Navy Bird Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 OK, it's time for more questions for Steve! VX388 has these cool guards that are attached to the outer portion of the horizontal tailplanes (Special Hobby didn't include these, so I made them from wire): I also see where VX388 has a cable, visible in the above photo, that goes from the top of this guard to a small mast that is on the top of the vertical fin. The same is repeated for the other side. Are these cables a standard part of the TT package, meant to prevent the target from getting tangled up in the elevators/rudder? The mast on top of the fin is not where the radio aerial wire would normally attach on the earlier Marks. On VX388, I don't see a radio wire, just the mast in front of the rear canopy, and a whip antenna behind the rear canopy. I know that your aircraft is a TT.5, whereas the kit I'm building is a TT.4. Do you think the antennae setup on VS388 would be the same as on my model, in other words no wire? Thanks in advance! Cheers, Bill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 Ah, Lego blocks - you gotta love 'em. So here are my jigs (one for each side): The block that is at an angle is an adjuster. Varying the angle of the block will adjust the tilt of the wings (when folded, the top of the wing tilts out relative to the bottom of the wing). Each jig also has a slot formed between the blocks in which the wing sits, and another slot for clearance of the drop tanks (which have been added since the last update). Here is what everything looks like when the model is placed within the jigs: Sliding the jig back and forth along the bottom edge of the wing will adjust how far above the horizontal tailplane the end of the wing will be. As it's assembled and adjusted right now, everything is pretty close to where it should be (as far as I can tell!): You may have also noticed that I've added the covers over the cannon apertures in the leading edge of the wing. These were supplied in resin from Special Hobby and needed some careful sanding with a round file in order to match the curvature of the wing. Royal pain in the bottom that was! The black patch was also added to the port drop tank. The wings still need their final varnish and then I can remove the masking tape from the lights. I wish I knew what the angle of the tilt is supposed to be in that last photo (head-on shot). I could then be more precise in my adjustment. As it is, I'm going to try and measure the photos that I have and see if I can get something to work with. Cheers for now, Bill 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I might be able to help with the aerial fit Bill. My references show that your Firefly went from 700 Squadron to Airwork at Hurn when the Fleet requirements role was taken over by private contractors. As Hurn is only four miles from where I live I have made a bit of a study of the Fleet Requirements Unit there and have some pictures of their Fireflies somewhere. As they would be all fitted with the same radio and aerial fit, if I can find my file we should have answer. The scanner is on the blink again but I should be able to tell you what you need to know. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 On 1/27/2016 at 17:46, martin hale said: I might be able to help with the aerial fit Bill. My references show that your Firefly went from 700 Squadron to Airwork at Hurn when the Fleet requirements role was taken over by private contractors. As Hurn is only four miles from where I live I have made a bit of a study of the Fleet Requirements Unit there and have some pictures of their Fireflies somewhere. As they would be all fitted with the same radio and aerial fit, if I can find my file we should have answer. The scanner is on the blink again but I should be able to tell you what you need to know. Martin Thanks! It's amazing how many folks who are following this build have just the sort of insider knowledge that I need. See if you can find out if they have the extra cables from the tailplanes to the fin - this would only show up on target tugs I'm guessing. Moving forward on the wing attachment, I'm guessing that the tilt angle is 12 degrees or so...the difference between these two measurements is probably because it's not exactly head-on. Cheers, Bill PS. The tilt angle in the model of my model with the jigs is about 17.5 degrees, so I have a bit of adjusting to do! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 All the pictures I have ever studied of TT Fireflies show the cables going from the tail planes to both the top of the fin and to the fuselage on the underside of the aircraft. They were there to prevent the drogue and it's cable fouling the control surfaces. Martin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 OK, it's time for more questions for Steve! VX388 has these cool guards that are attached to the outer portion of the horizontal tailplanes (Special Hobby didn't include these, so I made them from wire): I also see where VX388 has a cable, visible in the above photo, that goes from the top of this guard to a small mast that is on the top of the vertical fin. The same is repeated for the other side. Are these cables a standard part of the TT package, meant to prevent the