crobinsonh Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Brilliant thread as usual. Hope all went well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Bit late to this Bill, sorry, but I've caught up now. I don't usually follow resin builds but as it's you... Looking good and those internals are excellent The instructions for the I/P in post 26 look to me as though they've turned the panel around in the ballon so that they can show the location of the PE bits - or is it just me? Hope the Chemo went well and you feel better soon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted February 29, 2016 Author Share Posted February 29, 2016 Hi mates, Â Well, what do you know - I'm still here. I tried coming on the forum a day or so ago, posted a couple of comments somewhere and then decided I wasn't quite ready yet. Today has been much better, so maybe tomorrow I can make some progress on the Sea Venom. Â Needless to say, I didn't get all of the fuselage bits assembled before chemo, but I did get the fuselage halves together. A couple of places to fix up, most prominently the radome where I buggered up the removal of the pour stub. I noticed a few bubbles along the bottom fuselage seam, but these will be easy to sand and fill. I glued on the port wing, but stopped before I added the starboard. Why? I think I need to think about how I'm going to get the wings, fuselage, booms, and tailplane aligned. Remember, there aren't any positive alignment pegs or the like. Â Since the booms mount to the wings, any misalignment of the wings (relative to the thrust angle) will cause a significantly larger misalignment at the end of the booms - lever arm and all that. I think I may need a jig, he said, as visions of Legos flew through his mind. Or maybe he was just realising that he should stick to Legos, as they're easier to assemble. Â More to come I'm sure... Â Cheers, Bill 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 More to come I'm sure... Oh yes, please. Get well soon Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edge Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Good to see you back Bill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookenbacher Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Glad to see you're on the rebound portion of another treatment Bill. Take your time, like the old saying goes: a rested Bill makes for excellent resin Sea Venoms. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Hello Bill, well I'm later than late as usual, but have spent a very happy hour or so catching up! Glad to hear that you're starting to feel better after your treatment and will hopefully be back to fettling that lovely little jet again soon. Really good input from Steve again too, great pics and some good stories. Once again turning into a great thread! Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 I seem to remember Libor (Redboost) doing a CMR Venom NF which has the same basic parts and I think he said that the mounting of the booms and wings was quite positive with no problems. I bet I could find some problems though, I'm barely able to stick lego together. Good to see you back on here Bill. Duncan B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted March 7, 2016 Author Share Posted March 7, 2016 On 2/29/2016 at 18:15, keefr22 said: Hello Bill, well I'm later than late as usual, but have spent a very happy hour or so catching up! Glad to hear that you're starting to feel better after your treatment and will hopefully be back to fettling that lovely little jet again soon. Really good input from Steve again too, great pics and some good stories. Once again turning into a great thread! Â Thanks, Keith! The "little jet fettling" has returned in earnest. Although that sounds like something that should be illegal... Â On 3/1/2016 at 03:08, Duncan B said: I seem to remember Libor (Redboost) doing a CMR Venom NF which has the same basic parts and I think he said that the mounting of the booms and wings was quite positive with no problems. I bet I could find some problems though, I'm barely able to stick lego together. Good to see you back on here Bill. Â Thanks, Duncan - I remember that thread (I might have even made copies of some of Libor's photos for future reference). I think I'm not so lucky with the Sea Venom, since it appears from dry fitting that the booms will be misaligned if I rely solely on the mounting surfaces. But I don't think this will be a big problem. Â After I verified that the nose weight was sufficient, I glued the fuselage halves together. That was before my recent treatment, which caused me to take some time off from my normal activities. However, yesterday I found myself back at the workbench, defiantly giving those post-chemo blues my middle finger. Yeah baby! Â I added the landing gear to the assembled fuselage. The black resin that is used for extra strength in the gear legs has an odd effect on the CA adhesive I'm using (Zap-A-Gap). The glue takes forever to set up and cure! Really strange - eventually everything seemed OK, and the landing gear are on solid. Which means I'll probably break them off somehow during the rest of the build. Â Â At this stage, I set the model on a level, flat surface and measured the height of the outer wing sections. I wanted to make sure they were both the same, since this is going to be the reference for getting the booms on properly. As far as I can tell from my metal ruler, the outer wings are at the same height, so that's a good start. Â The booms have a small male nub on the end that goes into a similarly shaped female receptacle (gentlemen, mind your manners) on the trailing edge of the wings. It's not a solid fit, though, and there is quite a bit of play. The aft end of the booms need to be restrained in the proper position while the glue sets. I don't think CA adhesive will be good enough here, so I intend to use five-minute epoxy. It will give me more time to work, and will be stronger. Â I thought up this idea of using business cards to support the aft end of the booms. I can adjust the height of the business cards easily, and adding or removing cards one at a time gives me fairly good precision in adjustment. Something like this: Â Â