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rickbcolorado

Trumpeter 1:200 Missouri (Teak Deck/Pontos & Trumpeter aftermarket parts and PE)

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Colleagues:

I am starting a new WIP on the recently-released Trumpeter 1:200 BB63, Missouri. I am using the opportunity offered by the release of this model, the Pontos PE and Trumpeter aftermarket parts, to try to improve my modeling skills. I am not an expert in any sense, but I am an amateur in the best sense. I love modeling and am at a place in my day job, my income, and my blood pressure that I can relax a bit more and devote time to what has been a very long hobby.

I Live in Colorado, work in IT networking in a global association, and am just impressed as all get-out by the quality builders, the civility, and the class of the people on this list. Their patience with me (I was posting photos of my WIP in the middle of someone else's WIP...what a newbie goober I am!) is impressive--people on the 'net today don't usually tolerate any mistakes.

I have my hull built and am working out the armament builds with the Pontos PE, and i am going to Best Buy to pick up a better camera. I welcome all your feedback, and am looking forward to being corrected lots of times--I learn best that way. I will ask questions, share frustrations, and I know this will take a while....my deadline inside is a few months, but I know I would like it ready for seasonal competitions/displays in the summer of 2015.

Best regards,

Rick Bauer

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Good luck!

We both can share tips and tricks and stuff!

Now, just to tell you, between you and me, I'm really not that big of a ship builder...Mostly do Armor and Planes but it's the history of this ship that broke me down and made me buy it. Ohh well. It will become the center piece of my collection...When it's completed somewhere near 2016! SHEESH! What with Pontos set and all!

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Thanks for starting a new thread for your build, I look forward to seeing the pics.

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I look forward to watching your progress and hope that i can learn from it as i do with so many WIPs.

As far as cameras go i see very little wrong with your pics so far. I use a canon 450d with a 60mm macro lens but for a model like this i think you might have to get something which will go a little wider!!. I have read very good reports about the panasonic bridge cameras which the focal length goes from very wide to very long, cant go far wrong with a Leica lens!!.

All the best with your project.

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Getting back to the project....still in the "which subassemblies do I do first" phase of wading through all the PE?

Who gives you 16 frets of PE? Yikes, I had to number the bags because my eyesight ain't what it used to be. I put a computer with a high-res screen in my hobby room so I can zoom in on the PE diagrams that Pontos listed (thanks, Kim!) at http://pontosmodel.com/html/23002f1.html

anyway, still need a better camera (Best Buy this weekend, got a $100 gift card from my son), but here's the PE....amazing.

numberthatPE_zpsb09a3752.jpg

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Painting the hull....wanted to get this one in there....the seams were not that bad, and I was a bit unduly miffed with Trumpeter about the front piece....(why not just make the hull one solid piece, and make the box a few inches longer?), but the putty went fine. Seems a lot of other builds have a much brighter red, but I went with the Tamiya Hull Red, which was what the diagram called for....

still need to finish the grey part of the hull, but you can get of sense of things here. This is in a room right across from the hobby room....only about 6'x6', but it's all sealed off and vented, and I got the quietest compressor I could find....the perfect place to paint, mix, let things dry....nice on the dust, too....if I were as good a modeler as a technology dweeb, these would look a lot nicer, for sure.

photo9_zpsc8d370cb.jpg

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Actually, never EVER trust Trumpeter's color call out! They are always wrong. Put down a coat of Tamiya's Mica Red to lighten it up a little. It's a bit too dark.

Don't know what period you are trying to paint. But if it's after WW II (You got the teak deck right?) The it should be haze grey for the upper works, and navy blue for the hull sides. Watch it though. As by 1950, I think she completely went with Mica (hull) red bottom, black demarcation line, and Haze Grey completely on the side (no more navy blue) and superstructures. Also, the radars and antennas were also painted black at this point in time (1945, all haze grey). Check your references.!

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Actually, never EVER trust Trumpeter's color call out! They are always wrong. Put down a coat of Tamiya's Mica Red to lighten it up a little. It's a bit too dark.

Don't know what period you are trying to paint. But if it's after WW II (You got the teak deck right?) The it should be haze grey for the upper works, and navy blue for the hull sides. Watch it though. As by 1950, I think she completely went with Mica (hull) red bottom, black demarcation line, and Haze Grey completely on the side (no more navy blue) and superstructures. Also, the radars and antennas were also painted black at this point in time (1945, all haze grey). Check your references.!