target from getting tangled up in the elevators/rudder? The mast on top of the fin is not where the radio aerial wire would normally attach on the earlier Marks. On VX388, I don't see a radio wire, just the mast in front of the rear canopy, and a whip antenna behind the rear canopy. I know that your aircraft is a TT.5, whereas the kit I'm building is a TT.4. Do you think the antennae setup on VS388 would be the same as on my model, in other words no wire? Thanks in advance! Cheers, Bill The cable is to protect the tail from the drogue getting tangled, on 388 the lower two cables have been disconnected and rolled up as they are quite dangerous when one is clambering around the aircraft. The large aerial mast and associated wire is for the HF radio and is not installed on the Tugs. The whip is for the single TR.1936 VHF set. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 Excellent! Thanks fellas, now that I look more closely at the photo in post #701 at the top of the page, I can see the lower cable which has been disconnected and rolled up. I also have another photo of VX388 (from jetphotos.net) that shows what looks like the fuselage attachment point for the lower cables, between the rear of the tailwheel well and the rudder. Is that what I'm seeing, or do the lower cables connect in a different spot? One other bit of information that will help me position the folded wings correctly is the distance between the tailplane and the trailing edge of the wing aileron. It doesn't look like a lot in some photos - maybe a foot or so. I'm a bit reluctant to commit glue to model until I know for sure where the wing should be. I've adjusted my jig so I've got the 12 degree angle set, so I can cross that off. Cheers, Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giemme Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Lego jigs: how clever is that? I have buckets of them, should put them to good use Ciao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Yep, those jigs are quite inspired Bill, excellent idea! Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) Great jiggery! Steve will know, but were / are the wings locked in place once folded? Earlier Fairey designs (Fulmar, Barracuda) had a set-up where the elevator had a role in supporting the folded wing, but they were manual folders, not hydraulic (as, indeed, were the early marks of Firefly). I'm sure they wouldn't have relied on hydraulic lock alone - a bit of bleed over time and you'd have flappy wings on a windy flight deck; not a good thing. Ooh, as I write I have a vague memory of there being some strut or other built into the airframe to support the folded wings. My (rambling) point is that the strut arrangement would give you both the angle and the size of gap. Steve? [P.S. both Mark 1 & 5 appear in my stash. They are both 1/48 (I don't do 1/72 any more!), but if they turn out looking anything like as good as these two, I'll be chuffed to bits.] Edited January 28, 2016 by Ex-FAAWAFU 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 You'd be reffering to the wing fold jury struts that I posted some very nice shots of way back in September last year? Since you've probably been into Martins cheap scotch and not been paying attention here they are again 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Those are the very things, yes. Not guilty on the Scotch; guilty as charged on only partly paying attention. Ta 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Cheap Scotch? Cheap Scotch! you try shelling out for a bottle of Springbank and see how much change you get! You could probably buy two Hasegawa kits for the price and have change left over! Martin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 I was paying attention - the jury struts are on my list. I don't have any square styrene rod though, just round. I guess it's off to the LHS to see what they have. Cheers, Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Right Bill! I have tidied my room from top to bottom looking for my Hurn pictures (that doesn't happen for just anyone you know, not even Mrs Martin!) and finally have the answer you are seeking regarding the aerial. The aerials fitted were lacking the wire to the tail and were both slanted and offset to starboard as in the picture of the Canadian Firefly you have. Off to have slurp of Caol Ila, due to me still coughing up the dust from sorting my room out. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 28, 2016 Author Share Posted January 28, 2016 On 1/28/2016 at 15:02, martin hale said: Right Bill! I have tidied my room from top to bottom looking for my Hurn pictures (that doesn't happen for just anyone you know, not even Mrs Martin!) and finally have the answer you are seeking regarding the aerial. The aerials fitted were lacking the wire to the tail and were both slanted and offset to starboard as in the picture of the Canadian Firefly you have. Off to have slurp of Caol Ila, due to me still coughing up the dust from sorting my room out. Martin Great sleuthing, Martin! I appreciate you taking one for the team. So, the whip aerial is offset to starboard as well - interesting. I hadn't noticed that before. Earlier in this thread, Steve was able to ascertain that the aerials lost the offset and moved back on the longitudinal axis beginning sometime in the FR.5 production run. Since my TT was converted from a FR.4, I believe that the aerials were still offset. I hope you get that coughing settled down. You'll need your full lung capacity for when you sand your next resin kit. Cheers, Bill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 The pictures of the FRU aircraft clearly show offset aerials so I think you are as safe as you are ever going to be on that one. "I hope you get that coughing settled down. You'll need your full lung capacity for when you sand your next resin kit. " Are you trying to kill me off or something Bill? Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAVY870 Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 . I also have another photo of VX388 (from jetphotos.net) Dont get me started on that toerag that took those shots. Specifically told he could not take photo's for publication and has splattered them all over the web, including shots of stuff we dont wish to advertise we have yet. He has caused the museum all sorts of trouble from the vultures, I do hope he asks for a return visit so I can run him over with one of our tanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain goat Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Caught up on this build - my what splendid modelling. Nothing beats HS Silver with yellow if you ask me. Jay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 29, 2016 Author Share Posted January 29, 2016 On 1/29/2016 at 05:46, NAVY870 said: Dont get me started on that toerag that took those shots. Specifically told he could not take photo's for publication and has splattered them all over the web, including shots of stuff we dont wish to advertise we have yet. He has caused the museum all sorts of trouble from the vultures, I do hope he asks for a return visit so I can run him over with one of our tanks! I'm sorry to hear that. "David S." is the photographer associated with that image. He the guy? He sounds like a right stupid little bugger. Have you tried explaining the situation to jetphotos.net? Those sites have pretty strict copyright abuse policies. "including shots of stuff we dont wish to advertise we have yet." - so that's where that CF-105 Arrow went to! Cheers, Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Bird Posted January 31, 2016 Author Share Posted January 31, 2016 Hi mates, It's been two entire days since my last update, and I think this build is nearing the end. I added the VHF radio mast and the whip antennae, both offset from the aircraft centerline and leaning back a bit in the breeze. Next I added the photoetch pieces that represent the exhaust flare shields. Then I added the guards that I made out of copper wire to the outer part of the tailplanes. I painted these black on the bottom half and aluminium on the top half to match the photos of VX388. The guards are not entirely authentic, as the short vertical bars that add additional support are not present. Not that I didn't try, but they would only be about a millimetre or so in height, and I was having no luck cutting pieces of wire to the right size. Ugh. I then added the cables that run from the bottom of the guards over to center of the fuselage. I used 0.005" Nitinol wire for this, I just love that stuff. I was going to add the top cables next, but realized that I probably should glue the wings on first. So I first made a "12 degree from vertical" template to help me set the tilt of the wings, and then mounted the wings into my Lego jig and made my final adjustments. Then I bit the bullet and glued them on! I let them sit overnight before even attempting to see if they would stay on without the support of the jig. I think I got lucky, the glue held and I was even able to add two small decals to the upper surface of the wings that I had forgotten, without knocking them off. Keep your fingers crossed... All that's left are the upper cables (with the small post on top of the tail) and the jury struts as far as I can see (along with the small panels that open up to allow the jury struts to be extended and attached to the wing). My LHS was out of the small, square cross-section rod, so I may go ahead and use my small round rod and just make believe it's square. Here are some pictures - I suspect the next photos I take will be those for the RFI thread. There is probably no reason to add any more here. Thanks - it's been fun! Cheers, Bill 19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefr22 Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Stunning work Bill, just stunning!! Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-FAAWAFU Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Beautiful. Can we at least have one photo with both Fireflies together? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CedB Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Gorgeous Bill, just gorgeous. Thanks for sharing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perdu Posted January 31, 2016 Share Posted January 31, 2016 Proper job Bill That looks wonderful (echo the wish for both together too) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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