Scratch Build of 1951 Pullman Carriage

[hendie]

I thought I should provide some sliver of evidence that I am still alive and kicking, and preferably in the way of imagery of some sort.   Once again life has got in the way of modeling and most of my modeling over the last few weeks has been done by proxy i.e. you lot.  With me offering inane criticisms here and there.

For the first time in what has seemed like months I actually got some time to go delving in the basement so I dived in head first.   Only to discover that once I had checked my references, I had the doors slightly wrong.  Well, slightly wrong is as good as very wrong, so I scrapped what had gone before and started again - this time paying a tad more attention to what I was trying to do.

 

In my last outing and attempt at the vestibule doors,  I realized that the doors were just a bit short.  That in itself wasn't a deal breaker as there were ways to cover that up, but what I did discover when I looked more closely at my references was that the doors themselves were inset slightly and there was a 'frame' in front of them - I had completely missed that and it made a difference to the overall appearance.

However, taking a step back, last time around I showed some doors and had a nice little beading around the oval.  I showed the creation of the beading but didn't show how I got a nice even finish around the bead.  I gave a rather brief and unhelpful description but here's a photo that shows the process much better...  With the beading firmly glued in place in a door, I used a scrap door and simply enlarged the oval to a point where it fitted over the beading. The scrap door just happened to be the correct thickness for the amount I wanted the bead to protrude from the door itself.  Then it was a case of using a sanding stick to remove unwanted material, leaving a nice even bead all around the oval.

 

 

Next, I re-cut all the doors, or more accurately, rescribed the doors with the cutter.  This time I overlaid the frame, the door and a few other guidelines, none of which will be visible in the finished part (he hopes).  A separate frame was cut to fit over the 'door' part on the right.

You can see two 'doors' on the part on the right (with the arched tops).  The outer 'door' is the actual door and the inner arched shape is the frame overlap - I am using those lines to align the frame on the left.

 

 

They were carefully assembled and offered up to the structure.  That looks much better.

The crossbar over the oval window is a dry fit to check for scale.  According to my drawings, the chrome work works out at Ø0.5 mm, which this wire is, but it looks a little on the thin side compared to my references.  I may go up to Ø0.6 mm but we'll see about that later.

 

 

Next step was to add a rain diverter/weatherbar to the bottom of the door and a quick coat of primer to see how the details look. (everything just dry fitted of course)

 

 

I think I have a working design now.  Now I just need to repeat the process three more times.

The two vertical grab handles fitted either side of the door are going to be challenging and I think I will need to attack those before I fit the doors in place because if I stuff those handles up, I could end up having to remake the doors again.  That strip to the left of the door is a tad under 2mm wide and that's where the grab handle gets fitted as can be seen on this photo (photo copyright credit to Terry Bye)

 

 

 

Fun and games ahead....

 

 

 

[TheBaron]

Those last two photos show just how closely the first is getting to look like the second now hendie.

 

 

[hendie]

25 minutes ago, TheBaron said:

Those last two photos show just how closely the first is getting to look like the second now hendie.

 

 

 

Thanks Tony, still a long way to go though

Edited November 4, 2018 by hendie

[CedB]

Blooming marvellous Hendie, lovely stuff  

[perdu]

Tremendous stuff, I love the door details it's proper, proper job as they say

 

I'd be tempted to stick with that fine wire for the handle, an oversize will show up more than an under size methinks. 😉

[Pete in Lincs]

21 hours ago, hendie said:

The two vertical grab handles fitted either side of the door are going to be challenging

You could outsource those to @TheBaron

 

Nice door and frame.

My modelling goes in fits and starts depending on available time too. You are not alone.

Frustrating, isn't it?

[Brandy]

I do like that door! 

It looks to me as though the side pieces with the handrails on extend down below the door bottom, to about half way down the chassis rail. Or am I seeing things?

