Survey what airbrush for acrylics and mixes are you using ?

[Merlin]

Hi,

Treading carefully before buying a suitable airbrush for spraying modelling acrylics.

As it takes forever to plough through threads summarising what airbrush is working and what isn't, ...

Without losing the picture amidst lots of waffle, I simply wish to see what airbrush, nozzle, acrylic paint brand, thinners, mix ratio and psi and spraying distance are folk using with success. Without it bunging up/slowing down during spraying, need for cleaning needle during one colour etc. For those using more than one brand, or airbrush , simply mention second set of data on a second row.or more. If retarders are a must for the combination, mention so and qty/make used.

example:-

Iwata Eclipse HP-BCS 0.5mm Tamiya, X20A, 30Thinners/70paint, 20psi, 5cm

Iwata Eclipse HP-BCS 0.35mm Tamiya, X20A, 40Thinners/60paint, 20psi, 5cm

Iwata Eclipse HP-SBP 0.2mm Tamiya, X20A, 50Thinners/50paint, 15psi, 3cm

Cheers

Merlin

[Housesparrow]

I think you really have to judge the viscosity of the paint you mix regardless. Rumor has it that it ought to have a milky substance to it.

I am curious what psi people are using for when airbrushing. Presumably meaningful when put into context of what airbrush, nozzle size, and paint they use.

[Bordfunker]

I use two airbrushes, both Badger 100s, one an SG with a fine head, haven't a clue what the measurements are but assume around 0.25m and a G with a 0.5 nozzle.

With the G I can spray Gunze/Tamiya acrylics thinned 60/40 paint to thinner, with either Tamiya X20A or Halfords cellulose thinner at between 15 and 20 psi.

With the smaller head on the SG I thin the paint 50/50, which allows a nice fine line.

Hope that helps.

Karl

[DaveCromie]

Hi Merlin

Airbrush: Harder & Steinbeck Infinity CR Plus with 0.2mm needle/nozzle - £165

Compressor: AS186 (generic, cheap oil less compressor that came with 2 air brushes for about £65)

Paint: Tamiya acrylics mixed with Tamiya X-20A thinners and Windsor & Newton Flow Improver at a ratio of 4:2:1 (10ml paint, 5ml thinner, 2.5ml flow improver)

Pressure setting: 15 to 20 PSI depending on how fine a line I am making (20 PSI for very fine lines with the airbrush set to only allow very small needle movements at about 5cm and 15 PSI for everything else between 10 and 15cm)

Cheers

DC

PS, good idea this, hopefully it will save some people a bit of time when they start air brushing and give them starters for 10!

[Denford]

I use two airbrushes, both Badger 100s, one an SG with a fine head, haven't a clue what the measurements are but assume around 0.25m and a G with a 0.5 nozzle.

If you are really interested, and I can understand if you aren't, Microbox make some very fine drills, 0.3 - 1.6 mm Often on sale at Model Shows surprisingly cheaply.

Generally useful, no invaluable, in modelling use them to determine the orifice size.

[Giorgio N]

I use two airbrushes: a Badger 200 NH with medium tip (can't remember what size it is) and a 0.2 mm H&S Ultra. With both I tend to stay between 20 and 30 PSI.

Thinning ratios... really depends a lot on the paint I'm using and what I'm doing, the combinations would be too many to list.

Distance, again it would depend on what I'm doing. For thin camouflage lines I go closer, thin the paint more and reduce the pressure. If I have to coat a larger area I move farther and increase the pressure

[Merlin]

Hi,

thanks so far, interesting that two posts are 0.2mm yet I am told 0.2mm too fine for acrylics..Iwata anyway. My Iwata at 0.2mm refuses to spray such and this size was to blame, though its no better at 0.3mm. I am considering Harder & Steenbeck. Self centring nozzle sounds better, makes sure paint can't collect around it unlike if it was off centre. As to which H&S is best, I await more posts, so far its a vote for Infinity CR Plus. I google this to see its a 2 in 1 airbrush, is that the one ? I ask as it says 0.15mm and 0.4mm and you say 0.2mm. Now with 0.2mm being problematic with acrylics if Iwata (mine anyway) then 0.15mm is heading the wrong direction it seems.

