Sea Hurricane AF955- Dicky Cork's, a few questions

[85sqn]

Hi folks, I'm currently aiming to make this hurricane with the new airfix 1/48 kit and using decals from the spares box. Just a few things I wanted to clarify.

Using this photo:

http://media.iwm.org.uk/iwm/mediaLib/29/media-29571/large.jpg?action=d&cat=photographs

AF955 is the second aircraft in the line.

What is on the leading edge of the starboard wing? It has a yellow stripe, a gun camera, the normal 4 .303s and what are the other 2 patches further outboard?

Compared to the aircraft in front it doesn't have the stripe on the nose but some checks, does it have the oil ring?

From some profiles the 7 & E are drawn wider than usual squadron codes, are they?

Cheers,

Nick

[Troy Smith]

for ease of reference

it does have the oil ring.

The patches on the leading edge are probably that, patches, or primer.

The uncovered gun ports of the 1st and 3rd planes are of note, as are the still attached tie downs on the ends of the wings?

Actual details of Corke's plane I imagine will come from Tony O T, or Ian G.

[85sqn]

Cheers Troy, sadly Airfix haven't supplied an oil ring unlike the Italeri kit but a bit of Miliput and hey presto.

I'm mostly interested in the aircraft's use during Op Ironclad if there any differences to when used during Pedestal.

[Troy Smith]

Cheers Troy, sadly Airfix haven't supplied an oil ring unlike the Italeri kit but a bit of Miliput and hey presto.

I'm mostly interested in the aircraft's use during Op Ironclad if there any differences to when used during Pedestal.

the oil ring is thin metal strip, I'd cut the ring out of plastic sheet, or thin metal. I can't see how you could make it from milliput.

It only goes round the top half of the cowl, and was to stop oil from constant speed props being blown back onto the windscreen.

some relevant images

famous shot of Nicki

I have seen a profile with a red loop coming up from Nicki on cowl, but this is in fact the detached oil spill ring come loose from round cowling.

this shows it well too

overall the Italeri is a very poor model if you care about detail accuracy, the list of faults is tedious it's so long.

see http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234935596-sea-hurricane-148-italeri/#entry1390213

Surprised the real FAA experts have not pitched in....yet

[85sqn]

I'll get a photo of it later, basically I made a strip of milliput, wrapped around a spinner for the shape then slide it on to the nose. As it dried I trimmed it. Seems alright!

[Graham Boak]

This may have been flown at some time by Cork, but the line up is of 800 Sq. not Cork's 880 Sq. When 800 Sq converted to Sea Hurricanes from Fulmars at Port Reitz, Kenya, 880 Sq donated their senior pilot (whose name escapes me at the moment) and two Sea Hurricanes. These were 7E and 7F. 800 Sq carried the code 6, but these two retained their 7 codes. 7F can be seen on deck in the middle of other 800 Sq aircraft in a photo taken (I believe at Freetown) on the way to Operation Pedestal. The yellow leading edges and fin are Pedestal markings.

Cork then became Senior Pilot in 880, but his flight retained the codes J,K,L and M, following usual (but not invariant) FAA practice. (ABCD, EFGH,JKLM.). 880 Sq also had an adopted/converted ex-RAF 7.Z.

There is a misplaced photo in Peter Smith's book on Pedestal. it shows Sea Hurricanes with yellow bands inboard, from the wing root to the gun positions (from memory). These are not the Pedestal markings but do belong to the Madagascar period.

One interesting point is that whereas 800's SH were from store and had black spinners (plus codes on the leading edge), 880s had flown in the UK and still carried Sky spinners and tail bands. But three of the aircraft in this line-up have Sky spinners - is this on Victorious after the Pedestal battles and a joint mission being ranged? The two carriers do have different centre-line markings but I don't recall how to tell them apart. Spare aircraft with Sky spinners could be from Victorious's 885 Sq.

[iang]

The carrier is Victorious (dashed centre line). Indomitable had a solid centre line with a dashed line offset to port Not relevant to Pedestal, but for completeness, Illustrious after her Norfolk refit, had a segmented centre line composed of elongated triangles and Formidable's was a solid line without the offset dashed line to port. In consequence it is easy to mix up Indomitable and Formidable in deck-park photographs, where the port side of the deck is not visible. Implacable and Indefatigable also had solid centre lines, but Indefatigable's was noticeably narrower. Unicorn had a dashed centre line with crosses at about every 10th mark, which Victorious adopted as well. One of the photos posted above is possibly Unicorn.

On the subject of Pedestal Sea Hurricanes, I went through the 880 Squadron Diary from 1941 onward and used this to derive squadron composition, by serial number, until August 1942. For 800 Squadron, the only extant data is photographs and the Combat Reports filed soon after the operation, so it harder to be sure of the identity of every aircraft in the squadron.