 

Ian

[hendie]

21 hours ago, limeypilot said:

It looks to me as though the side pieces with the handrails on extend down below the door bottom, to about half way down the chassis rail. Or am I seeing things?

 

You're not seeing things Ian.   I might splice some pieces in place to prevent having to cut the whole lot again.  On one door there's also a cast iron plaque stating the year and place of build.

 

There are some subtle (as I am now finding out) differences between the drawings and the final build - down to the numptie shopfitters not being able to read an engineering drawing properly

Edited November 7, 2018 by hendie

[heloman1]

Alan, superb work on the door, perfect...

 

Colin

[Redshift]

Can't believe its taken me this long to find this build. This is staggering stuff, proper micro-engineering.

[hendie]

thanks folks, work on the doors is continuing...  I cut 4 new ones

[hendie]

On 11/9/2018 at 12:15 PM, hendie said:

I cut 4 new ones

 

... along with frames.  I've lost count of the number of frames, ovals, and doors I've cut out over the last few weeks. - at least I have plenty spares for testing ideas on...

 

 

talking of which.  Lets take a look again at the photo I posted last time around (copyright Terry Bye) - Note the chrome grab handles on either side of the door, the two vertical ones.  They are very distinctive and catch the eye as there's not a lot of other distraction on the car. (aside from the natural beauty of the car itself that is)

 

 

While making the doors and frames it dawned on me that I really need to get those chromed handrails done fairly soon.  Thinking about the build sequence, I want to mount the handrails on the frames before I mount the doors and frames to the carriage to avoid any chance of collateral damage.  That means the vestibule ends and doors have got to be finished, painted, clear coated, windows fitted and decals before they get fitted (I think).

I had mulled over how I was going to attack those handrails for a few days and had an idea or two.  When it came time to try those ideas out, most of it involved cutting bits of brass rod, getting it wrong and throwing the scrap away.  It took a while before I had a eureka moment.

The biggest problem was that there are a total of eight handrails, all identical, and all having that distinctive curve and mounting flange at the end (I'm sure there's a term for that).  Therefore I needed to make eight identical copies - with all the bends, curves and angles matching.  Generally when I have a task like this I will tape the rods together.  That works fine for two or three parts, but not for eight.  I messed around for a while with clamps, solder, and other less than award winning ideas before it struck me - how do I get all the bends in the same location on each piece of rod ? 

Simple - make a small jig.  I found a small off-cut of aluminum bar and drilled a 0.9 mm hole x 3 mm deep on one face.  

This way, the brass rod can only go so far into the jig so when the rod is bent, the bend will always be at the same location relative to the end of the rod.  

 

 

While the idea itself is simple, it still took me a good few attempts to get the overall dimensions I was looking for.

The 'hole in a bar' fixture solved the problem of the location of the bend but it also meant that every piece of rod had to be cut and filed to exactly the same length, in this instance 28 mm. 

I should mention that on checking my references I found I had no detailed drawings of these particular handrails,  only a very generic sketch which was of no real use. However, I figured a one inch diameter would be good size for a handrail and that works out at 0.8 mm in diameter at this scale.  Overall lengths were gauged from photos by eye.

 

 

Getting the bend in the right place was critical, but only one part of the equation - all the angles had to be the same too or this wasn't going to work. Constant test fitting against the protractor was essential in allowing me to sneak up on the correct angle. (it's a lot easier to add more bend to a rod than it is to remove some bend!)

 

 

Eventually I ended up with enough handrails plus a couple of spares cos I know I'm going to mess up at least once in this journey.

 

 

A quick visual check tells me that the length is about right, or as close as I am going to get it.  In the 1:1 photo above you can see that the top of the handrail is mounted at the mid point of the oval window, and the bottom of the handrail is mounted about the midpoint of the bottom of the oval window and the bottom of the door.

 

 

So far so good, but there's still a long way to go with the handrails.  Somehow I have to incorporate that distinctive flange mounting. 