Hope to see more answers as this will prove valuable to many. If many combinations work, do at least mention one or two,

Merlin

[AngstROM]

Needle/nozzle size is to do with the kind of spray job you're doing rather than the medium you're using. Bear in mind that some acrylics (ahem *Vallejo*!) can be highly tempramental, others like Tamiya or Mr Color Aqueous are almost impossible to stuff up if correctly thinned with the appropriate thinner -ignore all those blustering posts from folk who claim to use old bath water, Beaujolais Noveau, car battery acid and whatnot, always use the manufacturer's recommended one.

Get an electric stirrer -or make one out of one of those miniature fans: whip off the blades and drill the end of a tidy length of sprue to fit the drive shaft. This will mix your paint/thinner most effectively.

Not pretty, but it was easier than making my own Light Sabre!

Anything the viscosity of semi-skimmed milk should airbrush through a 0.2mm with no woes.

Edited November 17, 2015 by AngstROM

[Wolfgang]

To my opinion this

thanks so far, interesting that two posts are 0.2mm yet I am told 0.2mm too fine for acrylics..Iwata anyway.

is an urban myth. It is not the needle or nozzle size that is the problem as i. e. the pigments ar far smaller. It is the acrylpaint in its behavior and its compostion itself. I have nor problems using Tamiya or Gunze alcohol diluteable acrylics in my Evoultion, equipped with a 0.15 mm needle/nozzle or in my 0.18 Iwata. But the water dilutable acrylics are far more difficulter to handle. Some work, but some dont.

They work better with a big nozzle, cause the ammount of color passing the nozzle is bigger and so the paint is fluider and does not tend to dry so fast at the needle tip respectively the drying paint is easier carried away by the amount of following paint.

Regarding thinning ratios: I dont have a standard. It depends on which viscosity I find in the paintbottle. As others mentioned, a milk like viscosity is the starting point. If I want to airbrush big areas, I thin less and if I do fine work like Luftwaffe mottles, I thin more.

Same with pressure. It depends on what I want to do. From 10 to 40 PSI

[fingers]

Regarding thinning ratios: I dont have a standard. It depends on which viscosity I find in the paintbottle. As others mentioned, a milk like viscosity is the starting point. If I want to airbrush big areas, I thin less and if I do fine work like Luftwaffe mottles, I thin more.

Same with pressure. It depends on what I want to do. From 10 to 40 PSI

Spot on especially about the variance in what comes out of the paint pot, this links to one of my pet peeves which is instructions which tell you 4 parts to 1 which of course is only applicable if both paints are currently at the same viscosity or at the viscosities at which the manufacturer produced them.

[Av8fan]

You can also use a milk frother from ikea for mixing.

http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/50301166/

With Tamiya Gunze AQ I started at around 50%-60% thinner to paint ratio and approx 8-15 psi depending on what I was trying to do. Some colours seemed to need a more thinner even then. Yes it is possible to over thin, so experiment, learn what works best for you and your setup.

Vallejo Model air: I alsways added a few drops of their thinner. The clear thinner worked much better for me before I had to pack up the kits/bench.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Av8fan

[Mitch K]

H&S Ultra, with a 0.2mm needle/tip.

I use Tamiya acrylics. I thin with isopropanol, roughly 2 parts paint to one part thinner (the exact ratio varies because the viscosity of individual paints is not constant). Operating pressure is about12-16 psi and I work at about about 15cm range to do wide work. For narrow lines/fine work, I go to about 8-10 psi and about 6cm range.

[little-cars]

Hi,

thanks so far, interesting that two posts are 0.2mm yet I am told 0.2mm too fine for acrylics..Iwata anyway. My Iwata at 0.2mm refuses to spray such and this size was to blame, though its no better at 0.3mm. I am considering Harder & Steenbeck. Self centring nozzle sounds better, makes sure paint can't collect around it unlike if it was off centre. As to which H&S is best, I await more posts, so far its a vote for Infinity CR Plus. I google this to see its a 2 in 1 airbrush, is that the one ? I ask as it says 0.15mm and 0.4mm and you say 0.2mm. Now with 0.2mm being problematic with acrylics if Iwata (mine anyway) then 0.15mm is heading the wrong direction it seems.

