Paul Bradley Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 So a project in the near future will be to recreate Sea Fury 1st prototype SR661. This had the shorter vertical tail, short hook and a four-bladed prop, at least at first, which is how I intend to model her. My question is - what colours was she painted in, specifically the undersides? During WWII, British prototypes were often painted with Yellow undersides, and that is how photos of her look. BUT these photos could also be interpreted as MSG or Sky, and I have seen profiles with both. What is the learned opinion of this forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Boak Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 If it is a Sea Fury, as opposed to a Fury, then you can rule out MSG. If it is carrying the P in a circle, then I'd assume Yellow undersides, which was specified for prototypes and can be seen on other types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 from - http://www.strijdbewijs.nl/birds/hawker/seafury.htm from this I'd say yellow. Note the underside is in shadow, but is still a light tone. same here HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 Exactly my thoughts, Troy and Graham - those are two of the photos I've been looking at. These are from the period after she was modified, but I am making the assumption that she wasn't re-painted. Warpaint has MSG, but these photos seem to show that the colour is much lighter than that. The second photo - in particular, the vertical undercarriage doors - shows that it is the same tonal value as the outside ring of the roundel and the circle P, so I'd assume Yellow as well. Thanks, guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 Hi Paul one image that is related, the only colour photo of a WW2 era prototype I can think of, and it's yellow De Havilland Sea Hornet F.20 Prototype during deck landing trails on HMS Ocean in April 1945. from Etienne's photostream https://www.flickr.com/photos/8270787@N07/7381159974/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted December 14, 2014 Author Share Posted December 14, 2014 Nice - makes me want to invest in the Special Hobby kit..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham T Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 According to the Warbird Tech series book on the Sea Fury, SR661 was painted in the temperate fighter scheme which I take to be Ocean Grey/Dark Green. HTH 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr T Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 There was a photo in Aeroplane Monthly a while ago that i am sure was SR661 as a centrespread in full colour. It looked like TSS with yellow undersufaces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted December 14, 2014 Author Share Posted December 14, 2014 Cheers, Martin - can you please tell me what issue it was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingerbob Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I thought I had that photo in my computer, but didn't find it in the time I had looking yesterday- maybe it is just on paper... bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidelvy Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I remember seeing that photo in Aeroplane and also thinking it looked like TSS. I will try to have a look for the issue, if I can find it. It would have been from several years ago. The photo was from Aeroplane's archive, so it may be available elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted December 15, 2014 Author Share Posted December 15, 2014 Thanks, David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingerbob Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Well, here's a link to one version of the photo (think it's the same one, anyway...) bob or... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 cheers bob dang my memory is going as I have seen that pic before on Etienne Du Plessis flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/8270787@N07/8416363320/in/photolist-hyRwB9-dPJ4Aq And it does look like Temperate Sea Scheme upper surfaces. Looks good in this scheme as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted May 30, 2015 Author Share Posted May 30, 2015 Cheers, guys - just about to do a PM kit in these colours. Appreciate your help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erewhon1872 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 cheers bob dang my memory is going as I have seen that pic before on Etienne Du Plessis flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/8270787@N07/8416363320/in/photolist-hyRwB9-dPJ4Aq And it does look like Temperate Sea Scheme upper surfaces. Looks good in this scheme as well. Hi, only just found this thread so a bit late into the discussion I'm afraid. I have a set of decals for SR661 (can't remember off the top of my head who the manufacturer was) but have a couple of questions that I wonder if anyone can help me with? First if I wanted to model, in 1/48th, the early version of this airframe how would I model the shorter tail, different bladed prop and shorter arrestor hook? I assume the last is easy, just cut a section out of a long hook, but