Vallejo model air problem

[Hasegawa Geek]

Hi,

I recently bought some model air vallejo after not using them for 5 years and have run into an issue when airbrushing them. Yesterday I airbrushed the "white grey" onto a few areas on a model and today it is still tacky and sticky to the touch and easily rubs off with a fingernail. What did I do wrong? I airbrushed using light coats, just enough to cover the surface I was painting. I did not thin the paint at all. It sprayed very wet from the airbrush on a medium/low psi. Yes I did shake the bottle very thoroughly before putting into the airbrush. Here might be the problem: I sprayed it onto a non-primed surface on a Zvezda model. However, the surface was washed and prepped before painting so I don't see how that would affect the paint actually drying. This is by far the wettest paint I've ever used. I thought it may have been a bad bottle but I tried a different bottle bought from a different supplier and it was the same. I've only ever read how quickly Vellejo dries but this paint is WET.

Thanks for the help

[banzaiduke]

I almost exclusively use ModelAir and always thin with their airbrush cleaner. I know thinning changes the drying characteristics by quite a bit so give that a try and as for scratching off bare plastic ,its not the toughest of paints i've come across. Keep us informed of your progress because its a new one on me!!

[Hasegawa Geek]

Thanks for the help sir, I will try thinning a bit. What ratio do you use? 3 drops paint to 1 drop thinner?

[charley420]

What do you use to clean your airbrush? Could this have caused a reaction.

[Hasegawa Geek]

I use Tamiya acrylic thinner and the airbrush I used had not been used in about a year so anything in it would have long since evaporated. I only ever use Tamiya acrylics and thinner.

[CedB]

Perhaps a bad batch? I like Model Air and haven't had a problem with them drying... I don't thin, just a few drops of flow enhancer - bad luck there.

[cruiserguy]

Hi HG,

I suspect your Tamiya thinner is the culprit. AFAIK, it is mainly Isopropyl Alcohol; I have found Vallejo ModelColor reacts badly to it, and I guess it would be the same with ModelAir. Try Vallejo's own thinner or Ultimate Thinners, I know both of them work with Vallejo paint and primers.

Best Wishes,

Will.

[Hasegawa Geek]

Hi Will,

Thanks for the help. Before I sprayed anything of the Vallejo, I did run a few drops of the Vallejo Thinner through the airbrush to clean it out, then put in a few drops of paint un-thinned. I tried yesterday 6 drops of Vallejo to 2 parts Vallejo thinner and the exact same results happened: Sticky, un-dried paint. I will try to put down a primer coat and test to see if that is the only reason why this paint wont dry!

[banzaiduke]

A 6/2 mix is very close to what i use.As already said something else in your airbrush might affect the MA but if it is Iso it normally turns the paint to goop (technical term widely used on BM) Lol

[cruiserguy]

Hi HG,

This has me beaten, I have used Vallejo paints for 10 years now, stopped from time to time thinking others might be better, but have always gone back to them, and have never had the problem you have. Your mix ratio is fine, and I can see no reason why it should not dry.

Best Wishes,

Will.

HG,

I thought about this after I posted last night. It my sound daft, but how warm and humid is your house. If there is too much water vapour in the air in your house, it might prevent the paint from drying properly as Vallejo is water-based,

Friday 23 October at 08.45 am

[Stuck]

Although I am a confirmed Vallejo user, I have only sprayed the model air a few times and found it did remain tacky for quite a while. The problem i have found with at least the model color is that if stored in an upright position all the different pigments and dryers separate, and I dont believe a quick shake of the bottle will get them all back together again.,so because its just about impossible to stir these little bottles I store all the colours that I am working with upside down on a block of wood with some 20mm holes drilled in it.

[Hasegawa Geek]

The spraying conditions were normal (75 degree F, low humidity) and no different than when I use Tamiya, Model Master acrylics and Alclad, all of which dry rock hard.

Since a few days of spraying, the paint has gotten a tad bit harder but still easily comes off the plastic. At this point, It can only be a bad bottle or lack of primer. Can you guys recommend a good removing agent to get the paint off the plastic? I tried Wesleys Bleche Wite but surprisingly it would not get the paint off.

Cheers

Edited October 23, 2015 by Hasegawa Geek

[Stuck]

The spraying conditions were normal (75 degree F, low humidity) and no different than when I use Tamiya, Model Master acrylics and Alclad, all of which dry rock hard.

Since a few days of spraying, the paint has gotten a tad bit harder but still easily comes off the plastic. At this point, It can only be a bad bottle or lack of primer. Can you guys recommend a good removing agent to get the paint off the plastic? I tried Wesleys Bleche Wite but surprisingly it would not get the paint off.

Cheers

Tamiya X 20A thinner will remove the paint, found that out last week by accident.

[colin]

Although a lovely paint to airbrush/brush Vallejo is a nightmare when handling the model after, it's bad enough over a primer let alone on bare plastic.