My first attempt to replicate this involved soldering a small section of brass sheet to the end of the rod.  A scrap rod in this case. No use wasting a good one (just in case)

 

 

Then using an assortment of files and anglo saxon phrases I removed everything that didn't look like the pointy flange.  A quick squirt of Alclad Chrome to add some pretty to the rail and then placed against a test strip for a quick visual assessment

 

 

Perhaps seen to better effect in this view

 

 

It's by no means perfect, but I am not sure I can achieve any better at this scale.  It's going to be a tedious job making all eight of these handrails but has to be done.  

One other issue I must overcome is how to securely fix these to Pegasus.  I don't like superglue and it's really not suitable for a job like this. - Far too easily knocked off, and will probably damage the paint in the process.  The handrails need to be pinned in place as well as glued... but how to fix a pin to something this size?

 

I think I have a plan (!) so will try that out tomorrow. Stay tuned.

 

 

Edited November 11, 2018 by hendie

[Pete in Lincs]

Flangetastic, Batman!

Of course, it would be far too easy to make the handrails longer to go through the flange into the door frames.

6 hours ago, hendie said:

anglo saxon phrases

If you had a swearbox you could probably afford to buy more brass rod by Christmas. 😁

[Bigdave22014]

Why not etch some pointy bits?

[hendie]

6 hours ago, Pete in Lincs said:

Of course, it would be far too easy to make the handrails longer to go through the flange into the door frames.

 

I did consider that Pete,  but it was difficult enough getting the bends and angles consistent on the rods when there was only one at each end.  Adding another segment on each end would have made it almost impossible to produce accurate enough replicates.  The method I have in mind also allows me to use a smaller diameter pin so I will have a little bit of leeway when it comes to fitting (as my hole drilling is never that accurate)

 

6 hours ago, Bigdave22014 said:

Why not etch some pointy bits?

 

Again, considered, but I reasoned that it was easier to solder a big chunk of brass in place then remove material I didn't want, rather than try and align, then hold a small piece of brass securely (that I could hardly see in the first instance) while I soldered in my usual clumsy hamfisted method

 

[hendie]

sorta like this....

 

Take a piece of scrap timber, drill two holes. Cut some brass sheet into small squares, drill a hole in each.  Insert 'pin' into brass sheet and locate in holes in timber, then line up the handrail and secure in place for soldering

 

 

Repeat multiple times.  Okay, it's not pretty but it doesn't need to be at this stage - just functional.

 

 

Take a small vise and secure handrail - take one file and remove anything non handrail shaped.

 

 

We then end up with a handrail with a pin at each end.

 

 

Which will now sit nicely, and more importantly, securely on the framework.

 

 

Now I have plenty of filing time ahead of me... as well as yet more chromework for the doors.

 

 

[Bandsaw Steve]

Clever! 🤔

[CedB]

Masterful - great work Hendie  

[harveyb258]

You are doing some lovely, meticulous scratch-work there, Hendie. 

Great job, sir!

 

Cheers, H

[Paul821]

Despite this thread having been in existence nearly as long as the First World War, I only came across it today. The quality and detail of the build is outstanding. I have booked a ticket to follow it. 

[Pete in Lincs]

That's the way to do it!

(Okay, it's the wrong punch. so sue me)

[hendie]

3 hours ago, Paul821 said:

Despite this thread having been in existence nearly as long as the First World War

 

 

 

 

I'm now thinking after looking at that last photo that the handrails are about a millimeter or two too long.... Hhhmnnnnn... bugger

 

[perdu]

So?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You could almost seamlessly cut out a Millimoter and lose it at the top of it

 

or the bottom, there is a cut at the flange top and bottomley

[spaddad]

Orsum stuff Hendie, the most amazing thing about this build is that, as well as the outstanding craftsmanship, you still appear to be relatively sane, an amazing feat. Can't wait to see it on the scratch built rails along with the rest of the rake & the motive power,it's going to be even orsummer.

[bentwaters81tfw]

Time this was re-railed. Any updates?