I am going for 1950, haze grey on the top hull and all the works....thanks for the mica red suggestion....

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Update 12/22/2013

Went to Best Buy, got a nice little Nikon Coolpix S9500 camera...looks like it's going to be fine--especially if I break down and read the manual.

I masked and painted the grey above the waterline last night, and took off the masking...starting to look nice...

I broke down a few weeks ago and finally outfitted a painting room in my basement that I had the builders throw together. I got a new compressor that is a lot quieter, so I can paint at 5 in the am and not wake anyone. Domestic tranquility is key to modeling success, I have found (painfully).

DSCN0030_zps30f81766.jpg

I even splurged and bought (please don't laugh at how lazy I am) a little paint shaker to keep the paint (I am mainly using Tamiya acrylic) from being all gooped at the bottom. It went from being some pretentious little add-on toy to an absolutely essential tool in about 10 minutes (thanks, Hobby Town in Colorado Springs). At first I thought this was just a stupid expense, but now I find myself really appreciating how this really gets a bottle of paint completely mixed....I still get it started with a toothpick if it's been on the shelf for a while....absolutely one of my newest best friends...

DSCN0031_zps0a902285.jpg

so, here is where we are on Sunday morning....

DSCN0038_zps1fbd7ddf.jpg

the front piece came on really good...there are no lines on the finished hull....careful use of putty and sanding--good examples from other builds really helping here. Here is how she looks ... how does the picture quality seem to you guys?

DSCN0042_zps107c52c9.jpg

as I mentioned before, I decided to use three stands to give this a bit more stability. The piece of wood is just temporary, and while there it looks like it's cut in half, it's just a spare piece of something that had a cut in it already.....just one piece, for sure.

DSCN0040_zps8d2f7554.jpg

going to work simultaneously on both the deck and the PE for the back cranes (Pontos http://pontosmodel.com/manual/23002f1-page5.pdf )

question for Kim or anyone on this....do you have to prep the plastic Trumpeter deck before you put on the teak Pontos overlay? Do you have to sand the trumpeter deck for better adhesion....any need for extra glue? Going to try to find some examples of people who have done these wooden decks before.

Religious question (hey, it's Sunday)...do you prime or paint your PE before bending and putting it together? I have heard different opinions...

photo8_zps17d5c0aa.jpg

On the documentation, it looks like there are some parts of the existing Trumpeter deck that you need to cut down or remove (parts highlighted in purple), but once you look at the deck, there are no raised areas. Any help here?

We had a bit of snow yesterday in Colorado yesterday, we got all the Xmas prep work done, and spent time yesterday going to the graveyard to change the flowers on my wife's mother's grave (my father-in-law lives with us) and remember her life. What I am saying is that I have a lot of today to work on this thing...what a wonderful hobby and pastime we share.

Best,

Rick

Edited by rickbcolorado

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did some research and looked for demo's of the installation of the wooden deck on Bismark....lots of nice u-tube stuff for the rookie out there like me....

a few observation after doing the two major parts of the deck for the first time:

1) Wow....this is really easy, and I will never try to do all that crazy masking.....

2) razor blade necessary to give it a good trim before you peel

3) Put all the smaller teak pieces in a cigar box...some of them might get lost

4) Use the main gun circles to align things....gently position the deck...kind of dry fit before pulling off the tape

5) Once the tape is off--try to breathe.

6) Again, align using the gun circles and other squares off the deck....to align all the right places....and then press it down more firmly...no need for additional adhesive.

5) Clean fingers so as to not get oil on the deck.

DSCN0044_zps84726f67.jpg

this is dry fitting.....once I have all the trim off, it's time to go for it.

DSCN0046_zps0c9a61ff.jpg

everything went without any drama.....

using the end circles helps to line things up, even with the adhesive off.....wait for it before pushing it all down....

DSCN0054_zpsc2f1b5da.jpg

with the first major deck pieces on, it's starting to look pretty good. I still have not glued down the deck yet. No need to so far, and it's been easier to get the deck on.....

DSCN0058_zps973c1fed.jpg

drilling all the portholes on the next two layers of Missouri...I used the Dremel and 1/32" bit for the small portholes, and 3/32" for the larger portholes....

DSCN0050_zps5395790b.jpg

off to paint, and next to start with some of the PE. the combination of Trumpeter and Pontos is really helping me look like I know what I am doing.....

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Rick

How did you determine the correct waterline height for the model? I have tried 34' 7" as on the plans which works out to 52.5mm from the keel and it doesn't look right as it hits some of the "portholes" or "water drains" on the side of the hull. I thought those would be above the waterline.

