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martenare

SAAB 220 from simple plans to 1:72 model

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This will be my first post here at britmodeller but I have been a regular reader for quite some time.
As I am Swedish, I am currently (slowly) building up a collection of Swedish airforce models in 1:72. There are quite a few types that have never been made into a model so I started thinking about creating them myself and that leads us to this thread.

I am going to try to prove (to myself) the concept of creating the model in a 3D program and then either print it using a 3D printing service or a CNC. I will start by going down the 3D-printing route.
This thread will hence be a mix of 3D modelling and traditional building plus painting (I hope it still belongs here).


My 3D modelling skills are quite limited so I decided to look for an aircraft with simple lines. I found drawings for a project at SAAB in the 50's, called the SAAB 220 that fitted the bill. It was meant to be a delta winged, 2 engined jet trainer or business jet. The concept eventually turned into the much more conventional SAAB 105 (SK60 in the Swedish airforce) that is still in use in Sweden and Austria.

I will shortly post the plans that I will use. Details will have to be improvised and I will use the Saab 105 as a guide for many parts.

regards

Marten

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Welcome Marten!

Im not Swedish,but i have a passion with Swedish Air Force,and as you,in 1/72!

Cant wait for more progress,and any finished Swedish bird...

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Welcome Marten!

Im not Swedish,but i have a passion with Swedish Air Force,and as you,in 1/72!

Cant wait for more progress,and any finished Swedish bird...

Thanks George!

This will definitely be an experiment so I have no Idea what the result will be but I am hoping to to draw from the experience of the members here in order to help me along!

Cheers

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:welcome: aboard Marten - can't wait to see what you have planned :)

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Here are the plans that are my reference for this build. Like I said earlier not much detail but I will have to improvise and steal from the saab 105.

sideview_zps071838da.jpg

topview_zps86dce8c2.jpg

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Welcome!

I'm interested in the 3D printing so this will be nice to follow.

Även kul med fler svenskar!

/Erik

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3D printing, well thats certanly got my interest up!!

Will follow this with interest as it's something I would like to play with if I ever get back to a normal life!!

The drawing looks great, should be something really interesting when you finish it!!

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So, I have made some progress!

I have spent quite a few hours trying to learn Blender. I started with the nose cone and sent that of to shapeways to get it 3D printed as soon as I had it finished. It arrived within a week!

I have now continued with the canopy and it has proven to be a challenge. Here is a render of what I have managed to model so far:

canopyandnoserender_zps5ec0a666.png

I modeled the nose wheel bay as a part of the nose cone and let the doors be printed along with it. The wheel well doors look very oversized but I have to observe shapeways minimum thickness for printing, which is 0.7 mm. This would represent 5 cm in scale in 1/72 but at that scale I don't think they will look overly thick.

Here is the printed nose cone with my hand for size reference.

IMG_8365_zps1b543a6d.jpg

And here from a different angle with a pen for reference.

IMG_8367_zpsbd612d69.jpg

I expected it to be a lot less smooth than it is. It is possible to feel the printed layers when moving a finger nail over it but I think I should be able to make it smooth with some sanding ans mr surfacer.

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I need some suggestions!

I plan to 3D-print a master canopy and then to vacuum form it, but I have never done this before. Should I print the frames separately and try to combine these with a vacuum formed canopy or should I just form one with the frames indented?

Cheers

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I need some suggestions!

I plan to 3D-print a master canopy and then to vacuum form it, but I have never done this before. Should I print the frames separately and try to combine these with a vacuum formed canopy or should I just form one with the frames indented?

Cheers

The problem of the separate frames is that you have to glue these on the canopy and the change of getting glue on the canopy exists. It's probably easier to have the canopy printed with the frames already in. Careful though: any imperfection in the canopy affects the result of the vacformed part, you need to have a very smooth master for optimal results ! Of course you sure are aware that the master must be slightly smaller to account for the thickness of the clear plastic.

Personally I would use an alternative system: have the canopy printed without any frame and at the same time use the CAD drawing of the frames to design the shape on a single plane. The frames can then be cut from vynil or from a decal sheet using a cut plotter.

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The problem of the separate frames is that you have to glue these on the canopy and the change of getting glue on the canopy exists. It's probably easier to have the canopy printed with the frames already in. Careful though: any imperfection in the canopy affects the result of the vacformed part, you need to have a very smooth master for optimal results ! Of course you sure are aware that the master must be slightly smaller to account for the thickness of the clear plastic.

Personally I would use an alternative system: have the canopy printed without any frame and at the same time use the CAD drawing of the frames to design the shape on a single plane. The frames can then be cut from vynil or from a decal sheet using a cut plotter.

Thanks, i actually hadn't considered the fact that the master needs to be smaller.

I will probably try a few different methods to see which one works best.

Does anyone know a simple way to make a decent vacuum former that can be hooked up to the vacuum cleaner?

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Here is my progress so far with the 3d modelling. I have not sent any more parts for printing yet as there are several details left to do.

