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1/48 - Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-23BN "Flogger-H" by Trumpeter - released - nose correction set by Cold War Studio and from Ciro Models


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8 hours ago, Otakar said:

What will be the cost of this conversion?

His Foxbat update for the KH kit is 25Euros so I would think around that money. I have his MiG-17/21 upgrades and am impressed with his eye re. shape. Great news that the MiG-23 conversion is on final approach :)

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  • 4 weeks later...

Shape looks great, spot on! However, the canopy looks a bit badly moulded. And the etch frame seems to be a potential nightmare... Or maybe this is just a test-shot? But this really makes me tempted to build this one after all.

Edited by Bjorn
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Agreed Bjorn, the canopy doesn't look great. I have the Mig-27 and waiting on their correction set so hoping for something good!

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On 17-12-2016 at 1:15 PM, Otakar said:

Here is a piece of trivia and a challenge for anyone who wants to accept it. Try to find a picture or video of ANY of these MiG-23/27 aircraft in flight with its wings in full sweep. 

 

Ooh, I do love me a challenge. How about this then?:

 

www.hottail.nl/airforces/hungary/images/Mig-23-4.jpg

 

Cheers,

 

Andre 

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WOW, that is a first. Must be doing Mach 1.5 in that picture. Must have been taken in some attempt of record braking. Considering the poor quality of the photo. I than also found this. https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjAqpmXvufRAhWJ3oMKHZqQDRcQjRwIBw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fmoreaubruno%2Fmikoyan-gourevitch-mig-23%2F&psig=AFQjCNEzZjygnMnpnkykelY1Z7l0nH0mXg&ust=1485783621131829 I also noticed the "up elevon" configuration of the tail surfaces. This must be to keep the "nose up" in this sweep configuration.

Edited by Otakar
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That is a great improvement over the original kit. That now only brings the price of the kit to roughly $75 US. I might tree myself with one of these for next Christmas If I have the spare cash. However I can not find a shipping price to the US. If I try to use the Buy now cart feature on their website, it takes me straight to paypal and will not show me the shipping cost. That will bring up the cost another $12, I am sure.

Edited by Otakar
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The improvement of the overall shape is clear to see but the quality of the surface detail could be a problem for me. It's certainly not the same quality of casting we see from Eduard and other similar companies but hopefully the final detail will be a bit more refined to what is seen in the photos.

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21 minutes ago, Muzz said:

The improvement of the overall shape is clear to see but the quality of the surface detail could be a problems for me. It's certainly not the same quality of casting we see from Eduard and other similar companies but hopefully the final detail will be a bit more refined to what is seen in the photos.

Eduard doesn't do correction sets but detail sets. Detail sets can be CAD designed and rapid-prototyped as their dependance to the kit is quite loose. Correction sets are made to improve a particular kit so it's integration work where the master maker has to get his hands dirty.

Edited by Laurent
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1 hour ago, Laurent said:

Eduard doesn't do correction sets but detail sets. Detail sets can be CAD designed and rapid-prototyped as their dependance to the kit is quite loose. Correction sets are made to improve a particular kit so it's integration work where the master maker has to get his hands dirty.

Yes they do. Under different names such as Brasen, Quick Boost and soforth. 

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1 hour ago, Muzz said:

The improvement of the overall shape is clear to see but the quality of the surface detail could be a problem for me. It's certainly not the same quality of casting we see from Eduard and other similar companies but hopefully the final detail will be a bit more refined to what is seen in the photos.

My thoughts exactly,but I think this  is test  -Look at finnished un assembled pieces, they look much sharper. Hope I am right.

 

P

Edited by petarvu
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1 hour ago, Laurent said:

Correction sets are made to improve a particular kit so it's integration work where the master maker has to get his hands dirty.

 

That's not entirely correct.  It depends how much the parts 'interact' with the kit.  That CWS set replaces the entire forward fuselage; it only touches the kit at the fore/aft fuselage join, and the intakes - simple 2D planes.  If I were designing that in CAD, all I need are the cross-section at the back of my replacement, and the width to the intake splitters matches the kit.  As long as I have those three quantities, I no longer need the kit.  If I wanted to keep the kit's windscreen and canopy, it would get a lot more complex, but replacing *everything* is fairly simple.

 

In that sense, it's actually harder to design a cockpit set, or even exhausts or wheel wells, since they tend to interact with the kit parts over a much broader area, with much more complicated geometry.

 

14 minutes ago, Otakar said:

Yes they do. Under different names such as Brasen, Quick Boost and soforth. 

 

Quickboost is AiRes.  Brassin is Eduard's only resin brand.

 

3 minutes ago, petarvu said:

My thoughts exactly,but I think this  is test  -Look at finnished un assembled pieces, they look much sharper. Hope I am right.

 

Well, it's a hand-mastered, resin cast correction.  You don't do test-casts and iterations; they would be a waste of time and money.  That assembled set almost certainly *is* the with finished parts.  The difference in appearance is probably due to size - the assembled pics are about 2x life size (which will make it look worse); the unassembled shot is 1/2 life size (which will make it look better).  Given the quality of his previous releases, I'm sure this set will be fine.  If not, there aren't many panel lines on the nose, and they're mostly simple and straight, so it wouldn't be hard to fill it smooth and re-scribe.