Edited November 19, 2015 by iang

[Grey Beema]

Hope it posts - I've never posted a photo on this site before...

Here is my paltry contribution. Going on previous threads in this forum - here is my interpretation of Corks 880 Pedestal Sea Hurricane and yes it is the dodgy Italeri Hurricane.

No serial as I am awaiting the piece of evidence that gets us all to say Ahhhhh!

[/url]

Using the Airfix new tool Hurricane MkI. The aircraft in the left is Corks 242 Sqn Hurricane and that on the right is Gardner's (England Expects) aeroplane...

Edited November 18, 2015 by Grey Beema

[85sqn]

Hi folks thanks for the replies, so regarding the Hurricane '7E', during Op Ironclad it would have looked as it is in the photo but with a longer yellow leading edge?

Grey Beema- nice Hurris, I'd like to do Sub. Lt. Gardners at some point myself. I like the placards for each aircraft.

Troy- here's what I mean with the milliput, I'tll get a further trim once I get some fresh blades tomorrow. The paint is just where I'm checking the seams.

[Graham Boak]

The outer yellow band was missing on the aircraft in the photo, as I recall, which may imply an 800 Sq aircraft. I don't recall just how far they came outboard. On the 880 Sq aircraft, the outboard yellow bands are thinner than on the model, being the same as RAF Fighter Command - see posting 2.

If you look back through previous postings you'll find a suggested serial for K (I've quoted it several times in the past but can't bring it to mind now). He is known to have flown several different aircraft in the operation.

[tonyot]

Sorry I cannot add anything further Nick but that pilot in your model looks nothing like Dickie Cork you`ve got the colour of his eyes wrong ,...... so come on mate,..... get it right!!

Seriously though,....the oil collector ring looks great,.... I was a bit dubious when you first mentioned it but respect,......it looks like the type which curved over at the front rather than the flat style.

As you know he is reputed to have flown a so called `up gunned' Sea Hurricane which many have taken to be a cannon armed Sea Hurri Mk.Ic but I`ve never found any evidence of this and the only aircraft with extra guns onboard was the ex RAF Hurricane Mk.IIb which Graham mentioned above which was given a hook by the time the carrier reached Aden and was coded 7-Z. There is a side view photo of it in the book ` Hurricane-The Illustrated History' showing it still with its Vokes filter and it also appears in colour very briefly on a film but it is very hazy and hard to make out.

Cheers

Tony

[85sqn]

Sorry I cannot add anything further Nick but that pilot in your model looks nothing like Dickie Cork you`ve got the colour of his eyes wrong ,...... so come on mate,..... get it right!!

Seriously though,....the oil collector ring looks great,.... I was a bit dubious when you first mentioned it but respect,......it looks like the type which curved over at the front rather than the flat style.

Ha yes, will do!

Graham- This photo has been taken from the Diego Suarez/Madagascar Ops on 16 Jun 1942 on Indomitable. Is this what you mean with the leading edge yellow? The aircraft on the right looks like it goes up to the root.

We have 7F, 7L and 7B visible.

[Graham Boak]

B? I thought that was Z - the central one at the rear. My understanding is that this photo was taken in the Indian Ocean but I was thinking rather further East. I hadn't spotted the yellow inboard - yes, that is what I meant. I don't see any outboard however, which agrees with the other photo I've seen. Plus a banner (or a tatzelwurm?) on the nose of the outriggered SH. Very interesting.

[iang]

Hurricane in the centre bow is 7B. On the port side is 7L and on the starboard side Hurricane the code is not readable, to me at least, but could be 7D. I'm not sure which 880 sq Hurricane is pictured on the outrigger.

7F is AE966.

I have a head-on photo taken in Diego Suarez Harbour and the yellow leading edge markings run from the root to just outboard of landing light.

HTH

IG

[85sqn]

B? I thought that was Z - the central one at the rear. My understanding is that this photo was taken in the Indian Ocean but I was thinking rather further East. I hadn't spotted the yellow inboard - yes, that is what I meant. I don't see any outboard however, which agrees with the other photo I've seen. Plus a banner (or a tatzelwurm?) on the nose of the outriggered SH. Very interesting.

There's a couple on the IWM website and kts one of the Pedestal photos I think that shows Z.

Sturtivants Fleet Air Arm at War has a better reproduction of the above photo and it's definitely B.

Cheers for the help though chaps I'll do on of these with the unusual leading edge stripes.