the other two have got me stumped. At first I thought the tail was from a Tempest but looking at the two it doesn't seem to be? Is the four bladed prop from a late mark Tempest though? If after the airframe was modified the only difference from an early production Sea Fury was the shorter arrestor hook maybe I am making work for myself that's not necessary? Second is there anywhere I can get information on paint equivalents for the 'Temperate Sea Scheme upper surfaces' and the Prototype yellow under surfaces? Any help would be much appreciated, Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr T Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 (edited) The shorter tail is very similar in shape to the later Sea Furies and would be easy to reshape. Tony Buttlers book the Sea Fury published by Dalrymple and Verdun has a lot of useful photos. The four bladed prop seems to be the same as that on the Tempest II and so is different from that on Sabre engined Tempests. SR661 did not have folding wings. Temperate Sea Scheme consists of Extra Dark Sea Grey and Dark Slate Grey (which is actually a green grey colour). The underside yellow is the same as the yellow used for training aircraft. Some examples of the model colours available are Extra Dark Sea Grey Xtracolour X005 Humbrol 123 Dark Slate Grey Xtracolour X025 Humbrol 224 Trainer Yellow Xtracolour X011 Humbrol 24 Other paint matches can be found at http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts/colorcharts.asp Edited July 8, 2015 by Martin T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Hi, only just found this thread so a bit late into the discussion I'm afraid. I have a set of decals for SR661 (can't remember off the top of my head who the manufacturer was) but have a couple of questions that I wonder if anyone can help me with? First if I wanted to model, in 1/48th, the early version of this airframe how would I model the shorter tail, different bladed prop and shorter arrestor hook? I assume the last is easy, just cut a section out of a long hook, but the other two have got me stumped. At first I thought the tail was from a Tempest but looking at the two it doesn't seem to be? Is the four bladed prop from a late mark Tempest though? If after the airframe was modified the only difference from an early production Sea Fury was the shorter arrestor hook maybe I am making work for myself that's not necessary? Second is there anywhere I can get information on paint equivalents for the 'Temperate Sea Scheme upper surfaces' and the Prototype yellow under surfaces? Any help would be much appreciated, Pete Well Pete Martin has saved me typing, as that's what I was about to reply! Xtracolor also do the same colors in Acrylic, as Xtracrylix. Getting a Tempest II spinner might be tricky, as at the moment there are only conversions, though it can't be that hard to convert a 5 blade to 4 blade. The Eduard Tempest comes with two types of prop blade as well. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted July 8, 2015 Author Share Posted July 8, 2015 Just finished this last week. It's the PM kit, so not the best model you'll ever see! It was a for a GB over at UAMF, and due to other commitments, I had to blitz it.... Lacking definitive info, I used plans to shorten the tail by 5mm, then reshape it. The hook is a shortened version of the kit item. I filled the wingfold lines. The prop and spinner are from the Matchbox Tempest kit, with the blades suitably shortened. Paint is all Xtracrylix - a mix of EDSG and DSG, with Dark Slate Grey, over Yellow. Decals from my spares box. It really needs a panel line wash... A bit of a rush job; nevertheless, SR661 is a project worth pursuing, as the look is so different from the standard Sea Fury. I might have to acquire another Hobbycraft 1/48 and do the same conversion in that scale, but detail the heck out of it this time. Anyways, to the pictures: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erewhon1872 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 The shorter tail is very similar in shape to the later Sea Furies and would be easy to reshape. Tony Buttlers book the Sea Fury published by Dalrymple and Verdun has a lot of useful photos. The four bladed prop seems to be the same as that on the Tempest II and so is different from that on Sabre engined Tempests. SR661 did not have folding wings. Temperate Sea Scheme consists of Extra Dark Sea Grey and Dark Slate Grey (which is actually a green grey colour). The underside yellow is the same as the yellow used for training aircraft. Some examples of the model colours available are Extra Dark Sea Grey Xtracolour X005 Humbrol 123 Dark Slate Grey Xtracolour X025 Humbrol 224 Trainer Yellow Xtracolour X011 Humbrol 24 Other paint matches can be found at http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts/colorcharts.asp Hi Martin, I'm sorry for the late reply, the management at work wanted me to get on with some work rather than reading the Britmodeller forums, surely that's a contravention of my rights as a human? Thanks for all the information and especially the colour callouts, am going to the Moorlands model show tomorrow with those Xtracolor numbers written on a piece of paper! The decal sheet I could not remember was War Eagle WE4D021. It's curious as it only gives you the SR661 serials, and nothing else! I have had to source roundels, finflashes and Prototype P's from other sheets. It (the decal sheet) does give a very nice 1/48 scale side view of SR661, trouble is comparing it to the Hobbycraft fuselage the tail fin is the same height and shape as the kit one. Are there any plans that you know of that show the shape of the smaller tail or am I going to have to reshape it and compare to old photos? Again thanks for the information, much appreciated. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erewhon1872 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Well Pete Martin has saved me typing, as that's what I was about to reply! Xtracolor also do the same colors in Acrylic, as Xtracrylix. Getting a Tempest II spinner might be tricky, as at the moment there are only conversions, though it can't be that hard to convert a 5 blade to 4 blade. The Eduard Tempest comes with two types of prop blade as well. HTH thanks for the reply Troy, You mention there are conversions I assume from later mark Tempests to the Tempest II? Do you know who makes those and if the scale is 1/48th Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erewhon1872 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Just finished this last week. It's the PM kit, so not the best model you'll ever see! It was a for a GB over at UAMF, and due to other commitments, I had to blitz it.... Lacking definitive info, I used plans to shorten the tail by 5mm, then reshape it. The hook is a shortened version of the kit item. I filled the wingfold lines. The prop and spinner are from the Matchbox Tempest kit, with the blades suitably shortened. Paint is all Xtracrylix - a mix of EDSG and DSG, with Dark Slate Grey, over Yellow. Decals from my spares box. It really needs a panel line wash... A bit of a rush job; nevertheless, SR661 is a project worth pursuing, as the look is so different from the standard Sea Fury. I might have to acquire another Hobbycraft 1/48 and do the same conversion in that scale, but detail the heck out of it this time. Anyways, to the pictures: lovely work Paul, the prototypes certainly did look different from the later Navilised versions. You mentioned a plan that gave you the shape of the tail? Is that something that's available somewhere and could it be scaled up to 1/48th? Again a lovely model, hope mine works out half as well. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Smith Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 thanks for the reply Troy, You mention there are conversions I assume from later mark Tempests to the Tempest II? Do you know who makes those and if the scale is 1/48th Pete Confusingly the Tempest V came first.... anyway, the conversions are 1/48th, (Matchbox did a 1/72nd Tempest II/VI kit back in the mid 70's) were done by Airwaves and MDC. Not sure how available they are at the moment, but they were both a fair chunk of change each. I'd honestly look at modifying the kit spinner as a first option. One possible source maybe the 4 blade spinner from the old Airfix Spitfire Vc/Seafire III kit, the spinner is too wide at the base as the kit nose is wrong, which may make it usable for this. I can check when I can be bothered to have a hunt in the loft.... I don't know if there are accurate plans for the tail, this maybe a case of eyeballing the modifications, Paul said he shortened the tail fin by 5mm, which would be 7.5mm in 1/48th. HTH T * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Bradley Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) Thanks, Pete. I don't recall where the plans came from - I made a photocopy some years ago and I have no idea where they came from...sorry! They may (I stress may) have come from an old Scale Models mag. BTW, I am planning on tackling this conversion in 1/48 shortly. Edited July 12, 2015 by Paul Bradley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erewhon1872 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Confusingly the Tempest V came first.... anyway, the conversions are 1/48th, (Matchbox did a 1/72nd Tempest II/VI kit back in the mid 70's) were done by Airwaves and MDC. Not sure how available they are at the moment, but they were both a fair chunk of change each. I'd honestly look at modifying the kit spinner as a first option. One possible source maybe the 4 blade spinner from the old Airfix Spitfire Vc/Seafire III kit, the spinner is too wide at the base as the kit nose is wrong, which may make it usable for this. I can check when I can be bothered to have a hunt in the loft.... I don't know if there are accurate plans for the tail, this maybe a case of eyeballing the modifications, Paul said he shortened the tail fin by 5mm, which would be 7.5mm in 1/48th. HTH T * thanks for the offer of having a look in the loft for me, assume the Vc/Seafire prop/blades are a close-ish match the one used on the prototype Fury? Have to study the photos that are available and as you say use some good old fashion guess-imating? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now