Two 1/48 Mk.Vb Spitfires - Tamiya and Airfix (new) - Spitfire collection expansion project - FINISHED! - photos now in the RFI section - 08/06/15

[PlaStix]

Hi Giemme. Thank you for stopping by. I'm looking forward to Saturday when, hopefully, I can get some more done on this.

Kind regards,

Stix

[Jim Kiker]

Hi Stix,

sorry to have lost track of this for a bit. As I mentioned earlier on, I posted a buid diary a while back that shows the things I did to a Tamiya Spitfire Mk I to accurize it and turn it into a Spitfire PR I. I think you will figure out which, if any of the updates I did to the base kit would be something you want to include in your build. Here is the link:

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/48265-148-spitfire-pr-i-build-diary/

HTH, Jim

[PlaStix]

Hi Jim,

Well what a stunning build that was - fantastically skilled work! Thank you for sharing the link and I have got your thread bookmarked. I shall have to see what I feel comfortable doing - I'm certain I haven't got the skills to do half of what you have but I can see a couple of things I can achieve. Thank you.

Hopefully I'll get some more time on this over the weekend.

Kind regards,

Stix

[Troy Smith]

Hi Jim,

Well what a stunning build that was - fantastically skilled work! Thank you for sharing the link and I have got your thread bookmarked. I shall have to see what I feel comfortable doing - I'm certain I haven't got the skills to do half of what you have but I can see a couple of things I can achieve. Thank you.

Hopefully I'll get some more time on this over the weekend.

Kind regards,

Stix

Stix

Now IF the new Airfix VB is as good as it is supposed to be, based on new work by Artur Bentley, a very respected draughtsman, translated into CAD by the new Airfix team, and from the reputable plans [Cooke, Cox, Clint] I have it does seems this way, then the Tamiya is better than is sometimes described.

some lengthy anorak postings here

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/234968126-148-airfix-seafire-xv/page-3

but here is the New Airfix VB taped to a Tamiya I, AFAIK the Tamiya VB is the same shape as the Tamiya I.

looks to be a touch short in the instrument panel area, and the wings are too far back, but the big surprise was how well the Tamiya and Airfix rear fuselages match up. Try it yourself.

I have a suggested fix for the wing position in the linked thread, well for the Special Hobby kit, but the Tamiya looks to have the same problem, and the SH kits has a lot similarities with the Tamiya. , I should really do some actual plastic cutting to check though, but no bench set up

hope of interest.

[PlaStix]

Hi Troy.

Thank you very much for the link and the information. You and others on here always amaze me with your depth of knowledge, your modelling skills and ability to correct and make more accurate these different kits - absolutely brilliant! I'm a novice when it comes to this kind of thing - I'm not sure what I will attempt yet to improve mine but I have bookmarked several similar articles and saved copies of your photos - hope this is okay? Thank you.

With regards my efforts - last week I started painting some of the cockpit parts and I spent a fair bit of time doing more basic painting this morning.

Tamiya Vb

The rather lovely detail on the panel unfortunately has to be removed:

........so it can be replaced by the Eduard parts seen here:

You can also see in the above that I've painted the headrest armour plate.

Here it is with the detail removed and filed down:

And some cables added using fuse wire and painted with Revell's Antracite:

I still need to add some cable ties.

I also painted the area that will be below the cockpit:

Airfix Vb:

All of these areas will need washes and drybrushing before I start adding more detail.

Comments and suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Stix

Edited October 11, 2014 by PlaStix

[Biggles87]

The Airfix Spitfire cockpits are getting better with each new issue. We now have the proper curved sidewalls rather than the detail going into the wing fillet, you could say that it's not very noticeable in this scale but If you have the entry flap open it certainly makes a difference to what you can see on the starboard sidewall, I'm all for not having to buy extra resin sets or (God forbid) scratch building in any scale smaller than 1/32.

The Tamiya Spitfires are beautiful kits, I've built several but it's always nice to see Airfix up there with them.