Somehow I have to keep both booms aligned to each other, and properly positioned relative to the fuselage. Oh, and keep them the proper distance apart so the tailplane will fit correctly. What else? Oh, keep the booms from twisting - when looking from the rear of the aircraft, the vertical tails need to be square to the ground. Looking from above, the booms need to make a rectangular outline, not a trapezoid. And probably some other alignments I haven't thought of...in any event let's just say there are a lot of variables at work when attaching the booms. Â Wish me luck! Â Cheers, Bill 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 I thought up this idea of using business cards to support the aft end of the booms. I can adjust the height of the business cards easily, and adding or removing cards one at a time gives me fairly good precision in adjustment. Bill, that's genius! I have a ton of business cards, too. (Because I'm too shy to give mine out.) The booms have a small male nub on the end that goes into a similarly shaped female receptacle (gentlemen, mind your manners) 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael louey Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Hi Bill, Good work! I can relate to your worries about the booms. A careful modeller would pin the booms. Someone who doesn't want to spend the time, uses some super glue and accelerator and tries to juggle all the parts at one time. Here's one I prepared earlier - http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234953457-cmr-sea-venom-faw53-wz895/ I would have modelled a sister ship as my friend who flew in the squadron didn't have wz995 in his log book, but I didn't want to scrounge up all the correct replacement letters/numbers to model another airframe. Cheers Michael 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Glad to hear you're back Bill Business cards; genius idea! I would, of course, get the Lego out and I'm now using BluTak for fine adjustment. Works for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Epoxy sounds like a good idea, so does the business card thing I'm with CedB about adding some blue tack too, though.Good Luck! Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Thanks, Keith! The "little jet fettling" has returned in earnest. Although that sounds like something that should be illegal... Thanks, Duncan - I remember that thread (I might have even made copies of some of Libor's photos for future reference). I think I'm not so lucky with the Sea Venom, since it appears from dry fitting that the booms will be misaligned if I rely solely on the mounting surfaces. But I don't think this will be a big problem. After I verified that the nose weight was sufficient, I glued the fuselage halves together. That was before my recent treatment, which caused me to take some time off from my normal activities. However, yesterday I found myself back at the workbench, defiantly giving those post-chemo blues my middle finger. Yeah baby! I added the landing gear to the assembled fuselage. The black resin that is used for extra strength in the gear legs has an odd effect on the CA adhesive I'm using (Zap-A-Gap). The glue takes forever to set up and cure! Really strange - eventually everything seemed OK, and the landing gear are on solid. Which means I'll probably break them off somehow during the rest of the build. At this stage, I set the model on a level, flat surface and measured the height of the outer wing sections. I wanted to make sure they were both the same, since this is going to be the reference for getting the booms on properly. As far as I can tell from my metal ruler, the outer wings are at the same height, so that's a good start. The booms have a small male nub on the end that goes into a similarly shaped female receptacle (gentlemen, mind your manners) on the trailing edge of the wings. It's not a solid fit, though, and there is quite a bit of play. The aft end of the booms need to be restrained in the proper position while the glue sets. I don't think CA adhesive will be good enough here, so I intend to use five-minute epoxy. It will give me more time to work, and will be stronger. I thought up this idea of using business cards to support the aft end of the booms. I can adjust the height of the business cards easily, and adding or removing cards one at a time gives me fairly good precision in adjustment. Something like this: Somehow I have to keep both booms aligned to each other, and properly positioned relative to the fuselage. Oh, and keep them the proper distance apart so the tailplane will fit correctly. What else? Oh, keep the booms from twisting - when looking from the rear of the aircraft, the vertical tails need to be square to the ground. Looking from above, the booms need to make a rectangular outline, not a trapezoid. And probably some other alignments I haven't thought of...in any event let's just say there are a lot of variables at work when attaching the booms. Wish me luck! Cheers, Bill When removing or refitting the tail plane on a real one the 8 bolts are removed then the booms are pushed and held apart to get in in/out. True British engineering at its finest. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Glad to see you back at it Bill. Pure genius with the simplicity of the business card idea, must be all those chemicals you've taken recently! Aligning the booms is the one part of the build that has really put me off getting on with my NF3. Of course the wing sections of the Sea Venom and the NF3 kits are different as the proper RAF one doesn't have the 'broken' wings so maybe I'll be lucky! Duncan B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamden Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Very nice looking Venom - I do like those early jets Roger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Of course the wing sections of the Sea Venom and the NF3 kits are different as the proper RAF one doesn't have the 'broken' wings so maybe I'll be lucky! I think Bill has a wingfold set -- I seem to recall mine having "unbroken" wings. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Think I'm going to have to go around collecting business cards now (never been important enough to have any of my own...!!) Nice progress Bill! Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procopius Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Think I'm going to have to go around collecting business cards now (never been important enough to have any of my own...!!) I got my first ones from work when I was a call centre operator, so I think you could treat yourself and not be putting on airs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edge Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Lovely work, as always Bill. Great to see you're back at the workbench despite everything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted March 7, 2016 Author Share Posted March 7, 2016 On 3/6/2016 at 21:05, Michael louey said: Good work! I can relate to your worries about the booms. A careful modeller would pin the booms. Someone who doesn't want to spend the time, uses some super glue and accelerator and tries to juggle all the parts at one time. Here's one I prepared earlier - http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234953457-cmr-sea-venom-faw53-wz895/ I would have modelled a sister ship as my friend who flew in the squadron didn't have wz995 in his log book, but I didn't want to scrounge up all the correct replacement letters/numbers to model another airframe. Â Looks good, Michael! I thought about pinning the booms, but they don't weigh more than a gnat's eyelash, so I think the epoxy and the small "nubs" will be sufficient. As long as some brute of a man doesn't pick it up by the tailplane... Â On 3/7/2016 at 02:35, CedB said: Glad to hear you're back Bill Business cards; genius idea! I would, of course, get the Lego out and I'm now using BluTak for fine adjustment. Works for me. Â I tried Lego at first, since it worked so well on the Firefly. But I couldn't get the precision of adjustment that I wanted, the business cards are easier, and I'm lazy. Â On 3/7/2016 at 03:25, NAVY870 said: When removing or refitting the tail plane on a real one the 8 bolts are removed then the booms are pushed and held apart to get in in/out. True British engineering at its finest. Â I love it, but I can't tell if your last sentence is sarcasm or not. Â Anyway, that's exactly what I'm planning to do. Secure the booms in place with the opening for the tailplane just a hair too small, then spread them apart to install the tailplane. I must be a British engineer. Â On 3/7/2016 at 04:13, Duncan B said: Glad to see you back at it Bill. Pure genius with the simplicity of the business card idea, must be all those chemicals you've taken recently! Aligning the booms is the one part of the build that has really put me off getting on with my NF3. Of course the wing sections of the Sea Venom and the NF3 kits are different as the proper RAF one doesn't have the 'broken' wings so maybe I'll be lucky! Â It's good to be back! PC is correct, the Sea Venom kit comes with "unbroken" wings, and I bought the optional wing folding kit which includes the "broken" wings. The dealer had a special going when I bought the kit, with the folding wings at 50% discount. How could I refuse? Â Besides, I knew this wonderful gentleman in Australia who needed a set of unbroken wings, and those that came with my kit are now in his trusted care. Â Cheers, Bill 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gondor44 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Somehow I have to keep both booms aligned to each other, and properly positioned relative to the fuselage. Oh, and keep them the proper distance apart so the tailplane will fit correctly. What else? Oh, keep the booms from twisting - when looking from the rear of the aircraft, the vertical tails need to be square to the ground. Looking from above, the booms need to make a rectangular outline, not a trapezoid. And probably some other alignments I haven't thought of...in any event let's just say there are a lot of variables at work when attaching the booms. Wish me luck! Cheers, Bill How about making a frame using some business cards? You could even make sure that the main card which would have slots for the tops of the rudders at the right distance, was vertical by using another cut up business card to provide the right-angels otherwise known as corners. Anyway, I am sure you can work something out. Gondor 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted March 8, 2016 Author Share Posted March 8, 2016 On 3/7/2016 at 15:23, Gondor44 said: How about making a frame using some business cards? You could even make sure that the main card which would have slots for the tops of the rudders at the right distance, was vertical by using another cut up business card to provide the right-angels otherwise known as corners. Anyway, I am sure you can work something out. Gondor  Hey, you cheated and peaked at my business card jig! I guess great minds think alike.  Everything is now firmly epoxied and super-glued. Now I will apply some filler to a few places and let the sanding begin! Filler will be required on the nose (where I buggered up the pour stub removal), the underside fuselage seam (a small gap and some bubbles in the resin - first time I've seen bubbles in CMR resin), and the seams where the booms connect to the fuselage. This is primarily on the starboard boom, since my alignment forced the boom away from its mating surface by a tad. A little filler in all of these places, some MicroMesh on the whole thing, and it will be ready for some primer. Oh, I need to clean up the outer wing sections and get them ready for paint too.  And, of course, being of not-so-sound mind of late, I will forget something. I always do - only now I can blame it on the chemo!  Cheers, Bill 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Great to see the model progressing and even better to see you feeling up to modelling again. Martin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duncan B Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Will your Business Card Jig (sounds a bit like a Friday afternoon dance!) be available for hire/purchase. If so, send me your Business card ! Duncan B 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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