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The way ahead for Airfix


Denford

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A Blackburn Roc or Skua is bet for the next announcement, I know I proably will be off target a hundred miles but at least I tried :)

Maybe not. Isn't there one (or large parts) in the same museum that had the 111 which was LIDAR'ed?

Trevor

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Maybe not. Isn't there one (or large parts) in the same museum that had the 111 which was LIDAR'ed?

Trevor

Yes they have one that is under restoration or rebuild if I don't err.

And the Skua is featured prominently on the box art of said He 111P

That too, may it's only a matter of time

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Perhaps we could cajole a Westland Widgeon...

There's one in Weston and I believe there is another at Flambards (or there was)

Brazil, Cylon, Hong Kong Auxiliary, Jordan allbused them. Could even throw in a Bristows scheme for the civvies.

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Junkers Ju-87D family...although whilst the Fujimi may not be so regularly available about the meridian anymore(unused to see bucketloads) I'm not so sure about the Italeri ones (although I've not searched reviews for age, detail & accuracy ro double check their competitiveness)

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For me I was looking into getting the Revell B-17G but I'm now going to wait for the Airfix version as I know it's going to be better and I'll get the P-40 as well simply because I think it looks cool and I'd rather get a new tool Airfix kit than an old Monogram kit or a hard to get likely overpriced Hasegawa effort.

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...or maybe they are doing lots of work and will bring out a new Piper Cherokee for Xmas... :)...

I'd like that. The only aeroplane I've actually got stick time in...

But general aviation types seem to be well down everyone's list of priorities.

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general aviation types seem to be well down everyone's list of priorities.

I think you'd already realise why wouldn't you? No glam, and otherwise unable to identify with type unless haviing flown one is the problem. Not meaning to be demeaning, but what's particularly inspiring or exciting about a Piper Cherokee (ancient nomenclature for the long defunct PA28-140 BTW) superseded by the PA-28 160 Warrior (no longer in production) its sibling PA-28 180 Archer or the retractable PA-28 200 Arrow? I've instructed on all, and yonks ago owned an Airfix model of the previous model Arrow. The series pretty much all look the same, and after having been out of production for so long until recent resurrection of the famous brand, have over that time lost the ubiquity they once enjoyed given their representation back in their heyday at pretty much every aerodrome in existence anywhere. Very successful navigation or retractable trainers and safe type for GA private pilots, nevertheless, that's pretty much were interest halts. Like sailplanes, they don't make good sales return subjects for manufacturer's new tool budgets. Can't see that changing anytime soon.

For a GA type have half a chance of achieving even modest sales today, it needs to be a current and so widely in service over many years, it is ubiquitious with the brand name and represented at every flying club or school. Even then it will only really sell through to the market who as you say, want it because by and large they have some personal association such as 'some stick time on it'. I saw it when I was a kid with Austers, Tiger Moths and Chipmunks in homes of wannabe pilots who'd had a few lessons, and later Airfix's Piper Arrow.

I was gobsmacked when Revell AG (?) released their ASK-21 and subsequently LS-8 and Duo Discus. So they must sell well? Having flown all the bar the LS-8 -my time is on the nowhere near as successful or popular and decidedly more challenging LS-7 wl, both two seaters are contemporary and so popular as to be ubiquitious. So most gliding club members will have flown one of them, the all important associative identification aspect I mentioned. And the latter two in the particular are aesthetically drop dead gorgeous.

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Think British and fastest piston fighter built.... :coolio:

You neglected to put "One of the" in front of the fastest bit.

A myth born from a modified racer Sea Fury taking the speed record.

In service the later versions of the Corsair were fastest by a few knots.

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I'll just keep plugging away asking for an accurate and up to current Airfix standards 1/48th Spitfire XIV in both high and low back configurations, followed by a Spitfire FR.XVIII. Surviving examples that can be lidared, good factory drawings and reference material available, able to be completed in a number of interesting schemes, and plenty of interest expressed by modellers to replace the woeful Academy examples. Then after the 1/48th examples, scale down and simplify for 1/72nd. Keeps filling the gaps in the Airfix Spitfire line.

The queue can start here.................................

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I'll just keep plugging away asking for an accurate and up to current Airfix standards 1/48th Spitfire XIV in both high and low back configurations, followed by a Spitfire FR.XVIII. Surviving examples that can be lidared, good factory drawings and reference material available, able to be completed in a number of interesting schemes, and plenty of interest expressed by modellers to replace the woeful Academy examples. Then after the 1/48th examples, scale down and simplify for 1/72nd. Keeps filling the gaps in the Airfix Spitfire line.

