Tail-Dragon Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I had a chance years ago to pick up one at the local hobby shop at a reasonable price, but deferred due to badly creased vac canopies. I've regretted missing out on it ever since. I'd still like to get one here in Western Canada, but the eBay prices and huge shipping are ridiculous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongMan2 Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Hi Simon, Didn't want to spoil your thread on the FM Halifax in 1/48 scale as its not my intention. I'm glad you just want to build it and that is great...a more sensible option. I'm just providing information to others that wish to build this kit so they may be better prepared to do battle with the kit. I purchased the kit when it first came out at full retail; and after I opened the box and put it on some major components on suitable scale plans...I felt taken big time. I knew the Halifax was a FM kit and I was warned about their general quality and yet stubborn me; I still purchased it. I have to say I will never purchase another one of their kits ever again. May be I had some delusions about my skill level...but we shall see. We build to the standard we are most comfortable with….thats admirable I believe. However Simon, the deed was done and I had to move forward. I couldn't return the kit to Squadron mail order. I'm a 1/48 scale builder and I wanted a 1/48 scale Halifax. I had the 1/48 Sanger vac kit and it was no different to the FM kit. I personally believe FM copied the Sanger vac-u-form; but just dropped it in low pressure plastic. All be it FM added some additional parts. Yeah...its a FM project. The recent Revell 1/72 Halifax III looks nice...but it couldn't stand up to a well built 1/48 scale kit in my opinion. However there are some skilled modellers out there in the WWW that could make this kit look 1/32. You know I wish AIRFIX would drop a 1/24 scale project and do a 1/48 scale Halifax making it the top of their range in 1/48...it would be nice. But its just me wishful thinking again…. Moving, handling, and transporting the kit is a challenge given its sheer size…and the poor FM engineering would result in structural failure I'm sure. Yeah the FM kit needs to be supported properly and brass and silver solder is the way to go there, esp at the wings fuselage joint. I have never done any work with brass / soldering so Its another challenge to master there. I have some photos some where WIP's on where I am now...I still haven't gotten past improving the major plastic components of the basic kit. Yet when I see a photo of a Halifax it makes me want to build it...I have no idea why. I don't know...maybe a mini group build on FM Halifax's...might be a winner. Pushing the modelling skills envelope...We could help each other kinda sorta…I don't know. Time might be against me... PHIL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Hi all fellow Halifax WingNuts, Yeah I've started the FM Halifax, in 1/48 scale, and its a project to say the least. I have MAP scale plans which I used to measure the major parts against and I've found the FM people made major screw ups. I have photos some where if any one is interested. It seems the whole fuselage is 1/4inch too short and they have sadly tried fix it by moving parts of the plane around to cover it. The top turrent is in the correct location but that is about all. The wings were cut/molded based on a scrap line on the drawing; rather than the correct joint line! I used 2x 80thou laminations on each wing to fix it. Thankfully the "T" tail and elevators are ok...but we are talking about a FM kit here. All the surface detail is very poor...and needs replacing. Like I said its a project... Sure the whole interior will need to be scratched built ...as most of the parts are quite simply trash. But I do have very high standards...That being said some modellers have managed to put it together... On one web build, the modeller said the engines were ok...but I think not. I intend to install the nice resin ones from Vector....I have 4x Tamiya Beaufighter engines to replace the sad ones from FM. The major stumble for me is one of the exhausts is on the opposite side of the Tamiya cowl...so I will have to figure out how to fix that issue. The oil coolers need replacing as they are just approx of the originals. The clear vac parts are non-usable...I will have to make my own...I've tried to contact FM for replacements but they didn't respond. This is a pick-up-model for me and this in not going to be built in a couple of months. I imagine it will take several years to complete... PHIL. HI PHIL some interesting points. I highlighted some areas that would be good to clarify. a quarter inch is one scale foot, the real Mk III is 71 ft, 7 inch. (or just over 35 inches,) I don't see how a quarter inch is going to show up, unless it's all in one place. Then it's easy to fix? Otherwise it will not be visible if it's spread out. If it is, please explain further, ideally with photos. In a thread on the Revell Mk II, it seems various plans were consulted, but were at variance with each other and the kits. Are the MAP plans to be trusted, or at least, compare area at variance with photos. Also, have you checked the kit and plans against actual known dimensions? There have been several debates on here about stretched plans due to effects of copiers and just paper changing shape, which is why I ask. Interior, 'trash' is not helpful, or even descriptive. I've not checked the parts against photos, please add detail, or some comparison pics of what is wrong. I see Mark has scratched an