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17 hours ago, Otakar said:

Yes they do. Under different names such as Brasen, Quick Boost and soforth. 

 

Name one Eduard set that corrects a shape error of any kity, any manufacturer. Just one.

 

PS

 

Retooling of I-16 or 109G-6 doesn't count.

 

Vedran

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On 2017-01-29 at 14:30, Otakar said:

WOW, that is a first. Must be doing Mach 1.5 in that picture. Must have been taken in some attempt of record braking. Considering the poor quality of the photo. I than also found this. https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjAqpmXvufRAhWJ3oMKHZqQDRcQjRwIBw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fmoreaubruno%2Fmikoyan-gourevitch-mig-23%2F&psig=AFQjCNEzZjygnMnpnkykelY1Z7l0nH0mXg&ust=1485783621131829 I also noticed the "up elevon" configuration of the tail surfaces. This must be to keep the "nose up" in this sweep configuration.

 

I think there are other reasons that these pictures are rare. One is that most aviation photos (in flight) not are taken in action, but during special photo sessions, often by photographers in slower two-seat aircrafts. Which means that the speed of the photo object also is pretty slow - which in this case means that wings are at 47,5° (half-swept). The other explaination is that the maximum swept configuration was probably seldom used, since it was necessary only at very high speeds. MiG-23 was originally built as an interceptor that should use high speed in combination with missiles. I reality, however, it was more often used in dogfights and at lower speeds. So I think that half-swept was the normal flight mode. Second generation Floggers were also modified to handle dogfights in a better way.

 

This is a picture from the Soviet MiG-23 visit in Sweden in 1981, from an article in the Swedish Air Force News Magazine (Flygvapennytt). The text tells that the Soviets demonstrated the MiG-23 with all three wing configurations, not mentioning anything about problems with wings fully swept. 

 

31764945884_dae064ef66_c.jpg

 

The same goes for the similar-looking Su-24 Fencer. It is just as hart to find a picture of it with wings fully swept as it is with MiG-23/27. And I don't think that the Soviets would miss such an important issue as high speed performance twice.

 

EDIT. After about 3:55 in this film, a MiG-27 is flying with fully swept wings, as far as I can see, without any problems.

 

 

Edited by Bjorn
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9 hours ago, dragonlanceHR said:

 

Name one Eduard set that corrects a shape error of any kity, any manufacturer. Just one.

 

PS

 

Retooling of I-16 or 109G-6 doesn't count.

 

Vedran

 

Hey Vedran,

 

You can add the 109G-6 family to the list, they made the old crap look nicer , but still a POC shapewise !

As for the I-16, I don't know.

 

What I know is that Eduard has one of the best com system. They could sell you a sausage in a Profipack , telling you it's the definitive sausage and most people would buy it ...

 

Madcop

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one, probably stupid question:

 

but how much differ the Trumpeter MiG-23M/ MF kit from the BN taking into account the CWS conversion?

do I have to by the rather expensive BN (with pots of weapons that I will not use and decals that I will replace , etc..)

or can I use the M/ MF boxing alone.... pylons? any differences in the  main fuselage? (I am talking about the model of course, not the real plane differences!)

 

thanks.... 

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Safe the money and take the M/MF kit ! BUT a lot of work will come up. As mentioned before in this thread the BN has a different burner can (wrong in the BN kit !). The nose wheels have a bigger Diameter and different mud gards and different nose gear flaps (all of this also wrong in the BN kit). Then the rear fuselage weapon station (not sure about the BN kit). This is a simple thing to do. I am not quite sure about which version of ventral fins was on export BNs... There are quite some improvement sets around which should be used - a costy enterprise.

 

Here you will find some nice shots from the Gatow Museum which are most helpful:

 

http://www.bredow-web.de/

 

Grüße aus Charlottengrad

 

be

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On 1/30/2017 at 3:00 AM, Otakar said:

That is a great improvement over the original kit. That now only brings the price of the kit to roughly $75 US. I might tree myself with one of these for next Christmas If I have the spare cash. However I can not find a shipping price to the US. If I try to use the Buy now cart feature on their website, it takes me straight to paypal and will not show me the shipping cost. That will bring up the cost another $12, I am sure.

US$5 shipping to New Zealand, Otakar, and that is about as far away as you can ship something in the world :)

Looking forward to getting my set.

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9 hours ago, ABeck said:

Safe the money and take the M/MF kit ! BUT a lot of work will come up. As mentioned before in this thread the BN has a different burner can (wrong in the BN kit !). The nose wheels have a bigger Diameter and different mud gards and different nose gear flaps (all of this also wrong in the BN kit). Then the rear fuselage weapon station (not sure about the BN kit). This is a simple thing to do. I am not quite sure about which version of ventral fins was on export BNs... There are quite some improvement sets around which should be used - a costy enterprise.

 

Here you will find some nice shots from the Gatow Museum which are most helpful:

 

http://www.bredow-web.de/

 

Grüße aus Charlottengrad

 

be

Oh! Thanks! The nozzle of course! How could I forget the obvious???? :banghead:

 

So we NEED an aftermarket nozzle! Urgently! Are they the same BN and -27 at least?

Thanks!

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