The queue can start here.................................

I'd suggest starting with 1/72 then scaling up to 1/48...

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I think you'd already realise why wouldn't you? No glam, and otherwise unable to identify with type unless haviing flown one is the problem. Not meaning to be demeaning, but what's particularly inspiring or exciting about a Piper Cherokee (ancient nomenclature for the long defunct PA28-140 BTW) superseded by the PA-28 160 Warrior (no longer in production) its sibling PA-28 180 Archer or the retractable PA-28 200 Arrow? I've instructed on all, and yonks ago owned an Airfix model of the previous model Arrow. The series pretty much all look the same, and after having been out of production for so long until recent resurrection of the famous brand, have over that time lost the ubiquity they once enjoyed given their representation back in their heyday at pretty much every aerodrome in existence anywhere. Very successful navigation or retractable trainers and safe type for GA private pilots, nevertheless, that's pretty much were interest halts. Like sailplanes, they don't make good sales return subjects for manufacturer's new tool budgets. Can't see that changing anytime soon.

For a GA type have half a chance of achieving even modest sales today, it needs to be a current and so widely in service over many years, it is ubiquitious with the brand name and represented at every flying club or school. Even then it will only really sell through to the market who as you say, want it because by and large they have some personal association such as 'some stick time on it'. I saw it when I was a kid with Austers, Tiger Moths and Chipmunks in homes of wannabe pilots who'd had a few lessons, and later Airfix's Piper Arrow.

I was gobsmacked when Revell AG (?) released their ASK-21 and subsequently LS-8 and Duo Discus. So they must sell well? Having flown all the bar the LS-8 -my time is on the nowhere near as successful or popular and decidedly more challenging LS-7 wl, both two seaters are contemporary and so popular as to be ubiquitious. So most gliding club members will have flown one of them, the all important associative identification aspect I mentioned. And the latter two in the particular are aesthetically drop dead gorgeous.

Of course I realise why GA types don't sell. It was just a throwaway remark... But in a perfect world I wouldn't have minded a little model PA-28-161 Warrior II on the shelf to remind me of the fact that I got one up and brought it safely down to earth on a few occasions. Nothing to impress a jaded instructor obviously, but it meant something to me. Unfortunately, for the price of each hour I could have replaced my kit stash several times over, so I gave up.

And while on the subject of personal associations, I'd also love models of some of the various motorbikes I've owned, but until I can afford a Ducati 1199 I'm going to be out of luck. ;)

Ian (Biker and Wannabe Pilot)

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Not meaning to be demeaning, but what's particularly inspiring or exciting about a Piper Cherokee

I think the one reason for Airfix producing a Piper Cherokee is ebay sales. The old tooling appears regularly on ebay and yet sells for high bids. This may suggest there is a demand for this type of plane and worth releasing in either the original or new kit form.

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Nothing to impress a jaded instructor obviously, but it meant something to me.

<snip> until I can afford a Ducati 1199 I'm going to be out of luck.

Hi Ian

They are what they are, neither more nor less, and I described that accurately. If that doesn't fit your romanticised notion, so be it.

Warrior - no longer made- IME is a good navigation trainer, private hire aircraft, and excellent operator aircraft. It is not a good ab initio trainer per se, although it is a type students and private pilots like and which builds confidence easily because of its docility and performance seldom exceeding their level of competence. The Archer is nicer for its slightly higher performance, but it's also dearer to operate and more challenging to less able students/pilots. Yes, that hardly higher rate of climb and marginally higher speed can make a difference to the learning curve challenged. Cessna were just as clever with their lineup, their 182 retractable being the pick of the piston singles bunch in overall performance and handling. Late to that party after their Musketeer, Beech made the best ab initio trainer of the lot, but the Skipper was also the least liked because it shows up every fault in a student's performance. Confident above average ability students love it, most hate it. Would have made a decent military trainer although it still doesn't meet the kind of performance requirement offered by the likes of a CT-4A/B, the former of which I was taught on. I know where Beech were coming from with their Skipper, and like all Beechcraft, it was the cream of class in GA. But it's not ideally suited to the commercial environment of a flying school with all the compromises which must be made due to the conflict of interest in retaining the paying customer vs turning out a basically safe vs highly competent product. Ain't no such thing as a scrub ride in civvy street except for the uttterly hopless who shouldn't be left in charge of a shopping trolley on their own, or pressure within a 'perform or you're gone' timeframe other than imposed by ego or budget.