interior, but a given not much is really to be seen, a guide to major problems and salvageable parts would be handy I know the vac canopy parts are, 'less than optimum' but every completed build has used them, If you do make some new canopy parts, I'm sure you could sell a few. There was a change in exhaust position on the Mk VI and VII IIRC. The Sangar vac looks deeper in the fuselage than the FM kit, I don't know which kit is more accurate. If you do post up a WIP, which would be great, please add a link in here, I try to add cross links on here, as threads get 'lost' over time unless you know that subjects have come up. Look forward to finding out more! cheers T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongMan2 Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Hi Troy, I'm kinda busy right now...but I will try and answer most of your questions... The best Halifax Mk III build I've seen on the web is the uncompleted build of Halibag Phil's. Halibag Phil, (No relation) used these MAP plans to construct his resin 1/48 Halifax III. I believe his postings on the build are around the web and even here on BM. There are other documents out there like the Aerodata International, Squadron Signal Publications - a suspicious 1/72 - A Granger drawings which are in a reduced scale and of a Merlin engine Halifax only. These are nicely detailed and attractively presented. Unfortunately only of the Merlin versions...I don't know why the Hercules engine versions weren't reproduced. The Warpaint Series by Tony Buttler, has drawings which fold out in 1/72 scale but aren't detailed and sadly there are obvious errors...I would recommend using the drawings but there are some nice photos and text…in the book. Osprey has a book on the Halifax, Combat Aircraft 14, I believe, however the drawings are 1/144 scale and wouldn't lend themselves to blowing up to 1/48. Squadron in Action has a book but their drawings are full of errors...they are just informational use only. What ever that means. Hence the only reasonable plans are the old MAP plans…if you can find them if you would like to do a Mk III. Gee mine are 20yrs old now... I have taken some old photos of the FM Halifax wing and fuselage to help explain so far. I hope these help... With a look at the model built by Halibag Phil you will see what should be in the interior of a Mk III. He did a really outstanding job inmy opinion. I hope to have a model as good as his... I will when time permits, post some finished parts I have done for the build...I'm hoping this will help those building a 1/48 Halifax. PHIL. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Cornes Posted November 21, 2015 Author Share Posted November 21, 2015 Wow Phil, thanks for posting that. I may have to force myself to ignore it all - head in ground principle!! The question of which plans are correct is a vexed one and opinions are inevitable. The only definitive ones would be from HP and I imagine they were lost in the fire? Maybe RAF publications exist? I think the only real accurate evidence is from contemporary photographs where the location of parts can't be in doubt and model components can be directly compared, taking into account the photographic perspective. Its almost like saying the FM kit is a cartoon version of the real thing, which it may be but I don't know if I would have the heart to do the kind of surgery you have in mind - but each to their own and if we are happy with what we do then that's the main thing. Thanks again Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Phil THANK YOU! For someone short of time that is an excellent and clear description of the problems. I liked the line about 'legally justifying my statements' If my questioning post sounded cranky it's because I have a cold and feel miserable, and and when I run across broad statements my reaction is 'prove it' which you have done very clearly. That the kit has accuracy issues is not a great surprise. Could not the forward splice be added further back, so the extension is easier to do? I can see the point of adjusting the tail turret, I don't know how obvious the nose splice would be for the effort involved, the splice looks to be about 1/8th of an inch? Moving the wings out makes more sense, as easier and more visible, as you are talking about adding approx 4mm to each root? The Revell III kit has the same fuselage sprue as the Mk II kit, so no open hatch. I don't see a new tool 1/48th Halifax soon, a new tool Lanc is more likely.... cheers Troy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewerjerry Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 (edited) Hi Interesting thread, but I dont think I will bother modifying mine when i build them just a personal thing as the halifax is not my main aircraft of interest, and I personally always wonder about scale drawings ... just one of my 'things' ... but great work of explaining the difference from the FM and the drawing cheers jerry Edited November 21, 2015 by brewerjerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewerjerry Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I don't see a new tool 1/48th Halifax soon, a new tool Lanc is more likely.... cheers Troy Hi Most likely as I have two tamiya lancs and a paragon MkII conversion, in the pending pile Likewise as I have started a 1:32 whirlind and a 1:72 henley, both vacuform, so they will both soon come out in mainstream cheers jery 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Indeed, thanks for posting that info with photo's Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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