Vampire T.11 Colour Scheme Question

[Solar]

In the 1960s (sorry I cant be more specific on the timeframe) my Grandfather was based in Singapore at Tengah with 60 Squadron RAF. He was a photographer and used to fly in the Vampire T.11 to take photos the planes in formation.

For Christmas Id like to present him with a diorama with a Vampire and T.11 side by side. I wonder if anyone can give me an idea of what colour scheme to paint the T11? Would it have had the day-glo orange scheme or the yellow bands?

I have tried to find this out but have not found any photographs from Singapore in this time period of a T11, only normal Vampires.

A photograph or information on this would be great. Im not looking for 100% accuracy so any pointers, no matter how small, would be greatly appreciated.

[Rabbit Leader]

Solar,

Perhaps the Vampire was from No.45 Squadron (the flying camels)?

The unit was based at Tengah during the fifties and sixties and to my knowledge operated at least two twin seat Vampires.

If this is the case, it would be in the typical High Speed Silver with Yellow Trainer bands, similar to the scheme presented in the Airfix kit.

If it's 1/72 scale your after then Xtradecals do a decal sheet which includes one of 45 squadrons Vampires.

Take a look at the Hannants website for more info..

Cheers and I hope this helps.. Dave

[Rabbit Leader]

Solar,

Sorry forgot to add the link?

http://www.hannants.co.uk/product/X72172

Cheers..

[Solar]

Thank you Dave that is brilliant information. I was getting quite frustrated trying to find this out. I'm glad I don't have to attempt the orange colour scheme at least!

We went to the De Havilland museum in the summer (which is a really nice place to go) and that's where I found out about his time in Singapore. http://www.dehavillandmuseum.co.uk/

[Rabbit Leader]

If there's one thing I envy about you Brits is the amount of Aircraft related museums and frequency of Airshows.. Not to mention your ability to purchase the new Airfix kits as soon as they are released (well at least we've got Mail order!).

Anyway - I hope your Christmas gift comes off and am sure it will bring a smile to your grandfathers face. Make sure you post your end results here.

Glad I could be of some help.. When I get around to building my Vampire, this is the scheme I'll be doing mine as well.

Cheers.. Dave

Edited November 17, 2013 by Rabbit Leader

[AnonymousAA72]

According to Warpaint No.27 DH Vampire, 60 Sqn's T11 was WZ556 'Y'. Dated as 12.53-11.59....no artwork I'm afraid.....

[Solar]

Hi Bill, thanks also for your comment.

I found a picture of T.11 WZ556:

This was apparently taken at West Malling in the UK in 1960. Looking at the nosecone area this photo implies that this vampire has the Orange paint scheme unless I am mistaken? Also I found this quote regarding this particular Vampire on these forums:

"No.60 Squadron retained its Vampire T 11s until late 1959, which, together with a variety of second-line duties, also took part in operational strikes; the squadron's first recorded strike with Venom aircraft being on 14 May 1956, when two Vampire T 11s, WZ556 and WZ611, flown by Flt Lts David Blucke and Bill Alcock, respectively, accompanied six squadron Venoms during an attack on cleared jungle hideout in Kulai area"

If I am out on my dates (which I probably am) it is very possible that my Grandfather flew in this exact same T.11, so my question is when this aircraft was based at Tengah in the 50's what colour scheme would it have had? Silver with yellow panels and then later painted orange when in the UK perhaps or would it have already had the orange nose/wings etc?

I feel like im getting close to a final answer now!

[AnonymousAA72]

I wouls have thought that Dayglo would have been very unlikely on a front-line squadron at this time....I would stick with yellow t-bands. That said 60 Sqn were flying Venoms at this stage, so their T11 may well have had their black/white markings either side of the roundel....

[vampiredave]

Solar:

Thank you for posting my earlier quote on the forum regarding the use of Vampire trainers on operational strikes in Malaya.

I have found a less-than-perfect, (ie. poor) photograph of a 60 Squadron Vampire trainer (WZ611) at Tengah in December 1953. Being a 'computer dinosaur' I am unable to put the photograph up but if you send me a pm I will forward it to you?

DW

[Solar]

Thanks Bill.

I think what I am going to do is use the yellow bands and also add the squadron markings on the side because even if they are not 100% accurate they will be a personal touch for him.

My final question is that Iv read that the big number on the nose was only used on the dayglo scheme, not with the yellow bands*. For example on the photo of WZ556 from 1960 it has the large number, but it also has the dayglo scheme, so both could have been added when it returned to the UK...

Can you shed any light on this, or make a judgement call? Yay or nay for the large nose number? No pressure!

(If Grandad tells me its wrong I could always add it back in later...)

[Solar]

Thanks Dave, PM sent, my paintbrushes are being prepared for action as we speak.

[AnonymousAA72]

Thanks Bill.

I think what I am going to do is use the yellow bands and also add the squadron markings on the side because even if they are not 100% accurate they will be a personal touch for him.

My final question is that Iv read that the big number on the nose was only used on the dayglo scheme, not with the yellow bands*. For example on the photo of WZ556 from 1960 it has the large number, but it also has the dayglo scheme, so both could have been added when it returned to the UK...

Can you shed any light on this, or make a judgement call? Yay or nay for the large nose number? No pressure!

(If Grandad tells me its wrong I could always add it back in later...)

Artwork of 45 Sqns XH539/'X' RAF Butterworth, Malaya 1956 has the 'X' on the rudder. Squadron markings are used as are the yellow T-Bands

Nothing else on the nose apart from the seat warning triangles. I'd speculate that most front line units were similar.

Dayglo and large nose numerals only appear on 2nd line units....

Here's artwork from one of their FB9's...note badge on rudder..black boom markings and code in front of the intake....

Edited November 18, 2013 by Bill Clark

[teaselstudio]

Solar - very late in replying, I know, but stumbled across this thread while doing some surfing. There was a black and white photo of WZ611 in 60 sqn markings being advertised on ebay recently.This may be the same photo mentioned above? It clearly shows it in silver (painted aluminium) overall scheme with yellow trainer bands, 60 squadron's flashes of black rectangles with white outlines and lightning bolts (in a different style to those shown in the proflie above) and, it appears, black rudders. There does not appear to be a nose number. Hope that is of interest.