Heinkel 111 in 1/72, what's the best one?

[dfqweofekwpeweiop4]

The Revell kit is the Hasegawa kit.

It sure is, I've built both boxings. Nice kit too, builds very well and is, at the moment the best choice for anyone who wants a HEIII and doesn't care what version.

thanks

Mike

[Sgt.Squarehead]

I hate their bomb-bay parts.....Half-hearted bloody waste of plastic!

[Heraldcoupe]

The current Revell He-111 is the Hasegawa moulding. The old Frog moulding has also been boxed by them fairly recently in one of their gift sets, so be careful of that one.
They also issued the Italeri He-111 in the past.

All of the above will be eclipsed when the new Airfix He-111 hits the shelves. Which is annoying considering how many I already have in the stash...

Cheers,

Bill.

[kolibri282]

I only found out the Hasagawa kit was hardly

any different to the Revell kit yesterday when I

got my Hasagawa kit in the post yesterday.

The only place I can see Revell as the better kit

is the cockpit detail. The rest of the kit might

as be the kit. The real difference is the

price !

I think I'll stick with the Revell kit and the

monstrous Eduard 2 Photo etch brass sheets

of upgrades and CMK resin exterior details. If any

If any pmodel manufacturers can eclipse that for detail

I'll buy it.

Steve in the USA

Edited May 29, 2015 by kolibri282

[Smudger2]

Hmmm,

I only found out the Hasagawa kit was hardly
any different to the Revell kit yesterday when I
got my Hasagawa kit in the post yesterday.
The only place I can see Revell as the better kit
is the cockpit detail. The rest of the kit might
as be the Revell kit. The real difference is the
price !!

I thought they were the same kit, that's why i bought the Revell one, it's half the price!

How can the cockpit detail be different if it's the same kit?

Regards,

Rob

[kolibri282]

It looks like there's bit more to the Revell kits cockpit

detail. I could be wrong, but I think I'm right.

Actually I think the Italeri cockpit detail is pretty

good as well although it lacks against the other

two kits in a lot of other ways. I'll get both kits out

and compare them though.

[kolibri282]

A question I just thought of.

Is the Hasagawa Heinkel 111Z Zwilling the

old Italeri kit reboxed? I've got the Italeri kit

unbuilt with a ton of after market upgrades

from Eduard( the P/E double sheet has so many

parts it's eye watering!) and CMK which are more

exterior details, engines, wing surfaces, undercarriages

etc. I thought because it was such a one off and

unique it should have all the stops pulled out to

make this model really special. I'm wondering if

Hasagawa used two Revell fuselages with new tooled middle

wing with three engines or just the complete old Italeri

kit. If they did use the Revell fuselages and a new middle

wing and engines I might have to track it down.

I have the Italeri Messerschmitt 321 Gigant glider and two

of Gotha gliders so the more detail the better. I used to

have the He111Z and Gigant 321 on an airfield I built back

in the UK before I came to live in the USA in 2011,

but it had to be left behind in the UK sadly.

I recently replaced them all after much scouring the

internet, luckily none of them cost a fortune. I had the

He111Z in it's box from the UK. It just means building

all of them again though! There won't be any airfield though

sadly. I've got the Me323 Gigant as well, the wife

is not amused her garden shed has become my modeller's

corner though !!!

Edited May 29, 2015 by kolibri282

[occa]

The Revell 04377 kit IS the Hasegawa, there are no special parts from Revell in it ...

Hasegawa's Z was also fully Hase's own kit

[kolibri282]

Would you say the He111z was a vast improvement on the Italeri version and would a load of upgrades remedy any defficiencies ?

Is it worth getting the Hasagawa He111Z if I already have the Italeri version from the mid 80's?

I have enough upgrades to make the model way and beyond any commercially available He111 kit. I basically got upgrades for two He111's which I thought would do for the Zwilling. If I have to get the Hasagawa kit I will, but not if I don't need to as I really don't need two He111Z's cluttering up the garden shed even more than it is!