At least you can get an idea of what the aircraft would have looked like if it would have been produced by SAAB. Major external parts left are the engines and landing gear. Internally I will model a cockpit with an instrument panel and ejection seats.

fuselagewithoutengines2_zps86c27bca.png

fuselagewithoutengines_zpsc3a5972b.png

Edited by martenare

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This is incredible. Could this be the beginning of the end for the model shop? If 3D printers eventually become the norm, could we be downloading kits in the future? Who knows...

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Very interesting tech and very impressive product. Having seen a few printed pieces in real life I'd found them grainy but the technology really does seem to be moving a pace. Not so much of a threat to large scale injection moulding with runs of tens of thousands but it could provide a easier safer alternative to resin for more esoteric kits.

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Thanks, i actually hadn't considered the fact that the master needs to be smaller.

I will probably try a few different methods to see which one works best.

Does anyone know a simple way to make a decent vacuum former that can be hooked up to the vacuum cleaner?

Depends on what you mean for decent... I have a kind of former that is very simple and simply attaches to a vacuum cleaner. It is simply a box I made with some wooden bits on the 4 sides and the bottom. On one of the sides I made a hole of the size of the home's vacuum cleaner hose. This hole has silicon around to prevent air from escaping when the hose is connected. On top there's one of these:

Millefori.jpg

It's one of those boards used to build prototype electronic circuits, they can be found easily and cheap in every electronics shop. Mine is around 150 X 100mm, but there are larger and smaller types around. Of course siicon is again used to seal any corner of the box.

In my case I don't have an integrated heat source, so I use a candle to soften the plastic. The plastic is attached to a frame I made that fits perfectly on the board, heated on the candle (a large candle is better) and then laid on the board while the cleaner is running. Actually I have a number of frames designed for parts of different size... no need to use large plastic sheets when I'm making a small part.

Looking forward to seeing more of your build, it's very fascinating !

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What a pretty little airplane you've got going there :)

Does anyone know a simple way to make a decent vacuum former that can be hooked up to the vacuum cleaner?

Here's how to make your own.

Perhaps you might want to consider trying the option of printing the canopy and also printing a master and the frames separately, and see which one gets you the best look. If you "glue" the canopy into the frame with Future/Kleer, you can avoid the problem of getting glue onto the clear parts.

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This is incredible. Could this be the beginning of the end for the model shop? If 3D printers eventually become the norm, could we be downloading kits in the future? Who knows...

I've been thinking the same thing, I think it looks like it but at the same time I don't know a lot about 3D printing. What I've seen so far it looks like almost anything can be done though.

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I've been thinking the same thing, I think it looks like it but at the same time I don't know a lot about 3D printing. What I've seen so far it looks like almost anything can be done though.

It will certainly be interesting to see how the technology develops in the future. If we compare the resolution of conventional 2D printers today to their early counterparts forty years ago, the difference is phenominal. Imagine being able to pay Aires to download a pattern to 3D print a wheelbay set, or something like that.

Brilliant

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Depends on what you mean for decent... I have a kind of former that is very simple and simply attaches to a vacuum cleaner. It is simply a box I made with some wooden bits on the 4 sides and the bottom. On one of the sides I made a hole of the size of the home's vacuum cleaner hose. This hole has silicon around to prevent air from escaping when the hose is connected. On top there's one of these:

It's one of those boards used to build prototype electronic circuits, they can be found easily and cheap in every electronics shop. Mine is around 150 X 100mm, but there are larger and smaller types around. Of course siicon is again used to seal any corner of the box.

In my case I don't have an integrated heat source, so I use a candle to soften the plastic. The plastic is attached to a frame I made that fits perfectly on the board, heated on the candle (a large candle is better) and then laid on the board while the cleaner is running. Actually I have a number of frames designed for parts of different size... no need to use large plastic sheets when I'm making a small part.

Looking forward to seeing more of your build, it's very fascinating !

What a pretty little airplane you've got going there :)

Here's how to make your own.

Perhaps you might want to consider trying the option of printing the canopy and also printing a master and the frames separately, and see which one gets you the best look. If you "glue" the canopy into the frame with Future/Kleer, you can avoid the problem of getting glue onto the clear parts.

Thanks! I will have a go at making one in the near future. I just need to finish the canopy in the computer and send it of for printing.

No progress today yet but I realized that the two renders that I posted were a bit dark - here is a better one.

fuselagewithoutengines3_zps73a4c908.png

Edited by martenare

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This is freaking brilliant Marten!!!

I want to see what you can do, how it turns out, the materials, the paints, the process....go for it!!!..

I'm insprired and I think what you are attempting is amazing.

Cheers

Bruce

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This is freaking brilliant Marten!!!

I want to see what you can do, how it turns out, the materials, the paints, the process....go for it!!!..

I'm insprired and I think what you are attempting is amazing.

Cheers

Bruce

Thanks for the encouragement Bruce.

Work is taking most of my time at the moment so no progress. Will hopefully be able to get a few parts sent of for printing mid next week.

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