Cheers

John

[wimbledon99]

Not sure where you find time for all your builds but they are a pleasure to watch

[Troy Smith]

Hi Troy.

Thank you very much for the link and the information. You and others on here always amaze me with your depth of knowledge, your modelling skills and ability to correct and make more accurate these different kits - absolutely brilliant! I'm a novice when it comes to this kind of thing - I'm not sure what I will attempt yet to improve mine but I have bookmarked several similar articles and saved copies of your photos - hope this is okay? Thank you.

With regards my efforts - last week I started painting some of the cockpit parts and I spent a fair bit of time doing more basic painting this morning.

All of these areas will need washes and drybrushing before I start adding more detail.

Comments and suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Stix

Hi Stix

first, if you have not seen it, you may find this of use

http://spitfiresite.com/2010/07/anatomy-of-spitfire-cockpit.html

The aircraft serving as our subject is Supermarine Spitfire Mk. Vb BL628 YO-D, recently completed by Avspecs Ltd in Auckland, New Zealand. Due to the fantastic quality of the restoration work which took full 30 years, the cockpit of this Spitfire conforms almost entirely to wartime production standards. For this reason, the following photographs can serve as reliable reference to the cockpit layout of the production Spitfire Mk. V.

one detail you may want to change on your build, the aluminium paint starts behind the seat bulkhead, not at the end of the rear of the canopy as you have it.

also just visible here http://data3.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444/images/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444_26_of_37.jpg

the Science Museum Spitfire, a Mk I but most is similar to a VB, and as it's hanging up, lots of underside detail not usually seen

full walkround here

http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444/index.php?Page=2

some more useful detail shots of an unrestored Mk I in Chicago here, still in Training Command colours, but BoB survivor.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/59537-the-definitive-spitfire-mk1-thread/#entry641776

I've not been doing much actual modelling, just comparisons.

When you get to clip the major bits from the sprues, try dry fitting a Tamiya and Airfix fuselage together, as shown above tails aligned, and then nose aligned, and you will see the shortness is at the point the wing root kinks in. This is where I'd add just under 2mm extension.

Now try dry fitting the Tamiya fuselage to the airfix lower wing, if you the and you will see how the Airfix wing is further forward. Then compare an Tamiya and Airfix wing , and you will see the slight difference in shape.

You may wish to tape the main parts of the Airfix and Tamiya togther, and see how much difference you see, and if it's worth worrying about. The above comparisons would give you an idea of what needs adjusting on the Tamiya kit.

I'm going to do some more comparison pics when I get chance, and maybe the basic fixes suggested, to see how well they work, or not!

Jim Kiker's excellent build, while making the Tamiya the right length, I think adds it in the wrong place.

HTH

T

[Winenut]

Looking like a very good start Stix.

I'm on board.

Chocks away!

[PlaStix]

The Airfix Spitfire cockpits are getting better with each new issue. We now have the proper curved sidewalls rather than the detail going into the wing fillet, you could say that it's not very noticeable in this scale but If you have the entry flap open it certainly makes a difference to what you can see on the starboard sidewall, I'm all for not having to buy extra resin sets or (God forbid) scratch building in any scale smaller than 1/32.

The Tamiya Spitfires are beautiful kits, I've built several but it's always nice to see Airfix up there with them.

Cheers

John

Hi John,

Yes I can see what you mean about the detail on the Airfix kits. I was impressed by what they got into the 1/72 versions and this new one is certainly well detailed. The Tamiya one is simpler but also good. I'm hoping to try and do as much as I can to get the cockpits to look reasonably like the originals - the cockpits, since I started making Spitfires at the start of this year, have been one of my favourite areas to work on.