Hope to see more answers as this will prove valuable to many. If many combinations work, do at least mention one or two,

Merlin

Most H&S brushes are available as both a solo and a 2in1 version. Solo brush has one needle/nozzle/aircap set and one screw in paint cup, usually the 2ml. Two in one Brushes has two paint cups, 2ml & 5ml plus 2 needle/nozzle/aircap sets, 0.4mm for area coverage and either the 0.2 or 0.15mm set for finer work.

The infinity CR plus solo is available with either a 0.15 or 0.2mm nozzle set and a 2ml paint cup. Or with a 0.4mm nozzle set and a 5ml paint cup.

The infinity is the top of the range and has a couple of useful features, the preset handle that you can switch on and off and keep the setting. And the pincer aircaps. The aircap allows you to see the needle, which is useful in detailed work. It also allows you to see any paint buildup on the aircap before it becomes a problem and can be dealt with. H&S are fairlymodular, so the pincer aircap can be retrofitted to the Evolution brushes.

The most popular brush is the Evolution Silverline 2in1, 0.2 & 0.4mm nozzle, 2ml &5ml paint cup and preset handle.

I have most of the range available to try at shows if you would like to see what they are like.

Paul

[cruiserguy]

Hi Merlin,

I use Badger airbrushes, and have three Badger 200s: a 200G, with a medium needle, and two 200 NHs, one with a medium needle, and the other with a fine needle. I also have a Spraymaster cheapo, which I rarely use. As far as paint goes, I use Vallejo and Lifecolor, thinned with their own thinners, or Ultimate Thinners. A simple set up, but effective.

Best Wishes,

Will.

[Rob G]

I have an Iwata Hp-c (or something). Lovely dual action brush. I also have a Paasche single action. And a cheap Badger from a million years ago. I use the Iwata most, but that's because it's out of the box and plugged into the compressor.

I mix paint to something runny, put air through it, and adjust my distance as required to get a decent result.

Seriously, don't try to overthink this. On any given day, Mars will be in Scorpio, pi will not equal 3.14 and Uranus will be wiped out by Klingons. Buy the best you can afford that fits your hand, then learn to use it. It's a tool, and there isn't a perfect one, nor is there a magical formula for paint mixing, because every colour paint in every different batch from the same maker will give you different results every time you spray, due to Mars, pi, Uranus, Kkingons, humidity, and possibly which particular curry you had last Wednesday night.

If you can get to Paul from Little Cars, he's well regarded in plastic circles (never met the man, nor had dealings) and he can most likely point you in an approximately correct direction. In the end though, it's going to come down to how much time you spend learning the tool you have in your hand.

I give basically the same advice to people who ask me which camera they should buy to get the best photos...

[Duncan B]

example:-

Iwata Eclipse HP-BCS 0.5mm Tamiya, X20A, 30Thinners/70paint, 20psi, 5cm

Iwata Eclipse HP-BCS 0.35mm Tamiya, X20A, 40Thinners/60paint, 20psi, 5cm

Iwata Eclipse HP-SBP 0.2mm Tamiya, X20A, 50Thinners/50paint, 15psi, 3cm

Looking at your examples I'd say that your mixes are mixed up (if you pardon the pun). I would have expected the see the thinner paint mix with the thinner nozzle. Also I think that you could make your starting point a bit thinner than 50/50 thinners to paint, I tend to start at 60/40 thinners to paint (Gunze or Tamiya) and then thin from there depending on what I am trying to achieve.

I don't treat it like an exact science though and judge the paint mix by eye if it is a type I've used before. Maybe you should have a look at Mr Paint acrylics, they come ready mixed and you might be surprised how thin they are compared to your mixes.

Practice and experimentation is the key to successful airbrushing and once you've found a type of paint that works for you stick to it.

Duncan B (Iwata user x3)