Also how did you actually mark the waterline on the hull to lay the tape for spraying?

Thanks.

Lloyd

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Rick

How did you determine the correct waterline height for the model? I have tried 34' 7" as on the plans which works out to 52.5mm from the keel and it doesn't look right as it hits some of the "portholes" or "water drains" on the side of the hull. I thought those would be above the waterline.

Also how did you actually mark the waterline on the hull to lay the tape for spraying?

Thanks.

Lloyd

Lloyd:

the waterline was tricky for me, too...I used some photos and the trumpeter diagram for my waterline, but I found myself with portholes right at the line. I filled them in, which is probably not the right way to do it, but there you go.

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Yes I was thinking the same, fill them in and also the vertical line of little holes near the bow. I don't know what either are supposed to represent.

Thanks

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for the waterline masking, I used tamiya tape and then blue painters masking for the larger, non-border types. I have used others, and keep coming back to Tamiya...as far as keeping the line even across the entire hull, it was tricky--I kept laying it down, picking it up, laying it down. So, bottom line (no pun) is that it is a guestimated based on 1945 photos....

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Decided to attack this build on a few fronts, since there are so many sub-assemblies to work on.....but I gave in to lust and decided to to do the 16-inch guns first. they are real, and they are spectacular :evil_laugh:

a few observations about the Pontos stuff....

1) The PE is awesome...the ladders for the 16-inch turrets fold really well with the PE bending tools out there (see my pic....I can't get a better close up).

2) The resin-formed blast bags by Pontos are very nice! You have to cut a fair amount of resin off them (clamp them well--one flew off and disappeared into the carpet monster....took about three times of looking to find it had blasted all the way across the room....the way they are formed you can slide them over the barrel, having already painted them a nice dirty white...this will be nice.

3) Overall, I am discovering that so many other things in life, patience rules the day. Every time I start to go a bit faster than I should, some part flies off or some other issue pops up. This is going to have to be a patient, steady build.

here are a few pics to give you an idea....more to follow.....

Merry Christmas everyone....ironic that we are building beasts of war, when we are also celebrating Peace on Earth, good will toward men....but I always seem to have more good will when I have 12 16" rifled barrels backing my six.

Rick

pics: not a great focus, but you can see how the ladders can fold real easily on either end.

DSCN0083_zpsd3fe4087.jpg

so I just took this picture to show you all three stages of building one of the ladders. PE is not one of my strong suits, so I am trying to be really patient here, use the tools, not force it, and most of the time it's working.

you can see the ladder right after it was cut from the fret, the next one is loaded and bent, and the completed ladder is also shown. Take your time, do it right (I miss my dad).

DSCN0086_zpse73358c9.jpg

cutting and grinding down the resin on the blast bags....mounted my dremel for the cuts, and the bottom part of the blast bag cuts off well enough. Then you can buff the edges to have the bags look like they are right up onto the gun surface....very realistic.

DSCN0072_zps141d758b.jpg

slowly but surely, the turret PE comes together.

DSCN0066_zpsbdb4b29a.jpg

later!

Edited by rickbcolorado

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a bit more sanding, polishing, and finding one of the bags that flew across the room...finally found.

definitely have to dry fit these parts so you know how they will look once everything is painted. I tried to make a few divots in the bags so that they would not all look the same. The back ends of the bag have to be carefully trimmed (Dremel sanded) so that the gun barrel can completely clear them....this is one of those parts that I wish they gave you at least one extra...the top ridge of one of these was cracked right out of the bag, so I had to rebuild it.

these boys are now ready.

DSCN0087_zpseade90b2.jpg

Edited by rickbcolorado

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Liking the build. Did you have to remove any deck details before fitting the wooden decking??

the diagram seems to indicate the removal or sanding down of deck details, but I did not find any that needed to be removed, at least on the first level decks (the two main pieces) so far.....strange....

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The answer is no.

The wood deck has all the hatchs etc catered for.

All you need to do is lay it over the deck and the raised hatches etc will be eliminated.

Its very easy.

But the size of this ship is not :winkgrin:

Have fun Rick.

Cheers foxy :coolio:

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Ohh yeah, those blast bags......

Do not look at the cut off diagrams on the Pontos instructions! It would have you cut off too much...Which is what I did. The end result was I had to putty up the seams along the gun joint...Bummer......Do what Rick did. Cut off the major pieces, then test fit, test fit and test fit....Afterwards, sand it off slowly to make sure! I'm slowly finding out that I'm starting to hate Pontos instructions!