Hi Stix

first, if you have not seen it, you may find this of use

http://spitfiresite.com/2010/07/anatomy-of-spitfire-cockpit.html

one detail you may want to change on your build, the aluminium paint starts behind the seat bulkhead, not at the end of the rear of the canopy as you have it.

also just visible here http://data3.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444/images/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444_26_of_37.jpg

the Science Museum Spitfire, a Mk I but most is similar to a VB, and as it's hanging up, lots of underside detail not usually seen

full walkround here

http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/mark_hayward/supermarine_spitfire_mk1a_p9444/index.php?Page=2

some more useful detail shots of an unrestored Mk I in Chicago here, still in Training Command colours, but BoB survivor.

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/59537-the-definitive-spitfire-mk1-thread/#entry641776

I've not been doing much actual modelling, just comparisons.

When you get to clip the major bits from the sprues, try dry fitting a Tamiya and Airfix fuselage together, as shown above tails aligned, and then nose aligned, and you will see the shortness is at the point the wing root kinks in. This is where I'd add just under 2mm extension.

Now try dry fitting the Tamiya fuselage to the airfix lower wing, if you the and you will see how the Airfix wing is further forward. Then compare an Tamiya and Airfix wing , and you will see the slight difference in shape.

You may wish to tape the main parts of the Airfix and Tamiya togther, and see how much difference you see, and if it's worth worrying about. The above comparisons would give you an idea of what needs adjusting on the Tamiya kit.

I'm going to do some more comparison pics when I get chance, and maybe the basic fixes suggested, to see how well they work, or not!

Jim Kiker's excellent build, while making the Tamiya the right length, I think adds it in the wrong place.

HTH

T

Hi Troy. What can I say but a big thank you for all the detailed information. I almost spent more time studying the photos this morning than I did modelling!! When I get to a point where I remove the parts from the sprues I will certainly try some proper comparisons.

As you will see from some of the photos below I have already put your first suggestion into practice and extended the aluminium paint up to the back of the seat bulkhead.

Looking like a very good start Stix.

I'm on board.

Chocks away!

Hi Winenut - always happy to have you along!

As I mentioned above - I spent a fair amount of time going through the photos Troy kindly shared links to, but I eventually got round to doing some work on the two kits.

First off I followed Troys advice and extended the areas of aluminium paint to the rear of the seat bulkhead:

Tamiya:

Airfix:

I also repainted the rear bulkhead parts with Revell's aluminium:

Tamiya:

Airfix:

Next up, having seen how evident it is in the photo from Troy's post, I added the tubing to the top of the bottles from the Tamiya kit using fuse wire (this is already on the Airfix version on the left). Not perfect but better than none at all:

Next up I cut out the seat harness slot in the Airfix headrest armour - I made it slightly deeper than it should be as I intend to make the seat belts from masking tape for this version:

Then I did some work on the seats including adding some slots:

And then got some base coat paint on them:

Finally, while the seats were drying, I did some work in the cables on the instrument panel bulkheads:

Airfix:

Tamiya:

Comments and suggestions welcome.

Kind regards,

Stix

Edited October 12, 2014 by PlaStix

[Biggles87]

I know what you mean about putting detail in the cockpits, I probably spend as much time on that area as the rest of the kit. Watching your builds prompted me to dig out my Airfix Spitfire Mk1 and rummage through my paint store to see of I have anything that will pass for 'apple green' for the cockpit.

[Troy Smith]

Hi Stix

pleasure to help.

One point about the Airfix kit, seems this spinner, of the two supplied

is wrong for the DeHavilland unit it is supposed to be. The other, the Rotol one is fine. a DH unit can be got from the Airfix hurricane if you have one of those.

cheers

T

[giemme]

Good progress here, Stix.

And I agree 100% on the comment you made about Troy and people like him; luckily, a lot of knowledgeable people here on BM, and willing to help.

Ciao

[AdrianMF]

Not my scale, but it's a fascinating thread. Maybe one tiny little 1/48 Spitfire in the stash wouldn't hurt...