[85sqn]

Hi chaps just, open up this thread again. Have you noticed Airfix's boxing of the sea hurricane is AF955, the very aircraft above that I modelled? Looks like they are going for a yellow tail for an Operation Ironclad aircraft. What do you reckon- a quick email to say actually that would actually be an be Op Pedestal marking? Looks like they have the yellow leading edge going up to the wing root.

 

http://www.airfix.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2017/hawker-sea-hurricane-mk-ib-1-48.html

[ClaudioN]

A bit perplexed about yellow codes for the 804 Sqn. machine in the Airfix boxing. I'd reckon they would be white?

 

Yellow leading edges are a bit of a mystery... Yellow inboard for Ironclad, but yellow outboard for Pedestal? A bit of scrubbing and painting within Indomitable hangar...

 

Claudio

 

Edited January 5, 2017 by ClaudioN

[Graham Boak]

Yellow tail is indeed an instruction for Pedestal.  For the Madagascar operation only 880 Sq flew Sea Hurricanes, 800 still had Fulmars

[iang]

AF955 was not Cork's usual aircraft. He may have flown it during Ironclad, but only on 6th May, or possibly 7th May prior to the surrender being agreed.  I don't have a copy of Cork's log book for May 1942 (my copy starts in July 1942), but  Wren's biography of Cork gives the aircraft he flew for Ironclad, on May 5th 1942. 

 

May 5 0500 8 Sea Hurricanes took off in two sections to attack Diego Suarez aerodrome. Cork led Blue Section in Z4624 (recorded as Z4642).

 

May 5 1300 Cork and Cruickshank patrolled the town and attacked the aerodrome hangar (Wren claims that in his log book Cork lists Z4039 for this operation). Sturtivant credits the destruction of  3x MS406 and 4 xPo63 in the hangar to Lt JM Bruen in Z4039, leading 880 Squadron B flight attack, so Cork in Z4039 may be wrong.

 

May 6  Cork flew off with Cruickshank and Williams to reinforce the 0920 attack by 6 Sea Hurricanes on gun emplacements south of the town, after Judd had returned with a glycol leak. Wren does not list Cork's serial.

 

May 7 880 Sq carried out patrols over beaches until the surrender. Wren does not indicated if Cork participated. It's worth also noting that Haworth's and Harris' Sea Hurricanes were damaged on 6 May during the attack on gun emplacements south of the town  and returned to Indomitable  (and Judd's was O/S due to a glycol leak). So that left 11 Sea Hurricanes available (including the adopted Mk IIB), as the Squadron Record Book indicates that the Squadron increased from 9 to 14 aircraft on 24th April, 1942. 

 

I do have a photo of Cork's usual Sea Hurricane on Indomitable at anchor at Diego Saurez, taken on 7th or 8th May (Indomitable departed on 8th May), where the code and serial Z4624 is clear. The yellow leading edge markings run from wing root to outboard of the landing light.

 

 

Edited January 5, 2017 by iang

[85sqn]

As ever, thanks chaps. I sent them a quick message to say that airframe in that colour scheme was for Op Pedestal. Ian- I may have to get a copy of that book. Ospreys Aces of the Royal Navy says:

 

'During the landings at Diego Suarez in early May 1942, the senior pilot of sea hurricane equipped 880 NAS was Lt. Dickie Cork. Although this (AF955) was his regular aircraft which he first flew in October 1941, Cork was in another sea hurricane when he led a successful strafe of the Vichy air base at Arrachart on 5 May, when he destroyed several aircraft on the ground. The following day, however, he was at the controls of AF955 when he led another strafe on a gun battery during the mopping up operations. Cork flew the aircraft for the last time on 18 June, after which the sea hurricane was transferred to 800 NAS.

 

I don't know where the source is from that Ospreys have used, Wrens book isn't listed in the bibliography.

 

Nick

[iang]

Thanks for that, Nick.  It looks like this is what Airfix based their artwork on. As far as I'm aware, 880 Senior Pilot at the time was Lt Martyn (I have a copy of his log book). He was transferred to 800 Squadron when this Squadron re-equipped with Sea Hurricanes after Ironclad. At that point Cork became Senior Pilot in 880 Squadron.  It sounds from what you have quoted from the Osprey book that Cork flew AF955 on May 6th against the gun emplacements south of the town. Surely that information must come from his log book?  In the summer of 1942, Cork's regular aircraft was  Z4624 (recorded by Cork as Z4642).

 

 

[Engelsted]

According to Cork's logbook he flew AF955 on the 6th.

 

John

[85sqn]

Looks like they changed the yellow tail but have left the yellow leading edge stripe as is: http://www.airfix.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2017/hawker-sea-hurricane-mk-ib-1-48.html

 

Box art looks lovely though.

 

Nick