Never had a problem with them drying though so looks like a bad batch or age of paint causing problem.

I would definitely prime the model first before you use them though,

[Hasegawa Geek]

Thanks. I got all the goopy paint removed. I don't want to give up on Vallejo yet so I'm going to prime some plastic and test out the same bottle of paint.

[mollythedog]

A couple of things you should consider.You should always prime first,the Vallejo Air has an incredibly fine pigment and gives a beautiful finish normally,but is very "tender" even when well dry-a decent primer coat gives the strength to the coating,and the VA just gives it the colour you want on top.

I have never been able to get the paint to spray without thinning it atleast 10-15% with Vallejo airbrush cleaner. It normally goes on very "wet" but dries within 10 minutes touch dry,but I always leave things a minimum of 24 hours before touching.

I NEVER spray without shaking the paint for several minutes,with a couple of 4mm ball bearings in every bottle(actually I cast my own white metal ones but if you can get stainless BBs they are less likely to leave any rust in the paint) and if you intend spraying a largish area or large model then a retarder is a must-I use Winsor and Newton but I'm sure others will do.

I have never had very good results with anything less than a 0.5mm nozzle/needle either-if you can get it to work on a 0.3mm then good luck with that.And I am using an industrial type compressor so no lack of pressure if I need it.....

HTH

mtd

[Housesparrow]

@mollythedog

What psi and what distance to the surface (that combo, psi and distance) do you go for, when airbrushing Vallejo primer onto a model?

Edited October 25, 2015 by Housesparrow

[charley420]

I use around 25 psi and spray from about 4 -5 inches using brisk passes.

[mollythedog]

As I have said in previous posts,don't get hung up on psi numbers-whatever "feels" right,probably around 20 psi but to be honest I don't know-if it don't spray right I might up it by a slight twist on the reg knob,but equally I might turn it down.It really depends on the paint,how long it has been in the ab (I spray several models during a session,and how it works at the end of 20-30 mins is completely different to how it worked at the start-this is quite normal and again,like everything else,will come with experience) As for distance,around 6 inches,but as before it depends-if the pressure is up then there is a real danger with the small subjects i spray will get blown away and damaged if the pressure is up too much.You'll know when you get it right....

And I do not use Vallejo primer-bought it,tried it,thought it was c*ap......use rattle cans for primer,more expensive,but gives good results,dries quickly,very hard wearing,especially on metal castings. My comments on paint were for Air,but would work for Color as well,if the paint is thinned with 30-35% Vallejo ab cleaner.And shake like mad........

HTH

mtd

[Hasegawa Geek]

Update.

I primed a piece of Zvezda plastic with Tamiya Grey primer, let dry 1 day then sprayed a very thin coat of Vallejo USAF Grey (12 drops of paint + 2 drops of thinner). It dried quickly and a day later it is scratch resistant and not sticky.

HOWEVER, I sprayed Vallejo Model Air White on the same piece of primed plastic in a different area, very light coat and it is still tacky to the touch, same thinning ration as the USAF grey. ALL of these bottles of paint were bought from different locations recently. I can only concluded that there is no conclusion. For the time being I guess I got lucky with the USAF grey and will be using it for my project. Sticking to decanted Tamiya lacquer for the white.

[John Masters]

I known this is an old thread...but I have to chime in briefly.

 

Having just committed to the airbrush world, I am still getting used to the different viscosities one must use, thinning, etc...a real education in patience and perseverance this is for sure.

 

I had a similar dilemma as Hasegawa Geek last night with some Vallejo Air IDF Green.  I am using a low psi--around 15 or so.  I did not thin the paint nor use flow enhancer.  It airbrushed beautifully.  Smooth, thin layers that covered very well.  

 

The issue was the drying time.  It took all night to lose any tackiness but this morning, just over 12 hours later, it is now dry to the touch.  I noticed that the areas that seemed the most damp were crevices and where there may have been a slight build-up of paint.  

 

Today I begin the darker camo areas with Vallejo non-Air German Camo Green.  I will thin it with airbrush cleaner (recommended) and add a drop or two of enhancer.  Cross you fingers lads!

 

Just my 2 drachmas...

 

--John

[planehazza]

Vallejo white is what brought me to this thread.  I too am having trouble with 71001 white. I shook and shook and shook, and sprayed (maybe too heavy a coat, but not running) and 24 hours later it's still sticky.  Had to sand it all down to plastic again. Thinking of getting another brand white, or maybe try thinning it a bit with flow improver as it does seem a little thick out of the bottle.

[John Masters]

Now that the weather has changed here in Greece, I am having no problem whatsoever with my Vallejo Air paints.  In the inter it is cold and damp, even inside regardless of heating.  24-48 hours was normal for drying time.  Now that the air is more dry and the temperature warmer, the paints are drying in 6-10 hours easily.

 

Regarding your white, planehazza...Mine is not thick at all and I have had good luck spraying with a wide 'brush' at about 20cm from the target and over a good primer.