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Ohh yeah, Rick!

Forget about doing the details on semi-circles steps on the side of the turret and in front.....

Trust me! I've tried.....Was a HUGE PITA and almost made me threw the entire thing up against the wall. The details are so small you can't even get it on with an optivisor and all it does is make the details thinner...That's it......You can try if you want, but for me, for turret num. 2 and 3, I will leave those alone!

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Ohh yeah, those blast bags......

Do not look at the cut off diagrams on the Pontos instructions! It would have you cut off too much...Which is what I did. The end result was I had to putty up the seams along the gun joint...Bummer......Do what Rick did. Cut off the major pieces, then test fit, test fit and test fit....Afterwards, sand it off slowly to make sure! I'm slowly finding out that I'm starting to hate Pontos instructions!

Stryder:

I spent a lot of time on the guns today.....part of the problem is the interrelationship of the trumpeter base parts, the upgrade barrels, and the Pontos barrels. By far, the Pontos brass barrels look like they are the absolute best, but the problem is that you are asked to drill into a wide open part that will hold the barrel into the traverse rod (part P16). Pontos asks you to drill into the part, but the part is too long if you just attached it to the mounting bracket, so you would have to trim the part...and getting all three of these exactly equal is impossible. So I flipped the part, filled it full of 1) putty and then 2) gap filling CA, and then glued them together (P16 and one barrel each) I think I have something that is exactly the same length as the other barrels....way too much of a kludge to really be what we should expect. In other words, Pontos should have given us the mounting parts for the barrels as well....hard to merge them.

DSCN0093_zpsa1c98382.jpg

what really helped me trip the blast bags...dremel sanding station....

DSCN0094_zpsf44e3056.jpg

filled with putty, then after the mold dries, gap filling CA and the barrel...and now they dry.....kind of a kludge

DSCN0091_zps362c2795.jpg

working the PE is tough on the eyes...I put in a high-res monitor so I could zoom into the pics and see them more clearly. Pontos can't post a super hi-res pic because they are afraid of people stealing the photos.....sigh.

DSCN0090_zpsd364412b.jpg

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Ohh yeah, Rick!

Forget about doing the details on semi-circles steps on the side of the turret and in front.....

Trust me! I've tried.....Was a HUGE PITA and almost made me threw the entire thing up against the wall. The details are so small you can't even get it on with an optivisor and all it does is make the details thinner...That's it......You can try if you want, but for me, for turret num. 2 and 3, I will leave those alone!

so, you have a choice....no PE at all, using Trumpeter's onboard PE, or using Pontos' PE. In some cases, I have to agree with others--it may not be worth all the hassle.

Here's the original directions for using the Trumpeter PE that comes n the kit.....not too shabby.....

DSCN0098_zps3b9c28dc.jpg

Here is Pontos' diagram for the same part--a lot more, and harder, PE to lay down.

DSCN0095_zps69a84c02.jpg

Edited by rickbcolorado

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Ohh yeah, those blast bags......

Do not look at the cut off diagrams on the Pontos instructions! It would have you cut off too much...Which is what I did. The end result was I had to putty up the seams along the gun joint...Bummer......Do what Rick did. Cut off the major pieces, then test fit, test fit and test fit....Afterwards, sand it off slowly to make sure! I'm slowly finding out that I'm starting to hate Pontos instructions!

to Stryder's point on the instructions on Pontos......hard to not hold them at fault, but it's tough. We want the stuff right away. We want every single detail. At some point, my eyes fail and I simply end up spilling too much CA for it to be realistic anymore. The struggle to "get along" with Hasegawa and their PE is difficult, too.

I still think there could be some ways to reach out to the English-speaking market, explain how to build these clusters better (I still think a "Modeler's Workshop YouTube" every now and them--do one of the 16 inch guns, one of the 40mm, etc), This might help folks who have a problem going from a diagram to a full explanation.

I think also there is the challenge to "own" all of the solution to a cluster of parts (the fitting of the P-16 part, for example, that holds the 16-inch gun barrel). At some point, they are probably stepping on the intellectual property of Hasegawa.... but having to do all the cuts to existing pieces of Hasegawa's hardware is a challenge, too.

that being said, I am still terrifically impressed with all the stuff....and I am already starting to think to myself--is this model a "failure" if I don't use all the Pontos' PE in the build? I simply am not that good at CA application to end up with something good, especially on some of the trim work.

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