Ducati, that'd have to be a memory anyone rational would rather forget wouldn't it? :banghead:

Different strokes I suppose.

Not to dispel the dream, rather to lend perspective. I owned several when I went through my own Ducati phase long long ago. 860GTS, legendary (silver/blue fibreglass tanked) 900SS Desmo the epitomy of super cool in its day, and 450 Desmo also pretty high on the want to own/be seen on list back then. The latter two were right hand shift, no crossover linkage. Truth was, the first liquid cooled Yamaha the RD350LC even without YPVS and coming out a half a decade later with a rider of moderate ability would clean up any and all of the above back in the day as would one of my two current rides, a last production batch "T" suffix RGV250 now although its been out of production for nearly two decades. I was wise enough not to ignore that truth when confronted by it. The cool status pervading the mystique and hype didn't match with bitter lemon reality they were. The realisation of that came expensively and brutally after two engines managed to self demolish themselves despite being ridden within spec using the gearbox properly and mechanically pampered more than my wife. Edison era electrics, rubbish metalurgy, agricultural engineering, very sexy looks in their day without the performance to match. The former two have changed, the last two haven't. Dovizioso managed a few respectable podium places early this season matched equally in retirements for the first time in many seasons, but has the brand even managed a 1st since Stoner got off the bike? Kudos to him.

Re your flying. If you want it enough, you'll find a way to do it. Life is short. Carpe diem.

Edit: added hotlink to 1975 900SS. Curiosity begged, and actually finding that link so close to home gobsmacked me. Like new. Guessing it's someone my age or possibly older who's passed on and his estate/collection is being liquidated for cash by his children/his wife, or he's doing so himself to fund his shift to a nursing home. Ahahaha. I know the time has come to get off mine now, but they owe me nada and they sure are purdy to look at and reminsce with.

Edited by Bigglesof266
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I think the one reason for Airfix producing a Piper Cherokee is ebay sales. The old tooling appears regularly on ebay and yet sells for high bids. This may suggest there is a demand for this type of plane and worth releasing in either the original or new kit form.

Wonder it if it's collectors, nostalgia, or given the utter dearth generally of GA types, demand exceeding very limited supply?

Regardless I wonder if demand from the latter two would be sufficient to support a new tool vs alternative priorities offering more assured return on investment?

Not knocking the idea of producing an Arrow et al, just putting the obvious out there. Personally I'd be more than content to see Airfix reproduce every type known to mankind to keep everyone happy, even though I don't it eventuating into pragmatic reality.

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It's a sore point at the moment due to the ongoing issues involving the types, but new kits of the Grob Tutor and Vigilant could be quite successful, and maybe even the Viking. A lot of air cadets make models, and are encouraged into it. Building something they will actually be flying in (hopefully) and can therefore relate to is always a plus.

I could even be tempted into building a Viking, having had a few circuits in those in my younger days...

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Over the years Airfix produced a good selection of GA and light/medium aviation subjects including:

(and this is 72nd only, and not intended as definitive. Some were military but easily converted to civi):

Piper Cherokee

Grumman Gosling/Widgeon (re-released)

Beatle Basset (kickstarter)

Beagle Pup

SA Bulldog

DHC Chipmunk

DHC Beaver (Kickstarter)

DH Heron

Bristol Superfreighter

Auster 6

Cessna O-1 Birddog

Cessna O-2 Skymaster

DH88 Comet (re-released)

Ford Trimotor

HP Jetstream

Shorts Skyvan

HS Dominie

All pre-80 bar:

DH Tiger Moth

Douglas Dakota

+ various helicopters, other scales, military relations

So other than the new Moth and Dakota, the Basset and Beaver stalled on kickstarter, anf a couple of rereleases of golden oldies they have all pretty much been left to wither and die...which is a shame as there is pretty much no readily available competition.

Edited by dpm1did1
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<snip> new kits of the Grob Tutor and Vigilant could be quite successful, and maybe even the Viking. A lot of air cadets make models, and are encouraged into it. Building something they will actually be flying in (hopefully) and can therefore relate to is always a plus.

As usual on the common sense money T7. I agree. If Revell can sell ASK-21 and Duo Dicsus kits, the Grob is a potentially viable project. Marketed around the world and has succesfully penetrated markets.

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