Edited May 30, 2015 by kolibri282

[Chuck1945]

Depends, if you have compared the Italeri and Hasegawa He 111H kits and are happy with Italeri's version tarted up with AM, then go with their Zwilling. If you think the Hasegawa He 111 is much superior to Italeri's then recognize that Hasegawa's Zwilling will also be superior to Italeri's. I have both, but that is because I was able to get the Hasegawa kit a few years ago when Sprue Bros was having a sale. If I ever get around to actually building one, it will be the Hasegawa rendition.

[kolibri282]

I'm trying to work out if the Hasagawa Zwilling is the same quality of molding as the Revell He 111 Hasagawa is producing or is it entirely new Hasagawa molds. I know how good Hasagawa's own model kits are. Are we looking at the same quality as a later Revell molding? I know Italeri is dated, but for detail and accuracy which stands up best? Another question is this. I know the Zwilling carried torpedoes at some point, but as a glider tug was it used as a bomber or torpedo carrier. I'm thinking to keep down take off weight as a glider tug it would make sense to not carry ordinence. Has the Hasagawa got the option to have open bomb doors? Did it ever drop bombs from it's bomb bays in reality?

[Chuck1945]

The current Revell boxing of the He 111H-6 IS the Hasegawa kit. Only difference is the price and decals. The Hasegawa He 111Z is two He 111H kits and additional parts to make a Zwilling. The only use of the Zwilling was as a glider tug assigned to transport gruppen. It was not used to drop bombs or torpedoes. The kit however does contain the internal parts of the Hasegawa He 111 bombers.

My Italeri and Hasegawa He 111 kits are all packed up and in storage, so a direct comparison is not currently possible by me. From what I remember from comments at the time, both kits are reasonably accurate in shape, the Italeri kit has raised panel lines, Hasegawa has engraved lines that have received some criticism for being too obtrusive. Detail on the Hasegawa kits is sharper and they have more interior parts.

[Heraldcoupe]

I only found out the Hasagawa kit was hardly

any different to the Revell kit yesterday when I

got my Hasagawa kit in the post yesterday.

The only place I can see Revell as the better kit

is the cockpit detail.

There's no difference. Hasegawa made the tooling, Revell buy bagged mouldings from Hasegawa and put them in Revell packaging. Exactly the same plastic goes into Hasegawa boxes.

The only differences are down to specific variants, eg Hasegawa produce and He-111P which Revell have never re-boxed.

Cheers,

Bill.

[Tbolt]

There's no difference. Hasegawa made the tooling, Revell buy bagged mouldings from Hasegawa and put them in Revell packaging. Exactly the same plastic goes into Hasegawa boxes.

The only differences are down to specific variants, eg Hasegawa produce and He-111P which Revell have never re-boxed.

Cheers,

Bill.

I thought I read from some one that the Revell boxed version of Hasegawa kits use a cheaper plastic, which isn't as nice to work with, though I haven't build a Revell boxed Hasegawa kit yet.

[Smudger2]

Hi, I always liked the old Airfix H20 version as a kid, i have since gone right off it, i bought the Frog one later on and the Italeri kit to compare them against each other, as i remember they were both nice easy builds, the italeri He111 was the recognised by many as the best He111 on the model market until the Hasegawa kit came out, and shortly afterwards Revell released their (Hasegawa tooled) version at a much cheaper price, and now all eyes seem to be on Airfix in anticipation of their new release, which is expected to be the "dogs wotsits" if you know what i mean.

Coming from Airfix, it should be affordable to all.

I for one will be racing to get one upon it's release.

It's going to be interesting to see how they all compare once the new Airfix kit appears, lets hope that Airfix don't crash and burn on this one then.

Regards,

Rob

Edited May 30, 2015 by Smudger2

[kolibri282]

That clears a lot up then. I might as well build the Italeri kit with the AM parts I have for it. It wouldn't be worth buying the Hasagawa kit even with the option of open bomb bays because the He111Z was never used as a bomber, although there is evidence to prove there were plans to build a bomber version at some point from what I read.

I'm guessing it was only used in Eastern Europe as I've not seen any evidence to show it was used in the Mediterranean theatre. I'm guessing it would have two camouflage schemes. The splinter greens and light blue and the white and light blue. Were they used at the Stalingrad airlift? Where they used in North Africa or the Crete invasion ? How many camouflage schemes could there have been for the 10 of them?