Regards,

Adrian

[gingerbob]

Dangerous words, Adrian- but go ahead... everyone else is doing it!

bob

[Wolwe82]

Hey Stix, nice work so far as i m waiting for some scratchbuild material for my spitfire, i found out this page, showing amazingly restored Spitfire Vb with great detail shots. So it might be handy for you http://spitfiresite.com/2010/07/anatomy-of-spitfire-cockpit.html

[PlaStix]

I know what you mean about putting detail in the cockpits, I probably spend as much time on that area as the rest of the kit. Watching your builds prompted me to dig out my Airfix Spitfire Mk1 and rummage through my paint store to see of I have anything that will pass for 'apple green' for the cockpit.

I do hope you are going to do a WIP for the Spitfire - I will be on the front row!

Hi Stix

pleasure to help.

One point about the Airfix kit, seems this spinner, of the two supplied

is wrong for the DeHavilland unit it is supposed to be. The other, the Rotol one is fine. a DH unit can be got from the Airfix hurricane if you have one of those.

cheers

T

Thank you again Troy - good advice. Unfortunately I don't have a Hurricane kit as well but I'll sort something out before I reach that stage.

Good progress here, Stix.

And I agree 100% on the comment you made about Troy and people like him; luckily, a lot of knowledgeable people here on BM, and willing to help.

Ciao

Thank you giemme. Yeah we are very fortunate here on BM - there are people with a wealth of knowledge who, luckily, don't mind sharing it - and I for one am very grateful as it's helped me improve my builds no end - A Big Thank You to them all!

Not my scale, but it's a fascinating thread. Maybe one tiny little 1/48 Spitfire in the stash wouldn't hurt...

Regards,

Adrian

Hi Adrian - As Bob said - yes go for it! When I started planning to build the Eduard Spitfire and began by practicing with 1/72 kits I wasn't sure I was going to enjoy doing the larger scale as much - but I am!! 1/48 allows just a little bit extra space to do some detailing. I look forward to seeing one in progress from you at some point.

Hey Stix, nice work so far as i m waiting for some scratchbuild material for my spitfire, i found out this page, showing amazingly restored Spitfire Vb with great detail shots. So it might be handy for you http://spitfiresite.com/2010/07/anatomy-of-spitfire-cockpit.html

Thank you Wolwe. Don't take too long before starting yours - I'm hoping to pick up some build tips from you that I can use for these two! Can I ask what scratch-building material are you waiting for? And thank you for the link - yes I have seen it - Troy very kindly shared the link with me - and then I spent far too much time looking over the images at the expense of modelling time! It's a great set of photos that will really help when I get stuck into detailing both cockpits.

Now I have the problem of still waiting three days until the weekend! Hey ho..........

Kind regards,

Stix

[stevej60]

Hi Stix, love that AM cockpit set something I have never tried,although I,m impressed with Airfix,s molded detail,and you won,t be surprised to

know I have a spare DH spinner if you need it.

[Biggles87]

Yes, I will do a build thread when I start my Airfix Mk1 but don't hold your breath, I've resolved to finish a few before I start any more, and I build extremely slowly.

Looking forward to the cockpits

Regards

John

[Wolwe82]

well i would like to go on the spitfire as soon as possible, but i do not have that much time lately I m waiting for various wires (ordered some brass and copper wires in various thickness, some coloured, some left in the natural finish, so these will be handy for the wiring in the spitfire cockpit - i wont have to paint these, just matt coat to dull down the shine a bit). I got the brass-in cockpit, but decided to build first Ed´s spit without it, to get some experiences with the kit first

I ll be watching your V´s WIP

[mixup_1]

This is gonna be interesting....so far so good

[theanorak73]

i fully respect and admire anyone who likes to detail the cockpits, but just to give a different point of view... fortunately/unfortunately my head just doesn't work that way. if i cant see it then it's not important. i can just about bring myself to put a bit of colour here and there.

great topic. i also like to build two at a time and im also a Spitfire nut. great to see the two kits being compared like this.

[PlaStix]

Hi Stix, love that AM cockpit set something I have never tried,although I,m impressed with Airfix,s molded detail,and you won,t be surprised to

know I have a spare DH spinner if you need it.

