

Edited June 24, 2016 by Mikemx

[JimmyZ]

Beware, this kit builds into a horrid looking Fw190. I built one once and thought it didn't look right at all and I'm not usually that good at spotting such things. I would suggest treating it as a practice build or use your skills on a more deserving Fw190 kit such as any of the Eduard or 1990's Hasegawa tool kits.

thanks

Mike

Thanks for the heads-up Mike. I certainly intend to use it to try mottling with a paint brush for the first time...and I've read horror stories about Academy decals.

[stevehnz]

IMHO, unless you're a hard core Fw 190 tifosi or line it up along side some of the better ones, I'd include the latest Airfix one among them, its a bit like the Academt Spitfire XIV, builds beautifully but flawed in some areas & to 95 % of viewers will look fine.

Steve.

[Roman Schilhart]

Beware, this kit builds into a horrid looking Fw190. I built one once and thought it didn't look right at all and I'm not usually that good at spotting such things. I would suggest treating it as a practice build or use your skills on a more deserving Fw190 kit such as any of the Eduard or 1990's Hasegawa tool kits.

thanks

Mike

I have built one many years ago and it sits alongside my Hasegawa, Airfix, Revell and Eduard 190s.

The most obvious flaw on the Academy kit is the position of the undercarriage, which has a totally awkward angle.

I guess it's possible to do some corrections, but for the same money I'd rather buy the (new) Airfix kit.

Good luck with yours Jimmy, anyway.

[Mike Starmer]

Look at the date of the kit, 1992! The kit instructions are about par for then, way off. Much, much more accurate information about Luftwaffe colours has been discovered since then. RLM 74/75 dark grey and medium grey on top. RLM 76 light blue underneath and sides which are soft mottled with 74/75/02 but not always 02. The instructions are conflating Eastern and Western Front I.D. markings. For the East yellow (orange in the kit) on cowling, rear fuselage band and under wing tips. The blue fuselage band would have been Western Front only on Fw 190D models in 1945. I stand corrected on that last, i just did a quick check in Rosch.

[sroubos]

Does anyone have a rundown of what's wrong with it? I've built one wheels-up a while back and while it still looks off somehow, that negates the most obvious issue. The tail looks weird shape-wise but I'm not sure what the other issues are.

[Roman Schilhart]

Here's some of the major critizisms about Academy's Fw-190 A:

- too thick tail and rudder
- too narrow wheels

- wrong undercarriage angle
- wrong shape of side engine cowls,
- wrong shape of pilot seat,
- wrong shape of props blades
- wrong position of access panels

While I can live with a simplified interior in small-scale, it's the position of the undercarriage and general shape of the front part that stands out most.

The Academy kit is considered the "worst" of all 1/72 offerings (along with the Mastercraft kit).

However I've seen some built into very respectable replicas, so don't let all that whining about small details deter you from your build.

cheers

Roman

[Jure Miljevic]

Hi, Roman

While with P-51B I experienced many of Academy kit issues first hand, I can hardly imagine that its Fw 190 A-8 is worse than the old Revell A-5. Cheers

Jure

[FalkeEins]

unfortunately it is..the last thing I want to do is put Jimmy off but I have to agree with Mike and Roman ..here's a pic of my hopelessly uncorrected Academy A-8 (right) - converted to an A-6 with replacement gun cowl cover - alongside a Revell kit. Note how horrible the Academy kit is with its wing like a barn door and over-sized ailerons and flaps. The rudder and engine cowl are also under-sized. In fact there is no cowl to speak off - just a 'plug' on the front end. In fact the front end bears no relation to the actual aircraft - easily Academy's worst 72nd scale kit

[Jure Miljevic]

Hello, FalkeEins

I admit, just taking a glance at Academy Fw 190's vertical tail on your photo almost made me jump of my chair, screaming ˝My eyes!˝ in agony. Still, congratulations on finishing the model despite such obvious shortcomings. However, I was not talking about Revell's A-8, which appeared around the turn of the millennium, but about Fw 190 A back from 70' with Miki Maus emblem of Galland's old ground attack unit. I got one decades ago and even then the kit only interested me because it had wing drop tanks included. Regards

Jure

[JimmyZ]

Hardly inspirational stuff, thanks guys. Kidding, I appreciate the info.

I don't have the kit in front of me now, but I might be able to correct some of the issues, like over sized flaps and ailerons (fill-up and re-scribe), access panel positions (fill-up and re-scribe) and undercarriage angle (not sure but I'll work it out and modify), but I need to decide if that will be worth the effort since I won't even attempt to tinker with the nose shape. I think it's clear this won't be a contest winner (not that any of my models are, but you get my point) but I'd still like to make it into something decent, even if it will be far from perfect.

In case I decide to attempt fixing some errors, does anyone have a link to an accurate schematic of the A-8?

[Nick Millman]

Revell's original Fw-190 A (H-615) dates from 1962/63! The first issue (below) had red fuselage chevrons and bars and a cross not a swastika on the fin and rudder. It has been re-issued in different guises with different add-ons several times since then, the last time being in the early 1990s.

Nick

[Roman Schilhart]

Hi, Roman

While with P-51B I experienced many of Academy kit issues first hand, I can hardly imagine that its Fw 190 A-8 is worse than the old Revell A-5. Cheers

Jure

Jure,

I don't know a Revell A-5.

Do you mean the A-8?

On this kit, the canopy is the biggest letdown.

I've built some of Revell's 1/72 Fw-190 and while far from perfect, they still do look better than the Academy offerings.

But that is my personal view only.