Edited May 30, 2015 by kolibri282

[Mike]

If anyone's going for the He.111Z from Hasegawa, you'll probably want to scoop up any of Eduard's PE sets for it ASAP if not sooner, as they're currently discontinued You'll be pleased to hear that the interior set doesn't include any bomb bay details.

[Heraldcoupe]

I thought I read from some one that the Revell boxed version of Hasegawa kits use a cheaper plastic, which isn't as nice to work with, though I haven't build a Revell boxed Hasegawa kit yet.

Not true, they are identical down to the plastic bags Hasegawa put the mouldings in,

Cheers,

Bill.

[Sgt.Squarehead]

If anyone's going for the He.111Z from Hasegawa, you'll probably want to scoop up any of Eduard's PE sets for it ASAP if not sooner, as they're currently discontinued You'll be pleased to hear that the interior set doesn't include any bomb bay details.

Even Eduard couldn't casually save the shonky substitute for a bomb bay in the Hasegawa/Revell kit.....It would require a Brassin bombs set and a full etch fret for the bays.

I strongly suspect that these would cost considerably more than the Airfix kit.....Anyone want to buy/swap a Revell He.111?

[kolibri282]

Sargeant Squarehead I have the Revell and Hasagawa kits and I don't need both to be honest. It was because the website on Amazon had already sent the Hasagawa kit by the time I got the Revell kit I have two of them. I already have the old Italeri He111Z with AM Eduard parts and resin details for all the engines, undercarriages, wing surfaces etc. Some parts are white metal. But as for the He111 I'm not fussed which kit I build as they both look the same to me. Thankfully the He111Z doesn't need a bomb bay open to be historically accurate.

Edited May 30, 2015 by kolibri282

[Fifer54]

The He111Z-1s were intended to take part in the resupply of Stalingrad, but had to tow their Me321s from Reims to the goal, with so many delays at staging posts along the way they didn't reach the jumping-off point until January 28th, 1943, by which time it was too late to participate in the Stalingrad operation.

They were then deployed to the Crimea on CasEvac duties.

They were intended to take part in operations towing Me321s to Sicily loaded with 2 divisions of paratroopers, but staging was again a problem, the distance from their then bases in France being too great, and no suitable intermediate landing fields available.

The Zwilling Staffels were disbanded in the Autumn of 1944, when only 4 of the original 12 aircraft remained, the others having been shot down or destroyed on the ground by bombing.

In spite of all this the Zwilling was judged successful enough for proposals to be made to (and accepted by) the Technischen Amt of the RLM for bomber and reconnaissance variants, although neither was built. The Z-2 bomber variant was intended to carry 4 SC1800 bombs,or 2 LMA III mines and 2 SC1800s, or 6 SD1000 bombs, or 4 Hs293 missiles. Z-3 was the reconnaissance bird, with an estimated range of 2,670 mile carrying 4x198 gallon drop tanks.

Information paraphrased and condensed fron "The Warplanes of the Third Reich" by Dr William Green.

[kolibri282]

Thanks for that information. Do you have any idea of camouflage colours? Is it safe to assume the the standard splinter upperside green and underside blue would be ok? And the Me 321 would be the same. Both glider and aircraft would have yellow wing tips and yellow fuselage bands denoting the Eastern theatre of operations?

Edited May 30, 2015 by kolibri282

[Smudger2]

Hi,

This may not be relevant to your chosen colour scheme, but while i was visiting RAF Cosford last year, i saw a couple of pictures of a He111z in a book in the gift shop which showed one in white winter camo presumably somewhere on the eastern front.

Also they have a built model section and they had an Italeri He111z on show and that was in white with green camo, i don't know how accurate the model kit was but the photo's in the book prove that this scheme was used operationally at least.

This aircraft type probably only had an operational lifespan of 2-3 years, so the colour schemes may not be that varied and probably was in the standard splinter colours and whitewashed for inter operations, the Italeri boxing i have shows it in the standard splinter scheme on the box art.

I have not built mine yet but i think i will be doing mine in the winter scheme, as the type might have saw more service on that front than any other front, that's just my opinion and i have not researched it enough to make a definite decision.

Regards,

Rob