Hi Steve. Yes it does seem like a good AM set and I got it cheap (£3.99 plus £2.50 postage) off Amazon. At the moment I'm kind of torn between getting another for the seat-belts and some other bits for the Airfix version, whereas my original plan was to do the latter without any bought extras. I will see........

With regards the spinner - thank you very much for the kind offer. I think I may be alright at the moment as I'm thinking of going down the none tropical route and I think version B, according to the instructions, uses the other spinner. I'm happy to be corrected.

Yes, I will do a build thread when I start my Airfix Mk1 but don't hold your breath, I've resolved to finish a few before I start any more, and I build extremely slowly.

Looking forward to the cockpits

Regards

John

Hi John. I shall look out for your WIP for the Mk.I at some future date!

well i would like to go on the spitfire as soon as possible, but i do not have that much time lately I m waiting for various wires (ordered some brass and copper wires in various thickness, some coloured, some left in the natural finish, so these will be handy for the wiring in the spitfire cockpit - i wont have to paint these, just matt coat to dull down the shine a bit). I got the brass-in cockpit, but decided to build first Ed´s spit without it, to get some experiences with the kit first

I ll be watching your V´s WIP

Hi Wolwe. Can I please ask what thickness and type of wires you order? That sounds like a really excellent idea - especially with regards not having to paint some. I currently use mostly fuse wire.

This is gonna be interesting....so far so good

Thank you mixup_1

i fully respect and admire anyone who likes to detail the cockpits, but just to give a different point of view... fortunately/unfortunately my head just doesn't work that way. if i cant see it then it's not important. i can just about bring myself to put a bit of colour here and there.

great topic. i also like to build two at a time and im also a Spitfire nut. great to see the two kits being compared like this.

Hi theanorak73. Yes I quite understand and kind of agree with your point about cockpits - it is often difficult to see what's been done - but I just enjoy the process and I'll know it's all there in the long run!

Still two and a half days until the weekend!

Kind regards,

Stix

[Jim Kiker]

For Troy and all,

That was an interesting picture of the Tamiya and Airfix fuselages which you posted a bit back. My information on the Tamiya fixes came from information provided by several Spitfire boffins which included measurements of specfic segments and overall dimensions of the Spitfire, then converted and compared to measurement of the kits available at that time.

I noticed in your photograph that you lined up the rear end of the cockpits to make the picture, obviously leaving the length mismatch at the nose. Was there a particular reason for that? Based on the information I have, the Tamiya nose section is pretty close to correct back to the firewall. Assuming that is correct, I would have started that comparison by matching the noses.

Since I built the last Tamiya Spit, there seems to be further information that the wing or cockpit was located incorrectly; do you know anything along that line?

Thanks, Jim

[Wolwe82]

Stix at first, congratz to the D-Day group results

As for the wires, i m usualy using leaden wires, you can buy it in any fishing hobby shop i guess (well, you can buy it even in specialized kit shops, but these ll be way way overpriced and the wires are exactly the same.. here i can buy the leaden wires in the fishing shops like 20x cheaper then the same wires in hobby shops..), these are usualy in thickness of 0,1 - 0,2 - 0,3 - 0,5 - 0,7 - 1,0 mm (these i m using, you can get bigger as well).

Next i m using some wires used for fly fishing (again, super cheap compared to anything from specialized hobby shops) - you can get these in diferent colours if you want too.

I m also using some wires from old electric-engines, spools from old radios and such a stuff (usualy when you are doing the big spring house cleaning, you find something like that what you are going to throw out )

The wires i was talking about here, were from agama hobby shop http://obchod.agama-model.cz/en-kategorie_56707-0-0-5mm.html - they have the wires reasonably cheap (5m long wire for +/- 1 euro, depends on thickness) and in various thickness (0,3 0,6 and 1mm) and in various colours. I m quite sure you can find something similar like that in your country too