Vlamgat9 Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Financial Times reports Brazil has chosen the Gripen NG over the Hornet and the Rafale for its next fighter. If the india deal doesnt go through then rafale really is in trouble... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shar2 Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 That's an interesting decision. Does BAE Systems still have a stake in the Gripen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 The UK should be having these!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlamgat9 Posted December 19, 2013 Author Share Posted December 19, 2013 Here is the press release: 18 December 2013, in Press Release The Brazilian government today announced the selection of Gripen NG. The announcement today will be followed by negotiations with the Brazilian Air Force aiming at a procurement of 36 Gripen NG. The offer presented to the Brazilian Government by Saab includes Gripen NG, sub-systems for Gripen NG, an extensive technology transfer package, a financing package as well as long term bi-lateral collaboration between the Brazilian and Swedish Governments. The announcement today will be followed by negotiations with the Brazilian Air Force aiming at a procurement of 36 Gripen NG. After finalized negotiations an agreement can be reached between Saab and Brazil and an order for Gripen NG placed. ”I am extremely proud of the confidence that the Brazilian government has placed in Gripen NG. Saab regards the announcement today as a strong commitment of the Brazilian Government and we are looking forward to provide the Brazilian Air Force with the world-leading and most affordable fighter. Furthermore, this announcement is very significant for the collaboration between Brazil and Sweden. We stand prepared to start the industrial collaboration as planned, with its positive effects for Brazilian industry”, says Saab CEO Håkan Buskhe. If Brazil procures the Gripen system it will be joining the countries operating the Gripen System today: Sweden, South Africa, Hungary, Czech Republic, Thailand and the UK Empire Test Pilot School (ETPS). Switzerland has also selected Gripen as a future fighter jet. During August and September 2013 both chambers of the Swiss Parliament voted yes to the procurement of Gripen. A referendum on the procurement is expected in 2014. Saab serves the global market with world-leading products, services and solutions ranging from military defence to civil security. Saab has operations and employees on all continents and constantly develops, adopts and improves new technology to meet customers’ changing needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver66 Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 The UK should be having these!!! Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Test Graham Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 The Eurofighter project was delayed whilst the Germans took a year to decide whether they wanted a single-engined aircraft instead - effectively a twin for the Gripen. They, and the other partners, agreed that the single-engined version just wasn't up to meeting the requirements. So no, the UK shouldn't be having these, nice though they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlamgat9 Posted December 19, 2013 Author Share Posted December 19, 2013 The Eurofighter project was delayed whilst the Germans took a year to decide whether they wanted a single-engined aircraft instead - effectively a twin for the Gripen. They, and the other partners, agreed that the single-engined version just wasn't up to meeting the requirements. So no, the UK shouldn't be having these, nice though they are. Gripen would have made a great Jaguar replacement. It doesnt have to be an either/or thing with the Typhoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 (edited) If the india deal doesnt go through then rafale really is in trouble... BBC was reporting this afternoon that the UAE have opted for the Rafale over the Typhoon. Thought India had already settled on Rafale. Of the 3 (Gripen, Rafale and Typhoon), which one is in trouble? Edited December 19, 2013 by Seahawk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XV107 Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 It's not clear what UAE have opted for, and they may still go for Typhoon (the language is quite careful - note that the statement says that the order is not going ahead 'at this time'); BAE's line that they hadn't factored a sale to UAE into their forecasts is, AIUI, quite true - there was always a sense that a complicated political game (internal and external) was going on and that the Typhoon bid request might have been as a stalking horse to encourage someone else to come up with a more favourable offer. The four partners, plus Saudi, Austria and Oman are pretty respectable outcomes for Typhoon; of the three, if any one is in 'trouble', I'd still suggest that it isn't yet the Typhoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Why? Because its much cheaper than that F-35 abomination, More than capable in many roles, and among a few more reasons, ready Now!! I know it won't happen but one reason is a strange RAF /MOD policy of having a twin engine fighter instead of a single. (H&S again I suppose) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlamgat9 Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 BBC was reporting this afternoon that the UAE have opted for the Rafale over the Typhoon. Thought India had already settled on Rafale. Of the 3 (Gripen, Rafale and Typhoon), which one is in trouble? UAE havent opted for Rafale They just havent proceeded with the Typhoon order right now. Quite likely it is negotiating tactics. The Rafale india negotiations ate apparently similarly bogged down. Fact is only 122 Rafales have been built vs over 400 Typhoons, with another 170 Typhoons ordered. I would love to have seen the Fleet Air Arm operate Rafale, as it is a great plane. But in the world market place Rafale is a poor third right now, particularly given the results in Switzerland and Brazil. Gripen looks like it is having a serious second wind in its NG form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnT Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 From what I have read about negotiating contracts to sell kit to India it seems that you can believe they have signed a contract after the first aircraft is being flown by the Indian Air Force. Deals seem to be on and off more frequently than something that's on and off frequently....(its Christmas and don't want to upset the Mods but you know where that was going) Mind you I suspect India is not the only difficult place to do deals and they want the best contract they can get so can't blame them. Maybe BAE should hire Mr O'Leary to negotiate for them. At least it would be quick one way or the other!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Test Graham Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 The MoD wasn't interested in just a Jaguar replacement. It was interested in something that would replace the Jaguar, Harrier, Tornado and Sea Harrier, all in one package. Plus it had to be very stealthy. The Gripen just doesn't fit that requirement: F-35 does. Gripen is a lovely package for nations with slighter requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Neu- Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 (edited) BBC was reporting this afternoon that the UAE have opted for the Rafale over the Typhoon. Thought India had already settled on Rafale. Of the 3 (Gripen, Rafale and Typhoon), which one is in trouble? Typhoon isn't really in "trouble" per say. The partners will complete its production run, and its unlikely there will be any additional orders. Brazil isn't necessarily a disaster for Dassault at 30 aircraft, but it is a worrying trend. This is the third client now that Rafale had "won" only to lose due to higher costs. Given the lack of an actual agreement with India, the same problems may exist there. Gripen NG is a complete unknown. Its a paper plane in a lot of key respects, and their representatives have made unrealistic promises regarding performance and cost during sales pitches. Its part of the reason there is a fair bit of buyers remorse going on in Switzerland with their purchase, and why they decided not to participate in the Canadian options analysis. Its also facing significant pressure from below as the T-50 program is winning customers on a regular basis. The only way that Gripen can make a business case is to win clients that are not offered the F-35 after 2020, when Rafale and Typhoon lines are closed down. Edited December 20, 2013 by -Neu- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XV107 Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Rumour control suggests that the UAE sprang a 'Oh, and you will of course not mind if we cross out these figures and replace them with some smaller ones' surprise on BAE/Eurofighter at the 11th hour and were a bit surprised/narked when BAE/Eurofighter said 'Er. No, actually, we won't. We're off home to celebrate Christmas. 'Bye'. Certain other BM'rs may know more, of course, but equally may not be able to comment as to whether the rumour (which may be a misrepresentation of a carefully-worded off-the-record explanation to someone who has then passed on a slightly distorted version) is true... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnerboy Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 "Gripen wins in Brazil"....so glad it's not that Vettal again, not that I know much about F1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary West Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 It doesn't have to be an either/or thing with the Typhoon. 30 years ago maybe, but not today - "multi-role" pretty much means just that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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